ContinuousWave
Whaler
Moderated Discussion Areas
ContinuousWave: The Whaler GAM or General Area
Whaler 25 Walkaround
search | FAQ |
profile | register | author help
|
|
ContinuousWave Whaler Moderated Discussion Areas
ContinuousWave: The Whaler GAM or General Area
Whaler 25 Walkaround
|
| Author | Topic: Whaler 25 Walkaround |
| nickdemco |
posted 11-03-2014 11:10 PM ET (US)  
I currently own an OUTRAGE 18. I am looking to move up to something [I] can over-night in. An enclosed head is a must for girls in the family. I love a huge deck for fishing. I found [a Boston Whaler WHALER 25 WALKAROUND boat] for sale with twin 2006 E-TEC 200 H.O. engines with 300-hour. The boat is listed for [$60,000], which seems expensive. [Asks readers to reply with their] thoughts. |
| andygere |
posted 11-03-2014 11:59 PM ET (US)
Rare boat, built like a tank and one of Whaler's finest in my opinion. 200 H.O. E-TEC engines are great power for this boat, and really terrific engines: quiet, fuel efficient, and powerful. I can't comment on the price without knowing the condition of the boat, trailer, canvas, etc. |
| saumon |
posted 11-04-2014 12:42 AM ET (US)
Here's another one in the same league: a 27 Offshore with twin E-Tec 250's for a bit less than $60k... http://seattle.craigslist.org/oly/boa/4729055715.html |
| djahncke |
posted 11-04-2014 08:23 AM ET (US)
Nick, It is a great boat! My wife and I bought one last summer with twin yamaha 200's. We re-powered it this summer with twin etec 250's and we love it. It is a very large boat so unlike our other whalers we do not tow it anywhere. We keep at a marina with rack storage so it doesn't spend all the time in the water. It is also a much more complex boat to maintain than your 18. With both AC & DC electrical systems, water pressure systems, holding tanks etc. Personally I find it rather fun but it takes more thought and planning than your typical whaler. Let me know if you have a specific questions. -Don |
| nickdemco |
posted 11-04-2014 02:54 PM ET (US)
Thanks for the replies guys, much appreciated. [Asked another participant for their email adress. Please note that any participant can be reached by email by clicking on the envelope ICON in their posting or on the envelope with face ICON. If a participant wants to share their email publicly the email will be shown in those links--jimh] |
| martyn1075 |
posted 11-04-2014 03:55 PM ET (US)
Hey Nick, I am hoping Jeff will chime in on the pricing department. He is up to date in pricing on Whaler models and what the current market holds for asking prices, as well what they really sell for. This model however is a bit more tricky to accurately answer over other models imo. Very few were made its a very complex boat which needs all of twin V6 to power. There was an incredible amount of thought into the design of this vessel that is impossible to describe in a few words. Words would not give it justice and the sad part is not many would know the difference when it comes to purchasing this boat over others in its class and to be honest other 25 foot Whalers. In result it makes it a hard to price but even harder to sell as its a model that goes quite a bit unappreciated. The base price of an a average but not brand new glowing reflection condition with no updates is around the 18-24K. However don't be fooled by this value because depending on how big you go that number can tipple in price. By the time one is done with all systems replaced upgraded and enhanced the value on paper could easily be 80-90K or more. How are you going to sell that boat and more importantly how is one going to come up with a price for that unique boat. Could you sell it for 60? sounds like a bargain right especially if someone has put in about 90K but realistically its a 1990 era Boston Whaler and market My personal belief is anyone can ask what they want but realistically you need a partner to play ball with. The boat can have twice as much into it but its still only worth what someone will pay. After about 2008 most boats really have been very hard to sell unless they are market value. If the boat is mint which is rare then it will fit into the top of the market book value. In this rare position of a mint boat you can add a little more to that value. However not too much most people will just ignore it and wait for something else. As Don said its a big boat and although the title indicates a 25 its more like 30 feet. In fact engine to bow extensions it measures 33.8. Overall its more comparable to a 28 Conquest minus the flashy modern interior and comfort but the systems in place are comparable. |
| jimh |
posted 11-04-2014 04:47 PM ET (US)
An appreciation of the size of the WHALER 25 WALKAROUND compared to a REVENGE 25 can be seen in this image: http://continuouswave.com/whaler/images/LittleCurrent2014/ LUCKYTWO_WHITEWATER.jpg Both boats are called "25" footers by Boston Whaler. |
| jimh |
posted 11-04-2014 04:56 PM ET (US)
A modern V6 outboard engine in the 200-HP to 250-HP range will cost about $15,000, and for a pair of those engine, with rigging, wiring harnesses, gauges, remote controls, and so on, the cost could easily be more than $30,000. This substantial cost to re-power is probably holding down the asking price of many older larger boats that need twin engine power. For an older boat that has recently been re-powered with modern engines, the seller may have trouble recovering his investment cost for modern engines. I have looked long at a number of larger Boston Whaler boats that have been attractively priced but would need a re-power with twin V6 modern engines, and then come to the realization that my investment would be in the range of $50,000 to $70,000 when finally done. On that basis I do not think that an asking price for a very large classic Boston Whaler like a WHALER 25 WALKAROUND with modern engine in the range of $60,000 is out of line. As we all know, condition is very important in setting a price, and a rare boat, in great condition, with modern engines is not going to be found for rock-bottom prices. |
| WhalerTherapy |
posted 11-04-2014 07:51 PM ET (US)
Nick--I believe that used to be my boat, I did the re=power on it. I bought the boat for $20,000 in Florida and immediately re-powered for around $28,000. Personally, I think $60,000 is quite high but it is a very nice boat. It was unpainted when I got it. |
| nickdemco |
posted 11-05-2014 12:29 AM ET (US)
Thanks for all the replies. Whalertherapy - [Did your boat have any problems] before you sold it? Did you have the hardtop installed? I think this may be your old boat. Was the survey done in Newton, Massachusetts? Can I find a diagram of this boat's construction online? I would love to see where the scuppers drain. I believe [the scuppers drain] somewhere between the transom and pod. Where does the wiring run? Is [the Boston Whaler WHALER 25 WALKAROUND] constructed with stringers? Would need to get these checked for rot?. My boating friends I have shown it to have scared me a bit saying I need to [weigh the boat] in case the foam is waterlogged. Is this a serious concern with these boats? |
| jimh |
posted 11-05-2014 06:41 AM ET (US)
Nick says:
quote: What is a "pod"? |
| jimh |
posted 11-05-2014 06:45 AM ET (US)
Nick says:
quote: Ask your friends exactly how much the boat should weight, and how much deviation from that weight should be considered to be due to having water retained in the foam in the double bottom. I doubt they can answer those questions with any sort of precision. |
| martyn1075 |
posted 11-05-2014 01:32 PM ET (US)
The larger then normal thru hull drains are installed to remove water from the stern bilge area. This is not a small little bilge that you can only fit a hand into. Basically could fit a small human in there so it can if under stress or a bad sump pump could hold a tremendous amount of weight in water looking for a place to go. It will not sink the boat and yes it does drain above and between the "Whaler Drive" and the hull of the boat. With max weight on the transom they are designed to be out of the water completely. The deck is unique in design as it is not glassed into the side walls. The deck actually has its own elevated structure and when standing water enters the deck water will sway to either side of the boat into a recessed channel and out the back. Very nice design really reminded me of an extreme offshore style system to remove water. The boat also has (4) fish boxes. On each side the two drain out together with the natural pitch of the boat design. Never a need for a bilge pump unless you want them to always be bone dry. One flaw imo was if you left one of the fish box plugs out constant water would then enter into the box and then out into the bilge. This is a bit annoying as the pump constantly comes on to drain the bilge. If the pump dies yes these larger thru hulls drains will take over but trust me thats not what you want especially in salt water use. Boston Whaler keeps a fair amount of electrical systems including fuel lines cables etc back there and salt water is just not idea situation for these components. Martyn |
| Jeff |
posted 11-05-2014 01:52 PM ET (US)
Your friends sound like they do not fully understand Whalers....especially the large ones. There are no stringers for you to worry about rotting. Also weighing the hull is an absolutely fruitless venture for a Whaler of this size..even for smaller ones for that matter. Whaler openly admits the stated weights are a best guess average. Any boat rolling off the line had a variation from that number. Some might have been a little under and others might have been heavier. Maybe even a lot heavier depending who was laying it up, or other factors. And the larger the boat, the greater that number could vary from the stated weight. So how could you know what it's true and exact dry weight target should be? Then add on gear, fuel, motors, batteries, rigging, electronics, etc., etc., etc......you are just wild-ass guessing at a target at that point. I would bet a sizable sum of money that there is not a classic Whaler out there that has been used as someone's boat that does not have some sort of elevated moisture somewhere in the foam. Some have more, and others, less. Should you worry about it? No. Not if you float the hull and it seems to float well in the water. If you float it and the water line seems too high, or it floats with a heavy list to one side, then I would investigate further into what was causing it before labeling a hull truly waterlogged. On to the asking price, $60,000 for a 25 Walkaround with twin E-Tec's is not out of the question if those motors were newer and had full warranties with a few years left on the warranties. But let's be honest those motors are now 8 years old and have no warranties left. At that point, I personally put much less value to them. Yes, the fuel injected motors are nice and would turn that boat into a great long distance cruiser so there is value to them just not "like new" value. I think the asking price is too high....here is why... Most of the nice 25 Walkarounds that come up for sale with the original power (but well maintained and in great working order) are in the high 20's to mid 30's for asking prices. The price can vary depending on electronics and other options / trailer. For a comp, this 25 is listed at $34,900. We talked to the broker 4 years ago before we bought our 23 Walkaround. He was not willing to take offers so we moved on. The boat is clean and well cared for, but if it has been for sale for over 48 months, I would say mid 30's is the top of the market for asking prices for this model. Realistic selling prices are in the mid /upper 20's and topping out at 30. There was a real nice freshwater 25 Walkaround in northern Ohio that sold 3-4 years ago to Whalerdoc here on CW. The boat was an easy 8 out of 10, 100% freshwater use with nice early 90's fuel injected yamahas, decent electronics and a nice trailer. The boat sold for the mid 20's and he then had it shipped from Ohio to Anchorage Alaska. Here is Don's (djahncke) boat when the Dougherty's we're selling it. You can see the boat is in great condition with original power. And the asking price was $25,000. The problem you are facing in your search for a new larger Whaler, is your location. The West Coast always bring premiums for Whalers and the PNW brings the highest. You might be better to find a boat elsewhere in the US and ship it to you. But with this asking price of $60,000, I still think they are $15,000 to maybe even $20,000 above what a realistic selling price could be. None the less you should go look at the boat in person. This will help you get a good understanding if this is a good layout for you and also really put into perspective how big the boat is. Given your location, I would look at this 27 Whaler too. When it's all said and done, this 27 is about the same overall size as the 25 Walkaround with a larger cabin. It will also help you get a full understand of the different large whaler models. If you do not need a cabin the size of a SoHo New York Studio Apartment, and want something you could trailer, you should look at the 23 Walkarounds as well. We have a 23 Walkaround Whaler Drive and really love the boat. This model handles big water very well, provides a cabin large enough for cruising and sleeping two easily, has a head, freshwater sink, has an good open deck and is earlier trailed with a half ton truck. We salmon fish ours and it is great for 3-4 guys. This one in Florida is a great looking boat that seems well cared for. It has twin 200 E-Tecs with 140 hours and I think still might have warranties. Asking price is $33,900. You could likely have it shipped to you (Seattle) for about $3,500 - $4,500 at most. Hope this helps, and good luck in your search. |
| nickdemco |
posted 11-05-2014 02:26 PM ET (US)
Hi guys thanks again for your input. jimh- by "pod" I meant the whaler drive engine bracket. I went and looked at the boat last weekend, overall looked pretty good. Got up on plane easily and topped out at 45mph. I was already fantasizing about the modifications I would make and getting to fish and cruise on this larger boat. Martyn - I noticed this recessed channel along the sides of the back deck - looked nice. This of course runs top the back to 2 scuppers? These were blocked ny some gear and didn't get a chance to check them, I will for sure next time. These scuppers run right through the transom and then are located below the whaler drive I assume?? Jeff thank you for the reassurance on the solid construction - I plan to keep the boat in the water year-round so was worried about this waterlogged foam issue I had heard mentioned. The etecs are 2006 but the gauges seem to be original - is this am issue? No gauge stating the hours - would I have to just take his word on these being 350hrs each? Wiring behing the dash looked very clean from previous owner.. How can I post the pictures I took? |
| martyn1075 |
posted 11-05-2014 03:10 PM ET (US)
When my 25 walk around was surveyed just before I sold last spring the surveyor was shocked he could not find any form a of moisture anywhere. He had many positive and complimentary things to share with me which was great. he said it was out of line rare not to find moisture or gelcoat problems. The gelcoat was shown as new, Before I sold I had low ball quotes for mid 20's to mid 30's. To be fair the boat was as clean as you will ever find and all systems were replaced with very high end standard. Dry hull and everything worked as it should. I asked more and I got it but it wasn't easy sell. What I received was a absolute shocker to the total cost only 7 years prior to the sell. My intentions were to keep it for a very long time it was dream boat t does everything but the lifestyle was to extreme for my position and I had to make a call that made sense long term for my families needs. I wold strongly recommend the model if your budget can allow it. However as I mentioned beware of the extra cost if you decide to find one ship it only to really not be happy unless you put in thousands of dollars to bring it back. To give you a quick idea: Engines new 20k or more each= 40K plus extra rigging-- if used different market completely. If you buy one for mid 20's with old power just remember the above calculation. The difference between a good one and a bad one is not that much when considering fitting the above equation into the picture, because market value rules the boat sells now. Based on worst to best it shouldn't be more than 45K which is sad for the really good ones because they really are worth more but thats it these days. 60K can buy you one hell of a nice boat these days with far less age on it and that really is the big problem we find when selling a niche high quality older classic Whaler. |
| Buoy |
posted 11-06-2014 01:01 PM ET (US)
Not sure if the 2005 235 Conquest interests you. If this one is legit, it's an absolute steal. |
| jimh |
posted 11-06-2014 01:20 PM ET (US)
To learn about the engine hours of an E-TEC and a great deal more, just get the engines to send you a history report. See: http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/ETEC_EngineHistoryReport.html I am guilty of bad arithmetic re the value of a 2006 E-TEC. It is rather stunning to think they could be nine-year-old engines. Tempus fugit I have not made a study nearly as scientific and comprehensive as Jeff's re the market value of a Whaler 25 Walkaround, and I defer to his judgement. Nick explains:
quote: I think everyone understands the term "Whaler Drive" and you should use that term in preference to "pod" when referring to the Whaler Drive. |
| nickdemco |
posted 11-06-2014 04:51 PM ET (US)
Hi Jeff - thanks for the great response.. quick question, if the boat doesn't have any stringers what gives it structural integrity? |
| Jeff |
posted 11-06-2014 05:19 PM ET (US)
The hull does not have conventional stringers but has longitudinal structures designing into the hull form around the center fuel tank area that give the same type of support. They are all composite and foam so there is nothing that will rot. |
| nickdemco |
posted 11-13-2014 07:36 PM ET (US)
thoughts on something like this in comparison? way cheaper with newish Honda power?? http://www.boattrader.com/listing/1988-Boston-Whaler-27--Full-Cabin-102125582 |
| nickdemco |
posted 11-14-2014 12:57 AM ET (US)
or this one? looks very nice as well - would need to see how many hours are on the engines of course and could use new electronics. He states 17GPH at 3900RPM - would this be for both engines? so $51/hr to cruise at current prices? Thoughts on this boat?? 20k cheaper than the 25 WA I found and close enough for me to cruise home, no trailer needed.. http://www.boattrader.com/listing/1989-Boston-Whaler-FC-636149 |
| nickdemco |
posted 11-14-2014 12:59 AM ET (US)
sorry I realize now that jeff already posted that 27 whaler full cabin near me.. thoughts on this model? seriously considering driving down to check it out.. |
| Peter |
posted 11-14-2014 07:38 AM ET (US)
I had a Whaler 27 Whaler Drive (not a Full Cabin model). It was a great boat. The cockpit is huge. The ride is very stable and dry. I think the Whaler 27 Full Cabin with the Honda 225s represents a better value than the one with the Optimax 225s. However, given that the Hondas are 12 years old, I would have them carefully checked for corrosion. Hondas have some problem areas for corrosion with the drive shaft bushing in the leg. |
| martyn1075 |
posted 11-14-2014 10:58 AM ET (US)
17 gph would be for both engines combined. I know it doesn't sound great but realistically for a big fishing cruiser like that its about as good as it gets. I don't think it's quite $50 per hour. As you know I had 2007 Optimax and achieved really good mileage even compared to the latest and greatest engines on the market. The Optimax get a bad rap with the compressor otherwise they are a good running efficent engine. Over all the 27 from Seattle is a far better dal than 60k 25 wlkaround IMO. Like I said before 60k can land you a very nice boat and much newer model as well if you look around. Both used Boston Whaler Conquest and equal size Grady White models around the same years are available for similar prices. |
| Jeff |
posted 11-14-2014 10:42 PM ET (US)
The 27 with the Honda engines is in New Jersey and does not show the same pride in ownership as the one in Seattle. You would spend big money to move that 27 from the east coast to the west because the 27 will require Wide Load permits likely in every state it would pass through. Then, once you got it to the PNW, you could spend another $5,000 in a hurry to make the boat right. That one in Seattle is a nice boat. Tom W Clark has looked at it in person if I remember correctly and had good things to say about it. I believe the owner is on here, or is at least a lurker. |
| |
Powered by: Ultimate Bulletin Board, Freeware Version 2000
Purchase our Licensed Version- which adds many more features!
© Infopop Corporation (formerly Madrona Park, Inc.), 1998 - 2000.