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Author Topic:   Structural Wood Lay-up 18ft. Outrage

hauptjm posted 04-25-2000 02:31 PM ET (US)
The addition of the structural wood lay-up in this site is great. Does anyone know where one can be found for the bigger boats? I have an '85 18ft. Outrage. It seems I've got 2 very small "soft" spots in the deck in the exact same place. Both are located roughly 3 feet forward of the transom right at the outside edge of the deck liner for about 3 inches into the boat. I'd like to see if there is a stringer at this point that could be the culprit; possibly allowing water to "weep" into the exact same spot on both sides. Anyone knowing where I could locate a diagram or share their experience with this situation, would greatly appreciated.
p.s. Spent 3 days a while back running my Whaler in 5-6 foot seas in Lake Pontchartrain here in New Orleans with 25 knots of steady breeze working a racing clinic (sailing); blew the doors off of everthing around. Much bigger Mako's were not able to keep up. My '85 got a lot of attention at the dock. What a great boat.
lhg posted 04-25-2000 03:57 PM ET (US)
I have the wood locating diagram for the 18 Outrage. I don't think there is any wood in the places you describe, but send me an email with your address, and I'll send you a copy.
David Reid posted 04-26-2000 10:17 PM ET (US)
Agree with you on the O/R 18'. I picked my '86 model up in N.O. last September, repowered with a new OMC 150 and flat love it. Important that Mamma likes it, too. I'm about finished with a complete restoration and live over in Lafayette, so drop me an e-mail about anything. I can fax the wood diagram if you still need it.
Russ posted 04-27-2000 12:19 AM ET (US)
James, I hope you post your findings about the soft spots, and the repairs, of your 18' Outrage. I have an 18 footer too, and it has soft spots in the same places yours does. A fiberglass repairman told me not to worry about. But, of course, I do. Russ
tbirdsey posted 04-29-2000 09:11 PM ET (US)
James, While getting my 84 Outrage ready for the spring today, I found I also have a soft spot in the same place on the stern side only. Larry's right - no wood there according to the diagram. Guess I'll just keep an eye on it.
lhg posted 05-12-2000 09:22 PM ET (US)
The soft spots in the floor sounds like minor glass delamination from the foam. This could be from sitting on an improper trailer at some point in the boat's life, or an improper dry storage rack situation (a big problem today, since none of these that I have seen support a boat at the keel) unknown to a current owner when the boat is bought used.
In the early eighties, I have seen many Whalers set up on the Easy Roller cradle roller type of trailer by incompetent dealers. I had a friend with a brand new Montauk on such a trailer, furnished by the Whaler dealer! These trailers can ruin a Whaler hull in a short time, and are not much used anymore. But they were all the rage in the mid eighties. Bearing pressure on the outside hull, away from the keel, can "pop" the interior foam bond as well as the exterior bond.
The other not widely known fact is that for some (unknown to me, but possibly foam or resins being used) manufacturing reason, and inspite of Whaler's already proven track record, about 100 of the first 18 Outrage hulls proved to be defective, with glass/foam delamination showing up after a couple of years. The boat was a mid 1983 year introduction to the public, but evidently a few earlier test models found their way into the market beginning in late 1981. The 83's and early 84's had this problem, mainly noticeable by considerably wavy hull sides which were "popping" loose intermittenly. Almost all of these owners got brand new hulls in the period of 1985-1990, under the 10 yr warranty, but it's possible that some of these early ones may still be out there, and may have not shown the extreme problems. I understand they had to replace about 75 of them at no charge. All of this information was from a dealer, who replaced several of these hulls at his shop. (the interior items were not replaced, but simply transfered by the dealer to the new bare hull). I ran into a guy in FL, a real "sharpie", who knew about the problem, and located and purchased a badly beat up & weathered 1983 boat in 1990, with major signs of hull delamination (I saw the boat myself), at a used boat junk yard, and bought it for $1000 complete with trailer, without engine. Since Whaler's warranty is transferrable to any subsequent owner, he took it right over to a Dealer and demanded a new hull, which he reluctantly got, since they figured out what he had pulled off. It was quite a sight seeing the Dealer put the old weathered console and seat into the new boat! But the boat looked beautiful and he was the happiest guy around.
Said he couldn't believe the company was willing to do this for him! I'll bet he's still a whaler owner.
Tom Byrum posted 05-13-2000 08:56 PM ET (US)
Just checked my 18'. Solid as a rock. Maybe cause my boat spent it's first 11 years in the water and not on a trailer.
hauptjm posted 05-22-2000 02:11 PM ET (US)
My fiberglass "guru" is going to do a little exploratory surgery to see what's going on. He doesn't think it's any big deal because it's very isolated and has not spread in the 1 1/2 years that I 've owned the boat. And I use my boat fairly regularly. As far as the trailor, my boat is on the original trailer, which is a center load roller/side bunk configuration. After reading the article on trailers, I was glad to see mine has been properly done all these years. One of the possible repairs my glass man suggested was to drill a small hole, and fill with epoxy to create a sturdy underbase. He said it can be done assuming the materials will match-up and not degrade the foam filler. I'll let everyone know what we find.

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Author	Topic: Structural Wood Lay-up 18ft. Outrage
hauptjm	posted 04-25-2000 02:31 PM ET (US) The addition of the structural wood lay-up in this site is great. Does anyone know where one can be found for the bigger boats? I have an '85 18ft. Outrage. It seems I've got 2 very small "soft" spots in the deck in the exact same place. Both are located roughly 3 feet forward of the transom right at the outside edge of the deck liner for about 3 inches into the boat. I'd like to see if there is a stringer at this point that could be the culprit; possibly allowing water to "weep" into the exact same spot on both sides. Anyone knowing where I could locate a diagram or share their experience with this situation, would greatly appreciated. p.s. Spent 3 days a while back running my Whaler in 5-6 foot seas in Lake Pontchartrain here in New Orleans with 25 knots of steady breeze working a racing clinic (sailing); blew the doors off of everthing around. Much bigger Mako's were not able to keep up. My '85 got a lot of attention at the dock. What a great boat.
lhg	posted 04-25-2000 03:57 PM ET (US) I have the wood locating diagram for the 18 Outrage. I don't think there is any wood in the places you describe, but send me an email with your address, and I'll send you a copy.
David Reid	posted 04-26-2000 10:17 PM ET (US) Agree with you on the O/R 18'. I picked my '86 model up in N.O. last September, repowered with a new OMC 150 and flat love it. Important that Mamma likes it, too. I'm about finished with a complete restoration and live over in Lafayette, so drop me an e-mail about anything. I can fax the wood diagram if you still need it.
Russ	posted 04-27-2000 12:19 AM ET (US) James, I hope you post your findings about the soft spots, and the repairs, of your 18' Outrage. I have an 18 footer too, and it has soft spots in the same places yours does. A fiberglass repairman told me not to worry about. But, of course, I do. Russ
tbirdsey	posted 04-29-2000 09:11 PM ET (US) James, While getting my 84 Outrage ready for the spring today, I found I also have a soft spot in the same place on the stern side only. Larry's right - no wood there according to the diagram. Guess I'll just keep an eye on it.
lhg	posted 05-12-2000 09:22 PM ET (US) The soft spots in the floor sounds like minor glass delamination from the foam. This could be from sitting on an improper trailer at some point in the boat's life, or an improper dry storage rack situation (a big problem today, since none of these that I have seen support a boat at the keel) unknown to a current owner when the boat is bought used. In the early eighties, I have seen many Whalers set up on the Easy Roller cradle roller type of trailer by incompetent dealers. I had a friend with a brand new Montauk on such a trailer, furnished by the Whaler dealer! These trailers can ruin a Whaler hull in a short time, and are not much used anymore. But they were all the rage in the mid eighties. Bearing pressure on the outside hull, away from the keel, can "pop" the interior foam bond as well as the exterior bond. The other not widely known fact is that for some (unknown to me, but possibly foam or resins being used) manufacturing reason, and inspite of Whaler's already proven track record, about 100 of the first 18 Outrage hulls proved to be defective, with glass/foam delamination showing up after a couple of years. The boat was a mid 1983 year introduction to the public, but evidently a few earlier test models found their way into the market beginning in late 1981. The 83's and early 84's had this problem, mainly noticeable by considerably wavy hull sides which were "popping" loose intermittenly. Almost all of these owners got brand new hulls in the period of 1985-1990, under the 10 yr warranty, but it's possible that some of these early ones may still be out there, and may have not shown the extreme problems. I understand they had to replace about 75 of them at no charge. All of this information was from a dealer, who replaced several of these hulls at his shop. (the interior items were not replaced, but simply transfered by the dealer to the new bare hull). I ran into a guy in FL, a real "sharpie", who knew about the problem, and located and purchased a badly beat up & weathered 1983 boat in 1990, with major signs of hull delamination (I saw the boat myself), at a used boat junk yard, and bought it for $1000 complete with trailer, without engine. Since Whaler's warranty is transferrable to any subsequent owner, he took it right over to a Dealer and demanded a new hull, which he reluctantly got, since they figured out what he had pulled off. It was quite a sight seeing the Dealer put the old weathered console and seat into the new boat! But the boat looked beautiful and he was the happiest guy around. Said he couldn't believe the company was willing to do this for him! I'll bet he's still a whaler owner.
Tom Byrum	posted 05-13-2000 08:56 PM ET (US) Just checked my 18'. Solid as a rock. Maybe cause my boat spent it's first 11 years in the water and not on a trailer.
hauptjm	posted 05-22-2000 02:11 PM ET (US) My fiberglass "guru" is going to do a little exploratory surgery to see what's going on. He doesn't think it's any big deal because it's very isolated and has not spread in the 1 1/2 years that I 've owned the boat. And I use my boat fairly regularly. As far as the trailor, my boat is on the original trailer, which is a center load roller/side bunk configuration. After reading the article on trailers, I was glad to see mine has been properly done all these years. One of the possible repairs my glass man suggested was to drill a small hole, and fill with epoxy to create a sturdy underbase. He said it can be done assuming the materials will match-up and not degrade the foam filler. I'll let everyone know what we find.