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Author Topic:   Minimum power for 1976 Outrage 21

lucky13 posted 04-20-2014 06:38 PM ET (US)
I think after a couple summers worth of work I'll finally get my 1976 Outrage 21 in the water this year. It still has its original Johnson 200 that seems to run great. I plan to take it out with this motor to see what it will do, but there is no way I'll be able to afford the gasoline to use all the time. I know originally it was rated for a mininum of 65-HP. I have a 75-HP OMC V4 that I'm thinking of using. I don't care about going crazy fast, just having enough power to be safe. Has anyone tried something this size? I've seen some with newer 90-HP engines on them with good results. I'd be happy if it would plane. The hull is light.
Thanks--Randy
Teak Oil posted 04-21-2014 07:42 AM ET (US)
That OMC must be pretty old to only be a 75.
You want to have enough reserve power to get up on plane in heavy seas or with a heavy load. Also, using a motor that can barely get on plane uses more gas, not less.
A V4 from the 80s, like a 115, would be adequate and use the same amount of gas as that old smoker and probably be more reliable
lucky13 posted 04-21-2014 09:16 AM ET (US)
That's pretty much what I figured. After posting I saw the chart someone put up in the power and performance section and according to that, I "should" be able to get 30mph if everything is right. That would seem to me that the 75 would at the very least be enough. The boat will only be used in Lake Erie on nice days. Trust me,I know those nice days on Lake Erie can turn not nice in a hurry.
I guess the more important question is, at what speed will
a banana outrage 21 with a light load get on plane? I know there are many variables.
Thanks for your reply

kmev posted 04-21-2014 01:15 PM ET (US)
The 21 gets on plane quickly and does not require much speed at all. The disadvantage is that the hull also pounds rather quickly. It you are running into a head sea of short choppy waves, plan on speeds of about 10-15 mph unless you like shaking the screws loose.
That's my experience on Lake Michigan, but I hate pounding and run slow.
jcdawg83 posted 04-21-2014 03:05 PM ET (US)
Only my opinion but I would not want less than a 115 on a 21 foot boat. 2 people, a cooler full of ice and drinks, and a reasonably full fuel load and the weight starts to add up.
I agree about the fuel usage with the 200 on it now. Those early 200 hp OMC engines would almost collapse the tank they sucked fuel so fast. I would think you can find a nice 15 yr old Yamaha 115 fairly reasonably priced. They are/were reliable, strong running engines. I saw quite a few pairs of them on 20-25 foot center consoles back in the 90s.
lucky13 posted 04-21-2014 03:47 PM ET (US)
Ideally and eventually I will get a 115-140 of any brand as long it runs good. Not in the budget now and the 75 is just sitting there. I think if I can getting it running REAL good I will give it a try just for the sake of seeing how an older,lower HP engine will do. These motors are pretty easy to come by and inexpensive. I will see just how much I think it will need to get going and go from there.
According to factory ratings it should work...we'll see.
Thanks for the input and if I do get it going I'll get a video.
Randy
Teak Oil posted 04-21-2014 08:38 PM ET (US)
The Yamaha 115 was a good motor because it was a nearly exact copy of the OMC 115 lol
contender posted 04-21-2014 08:46 PM ET (US)
I would go with a small 6 cylinder, engine of your choice, the worse thing to do is under power a boat
Lionheart posted 04-22-2014 07:53 AM ET (US)
On mine, I have a 1977 150 HP Mercury. For my casual day tripping, way too much power on this boat. Lately, I have been snooping around for something newer and smaller.
adlert posted 04-22-2014 08:16 AM ET (US)
Lucky13, the really old V4 75 HP engine can certainly run very well when in proper tune and as you mentioned, they are plentiful and dirt cheap (often free even). They can be real fun to use as well.
I think however, you will be impressed with how much fuel a V4 from the 60's can use. It's significant. Every time I have used one it sure impressed me, and I still use a lot of OMC engines from the 70's and 80's.
Tom W Clark posted 04-22-2014 10:44 AM ET (US)
The Outrage 21 performs very well with little horsepower. I cannot imagine any need for more than 115 HP.
The problem with an old OMC V-4 &% is that is doe snot have a modern gearcase nor use a modern through-hub propeller, so getting those 75 horses to the water will not be very efficient.
A better choice of motor would be the venerable old three cylinder OMC 70 HP motor which does use a modern 4.25 gearcase and can be fitted with any number of props that will work well on this boat. It also has a low 2.42:1 gear ratio which is comparable to what virtually all outboard manufacturers have now realized is very beneficial. OMC figured out back in the 1970s.
Here's an Outrage 21 with a 90 that performs very well, even loaded with passengers and gear:
http://home.comcast.net/~tomwclark/21Outrage_III_ETEC90.jpg
lucky13 posted 04-22-2014 01:10 PM ET (US)
Thanks Tom, That is a nice boat and I have looked at that picture many times. The 3 cyl. models are a great idea that I had not thought of.
My original question is would the v4 75 be enough to power the boat? I think it would. Is it the best way? of course not. There are many more modern ways to go lower HP but my goal is(as always)to be as cheap as possible. The 75 will burn more fuel than any modern 75 or probably even a 115 but one of those engines will cost me thousands. That's a lot of money to put towards fuel,or a decent tow vehicle. Running a 1991 AWD ford Aerostar,told you I was cheap : ) That same basic engine was around when Whaler was rating these boats for HP so I don't think it would be underpowered according to Manufacturers specs.

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Author	Topic: Minimum power for 1976 Outrage 21
lucky13	posted 04-20-2014 06:38 PM ET (US) I think after a couple summers worth of work I'll finally get my 1976 Outrage 21 in the water this year. It still has its original Johnson 200 that seems to run great. I plan to take it out with this motor to see what it will do, but there is no way I'll be able to afford the gasoline to use all the time. I know originally it was rated for a mininum of 65-HP. I have a 75-HP OMC V4 that I'm thinking of using. I don't care about going crazy fast, just having enough power to be safe. Has anyone tried something this size? I've seen some with newer 90-HP engines on them with good results. I'd be happy if it would plane. The hull is light. Thanks--Randy
Teak Oil	posted 04-21-2014 07:42 AM ET (US) That OMC must be pretty old to only be a 75. You want to have enough reserve power to get up on plane in heavy seas or with a heavy load. Also, using a motor that can barely get on plane uses more gas, not less. A V4 from the 80s, like a 115, would be adequate and use the same amount of gas as that old smoker and probably be more reliable
lucky13	posted 04-21-2014 09:16 AM ET (US) That's pretty much what I figured. After posting I saw the chart someone put up in the power and performance section and according to that, I "should" be able to get 30mph if everything is right. That would seem to me that the 75 would at the very least be enough. The boat will only be used in Lake Erie on nice days. Trust me,I know those nice days on Lake Erie can turn not nice in a hurry. I guess the more important question is, at what speed will a banana outrage 21 with a light load get on plane? I know there are many variables. Thanks for your reply
kmev	posted 04-21-2014 01:15 PM ET (US) The 21 gets on plane quickly and does not require much speed at all. The disadvantage is that the hull also pounds rather quickly. It you are running into a head sea of short choppy waves, plan on speeds of about 10-15 mph unless you like shaking the screws loose. That's my experience on Lake Michigan, but I hate pounding and run slow.
jcdawg83	posted 04-21-2014 03:05 PM ET (US) Only my opinion but I would not want less than a 115 on a 21 foot boat. 2 people, a cooler full of ice and drinks, and a reasonably full fuel load and the weight starts to add up. I agree about the fuel usage with the 200 on it now. Those early 200 hp OMC engines would almost collapse the tank they sucked fuel so fast. I would think you can find a nice 15 yr old Yamaha 115 fairly reasonably priced. They are/were reliable, strong running engines. I saw quite a few pairs of them on 20-25 foot center consoles back in the 90s.
lucky13	posted 04-21-2014 03:47 PM ET (US) Ideally and eventually I will get a 115-140 of any brand as long it runs good. Not in the budget now and the 75 is just sitting there. I think if I can getting it running REAL good I will give it a try just for the sake of seeing how an older,lower HP engine will do. These motors are pretty easy to come by and inexpensive. I will see just how much I think it will need to get going and go from there. According to factory ratings it should work...we'll see. Thanks for the input and if I do get it going I'll get a video. Randy
Teak Oil	posted 04-21-2014 08:38 PM ET (US) The Yamaha 115 was a good motor because it was a nearly exact copy of the OMC 115 lol
contender	posted 04-21-2014 08:46 PM ET (US) I would go with a small 6 cylinder, engine of your choice, the worse thing to do is under power a boat
Lionheart	posted 04-22-2014 07:53 AM ET (US) On mine, I have a 1977 150 HP Mercury. For my casual day tripping, way too much power on this boat. Lately, I have been snooping around for something newer and smaller.
adlert	posted 04-22-2014 08:16 AM ET (US) Lucky13, the really old V4 75 HP engine can certainly run very well when in proper tune and as you mentioned, they are plentiful and dirt cheap (often free even). They can be real fun to use as well. I think however, you will be impressed with how much fuel a V4 from the 60's can use. It's significant. Every time I have used one it sure impressed me, and I still use a lot of OMC engines from the 70's and 80's.
Tom W Clark	posted 04-22-2014 10:44 AM ET (US) The Outrage 21 performs very well with little horsepower. I cannot imagine any need for more than 115 HP. The problem with an old OMC V-4 &% is that is doe snot have a modern gearcase nor use a modern through-hub propeller, so getting those 75 horses to the water will not be very efficient. A better choice of motor would be the venerable old three cylinder OMC 70 HP motor which does use a modern 4.25 gearcase and can be fitted with any number of props that will work well on this boat. It also has a low 2.42:1 gear ratio which is comparable to what virtually all outboard manufacturers have now realized is very beneficial. OMC figured out back in the 1970s. Here's an Outrage 21 with a 90 that performs very well, even loaded with passengers and gear: http://home.comcast.net/~tomwclark/21Outrage_III_ETEC90.jpg
lucky13	posted 04-22-2014 01:10 PM ET (US) Thanks Tom, That is a nice boat and I have looked at that picture many times. The 3 cyl. models are a great idea that I had not thought of. My original question is would the v4 75 be enough to power the boat? I think it would. Is it the best way? of course not. There are many more modern ways to go lower HP but my goal is(as always)to be as cheap as possible. The 75 will burn more fuel than any modern 75 or probably even a 115 but one of those engines will cost me thousands. That's a lot of money to put towards fuel,or a decent tow vehicle. Running a 1991 AWD ford Aerostar,told you I was cheap : ) That same basic engine was around when Whaler was rating these boats for HP so I don't think it would be underpowered according to Manufacturers specs.