Gas line on Montauk routing through hull - Moderated Discussion Areas

  ContinuousWave
  Whaler
  Moderated Discussion Areas
  ContinuousWave: Whaler Repairs/Mods
  Gas line on Montauk routing through hull

search | FAQ | profile | register | author help

Author Topic:   Gas line on Montauk routing through hull

tully_mars posted 10-10-2002 10:59 AM ET (US)
Ok all, I am about to start putting my Montauk back together here and am trying to decide on how to run the gas line. The tank will be under the seat (20 gallons) and I was thinking about drilling a hole into the cable "tunnel" and routing the gas line back to the motor as not to have it on the deck.
Question is, I just read that in these old 16' Whalers the tunnel is Aluminum, is this a bad or good idea? Will I be creating a great place for water to get into the hull?
I was going to use a seal-tite around the gas line to seal up the deck, but of course you won't be able to get to it on the inside.
Tully Mars
kingfish posted 10-10-2002 11:14 AM ET (US)
TM-
I may be exposing the fragile condition of my memory here (not even the first time today!), but I thought both the Montauks I had routed the fuel line through the center tunnel to a factory cut-out in the deck below the seat. Yours doesn't have this cut-out into the tunnel?
I think the older of my two Montauks was an '82; maybe yours is an earlier model that didn't have this?
kingfish
Tom W Clark posted 10-10-2002 11:19 AM ET (US)
Tully Mars,
You definitely want to run the fuel line through the tunnel. There's nothing wrong with drilling the aluminum tube (or PVC), that's what Whaler did (and does). Whatever piece of hardware you choose to use for the "hawse hole", be sure to bed it well with the sealant of your choice, like 3M 4200 or 101 and the water will be kept out.
I think you will find that the tube is directly under the "floor." I believe they laid it directly on the interior skin during lay up. Thus there will be very little, if any, foam exposed when you drill/cut the hole.
tully_mars posted 10-10-2002 01:28 PM ET (US)
Ok, so I am still going to drill it. I just going to start with a small pilot hole and work up to bigger drill bits. I don't think it will be any larger than 3/4" and I was planning on using 5200 all over it like crazy, then the seal-tite over that.
Actually my boat is a 1972 Standard 16' that is being rebuilt into a Montauk. So it did not have the hole in the deck already. Hope to have some pictures here in the next couple of weeks of a running boat.
BTW, it did come with Montauk rails already on it when I got it, just the console was home-made.
Tully Mars
Tom W Clark posted 10-10-2002 02:18 PM ET (US)
Tully Mars,
You should use a hole saw in a low speed drill motor to drill the hole.
You should maybe think about a larger hole than 3/4". While a hole this size will accommodate the fuel hose itself I think you will find it far more convenient to be able to pull the fuel hose with connecter through the hole you create.
You do not need to worry about sealing the hole with a "seal-tite" as the tunnel is flooded anyway. Just protect the exposed foam. Do not use 5200 for this as it will be tough to remove later.
Wilcox Crittenden still makes a really nice hawse hole that was used on the Classic Outrage gunwale boards that is also about the same size as the plastic hawse hole Whaler used on the Montauks.
A chrome plated flush mount fuel fill (without the cap) or garboard drain plug (without the plug) works well for this purpose too.
ratherwhalering posted 10-10-2002 04:55 PM ET (US)
Check out my article in the reference section, it has a whole section on drilling and sealing this hole, and what tools I used. In addition, adaco, a member of this forum, just did this exact thing to his older 17'. He probably has some good tips for you too.
lhg posted 10-10-2002 06:21 PM ET (US)
The correct name of the fitting for this hole is "hawse pipe". Several types are available.
Tom W Clark posted 10-10-2002 07:34 PM ET (US)
Larry,
"Hawse pipe" is one correct term for that piece of hardware. "Hawse hole", "deck pipe", and "hawse hole pipe" are others.
When there are multiple correct terms or spellings of the same word I choose to use the version that Whaler themselves used to describe the part in question. Whaler describes this part for the fuel hose passage on the Montauks as a "hawse hole" in their price lists.
"Hawse pipe" is the more traditional term.
jimh posted 10-11-2002 08:50 AM ET (US)
"Hawse Pipe" often refers to the large hole in the bow of a ship through which the anchor chain passes.
Among military mariners, an officer who has been promoted from the enlisted ranks is said to have "come up through the hawse pipe."
In the Coast Guard, such officers are known as "Mustangs".
Chesapeake posted 10-11-2002 03:25 PM ET (US)
I may be completely off on this, but as I read Tully Mars' thread, it seemed that he may have missed the context you guys are appropriately trying to convey.
Listen to Tom... after you drill the hole, the best procedure is then not to simply weather-tight it, but to apply a "fitting" to the open hole (hause pipe or whatever you want to call it). The fitting or hause pipe is a piece of plastic (or stainless) tubing with a flange on the top that is proud to the deck floor. It not only looks better, but if sealed, will go along way in preventing water from intruding into the deck foam. Look at Cetacea for more.
If this was understood, please disregard this...
Best,
BW
tully_mars posted 10-12-2002 09:32 PM ET (US)
Thanks all for the input. I am going to look at getting a Stainless Water or something cap and make a "small" Hawse Pipe hole. I will also check out the article in the Reference.
The inside of my boat is finished as far as paint goes, will be getting it back on Wednesday so 1 or 2 more weeks and it will be done.
Frustrating, I lost all pics due to a hard drive crash of the progress on this restoration. Bummer....
Thanks again.
Tully Mars
tully_mars posted 10-15-2002 09:36 AM ET (US)
The article in the reference section was awesome, and the pictures were great. I went and got a plastic white thru hull and am going to put that in, question though on sealing around it.
I am thinking of using Marine-tex to seal/rebuild the vertical area newly created in the tunnel around the thru hull after drilling. Is Marine-tex as good as any other epoxy for this? I looked at the West Systems epoxy but that is really expensive for such little use here.
Also, I would like to use the Marine-Tex for filling the rivet-hulls on the rub rail because I plan to use stainless screws on the new one. Will marine-tex hold over time to seal and be good enough for drilling if I hit one of the old holes? I am planning on drilling not in the old places, but wanted to use something strong in case I did hit one.
Thanks in advance all.
Tully Mars
Sixer posted 10-15-2002 10:18 AM ET (US)
the hawser hole, hawser whole, hauser pipe, hawser fitting, hawser whatever; will also protect your fuel line from chafing. You don't want to be sitting on a 20 gal bomb!!!
Tom W Clark posted 10-16-2002 12:25 AM ET (US)
Tully Mars,
I don't think you want to use either Marine-Tex or West System epoxy (or any other type of epoxy) to seal the exposed foam.
Epoxy is a very strong adhesive and filling material. (Marine-Tex is just an epoxy putty.)
All you are trying to do is seal the area, not glue the fitting in or fill a void. What you want to use is a caulk, preferably one that will not prevent you from removing the thru-hull/haswe hole at some point in the future.
A polyurethane caulk like 3M 4200 or Sika 231 would do well, as would a household grade of silicone caulk. Polysulfide caulks are not recommended for plastic parts like your thru-hull as they may "melt" it.
You should probably drill the hole before you decide what is really needed. You may not expose much foam at all. Remember, all you want to do is protect the foam from any water contact.
Use the polyurethane caulk on the rub rail as well. It will be far less work, seal the holes better and cost less.
The old rivet holes should be on a pretty regular layout so if you install new screws between them using the same spacing you will not run the risk of hitting one of the old holes.
tully_mars posted 10-17-2002 03:27 PM ET (US)
Conclusion all. Kudos to Tom Clark, his experience is great. Used a 1 3/8" hole saw which was perfect. Found out there was no foam exposed only about 1 1/4" of wood in the deck which was a nice surprise to me. According the wood locating diagram on this site for the 16' Whaler, there are only 2 strips of 4 1/2" wood in the deck. In my boat here (1972 16') the whole deck is wood. Was much easier than I expected. Thanks again all.
Now on to the rub rail, report to come....
Tully Mars
tully_mars posted 10-21-2002 08:59 AM ET (US)
Ok all, my rub rail is no the boat. 5200 in old screw holes etc... Let me tell you, that is the first and last rub rail I will ever do. It looks great and the finished product is 1st class, but what a load of trouble and royal pain in the ####. LOL, took an entire afternoon, about 6 hours and a heat gun works so so. The hard part was the track itself, it was so conformed to the coil in the box we couldn't get enough to straighten out for the heat gun to really help. Anyhow, it does look good though I doubted myself in the middle of it.
So the restoration in 90% complete, pictures to come next week upon completion.
Tully Mars

Hop to:

Contact Us | RETURN to ContinuousWave Top Page

Powered by: Ultimate Bulletin Board, Freeware Version 2000
Purchase our Licensed Version- which adds many more features!
© Infopop Corporation (formerly Madrona Park, Inc.), 1998 - 2000.

Author	Topic: Gas line on Montauk routing through hull
tully_mars	posted 10-10-2002 10:59 AM ET (US) Ok all, I am about to start putting my Montauk back together here and am trying to decide on how to run the gas line. The tank will be under the seat (20 gallons) and I was thinking about drilling a hole into the cable "tunnel" and routing the gas line back to the motor as not to have it on the deck. Question is, I just read that in these old 16' Whalers the tunnel is Aluminum, is this a bad or good idea? Will I be creating a great place for water to get into the hull? I was going to use a seal-tite around the gas line to seal up the deck, but of course you won't be able to get to it on the inside. Tully Mars
kingfish	posted 10-10-2002 11:14 AM ET (US) TM- I may be exposing the fragile condition of my memory here (not even the first time today!), but I thought both the Montauks I had routed the fuel line through the center tunnel to a factory cut-out in the deck below the seat. Yours doesn't have this cut-out into the tunnel? I think the older of my two Montauks was an '82; maybe yours is an earlier model that didn't have this? kingfish
Tom W Clark	posted 10-10-2002 11:19 AM ET (US) Tully Mars, You definitely want to run the fuel line through the tunnel. There's nothing wrong with drilling the aluminum tube (or PVC), that's what Whaler did (and does). Whatever piece of hardware you choose to use for the "hawse hole", be sure to bed it well with the sealant of your choice, like 3M 4200 or 101 and the water will be kept out. I think you will find that the tube is directly under the "floor." I believe they laid it directly on the interior skin during lay up. Thus there will be very little, if any, foam exposed when you drill/cut the hole.
tully_mars	posted 10-10-2002 01:28 PM ET (US) Ok, so I am still going to drill it. I just going to start with a small pilot hole and work up to bigger drill bits. I don't think it will be any larger than 3/4" and I was planning on using 5200 all over it like crazy, then the seal-tite over that. Actually my boat is a 1972 Standard 16' that is being rebuilt into a Montauk. So it did not have the hole in the deck already. Hope to have some pictures here in the next couple of weeks of a running boat. BTW, it did come with Montauk rails already on it when I got it, just the console was home-made. Tully Mars
Tom W Clark	posted 10-10-2002 02:18 PM ET (US) Tully Mars, You should use a hole saw in a low speed drill motor to drill the hole. You should maybe think about a larger hole than 3/4". While a hole this size will accommodate the fuel hose itself I think you will find it far more convenient to be able to pull the fuel hose with connecter through the hole you create. You do not need to worry about sealing the hole with a "seal-tite" as the tunnel is flooded anyway. Just protect the exposed foam. Do not use 5200 for this as it will be tough to remove later. Wilcox Crittenden still makes a really nice hawse hole that was used on the Classic Outrage gunwale boards that is also about the same size as the plastic hawse hole Whaler used on the Montauks. A chrome plated flush mount fuel fill (without the cap) or garboard drain plug (without the plug) works well for this purpose too.
ratherwhalering	posted 10-10-2002 04:55 PM ET (US) Check out my article in the reference section, it has a whole section on drilling and sealing this hole, and what tools I used. In addition, adaco, a member of this forum, just did this exact thing to his older 17'. He probably has some good tips for you too.
lhg	posted 10-10-2002 06:21 PM ET (US) The correct name of the fitting for this hole is "hawse pipe". Several types are available.
Tom W Clark	posted 10-10-2002 07:34 PM ET (US) Larry, "Hawse pipe" is one correct term for that piece of hardware. "Hawse hole", "deck pipe", and "hawse hole pipe" are others. When there are multiple correct terms or spellings of the same word I choose to use the version that Whaler themselves used to describe the part in question. Whaler describes this part for the fuel hose passage on the Montauks as a "hawse hole" in their price lists. "Hawse pipe" is the more traditional term.
jimh	posted 10-11-2002 08:50 AM ET (US) "Hawse Pipe" often refers to the large hole in the bow of a ship through which the anchor chain passes. Among military mariners, an officer who has been promoted from the enlisted ranks is said to have "come up through the hawse pipe." In the Coast Guard, such officers are known as "Mustangs".
Chesapeake	posted 10-11-2002 03:25 PM ET (US) I may be completely off on this, but as I read Tully Mars' thread, it seemed that he may have missed the context you guys are appropriately trying to convey. Listen to Tom... after you drill the hole, the best procedure is then not to simply weather-tight it, but to apply a "fitting" to the open hole (hause pipe or whatever you want to call it). The fitting or hause pipe is a piece of plastic (or stainless) tubing with a flange on the top that is proud to the deck floor. It not only looks better, but if sealed, will go along way in preventing water from intruding into the deck foam. Look at Cetacea for more. If this was understood, please disregard this... Best, BW
tully_mars	posted 10-12-2002 09:32 PM ET (US) Thanks all for the input. I am going to look at getting a Stainless Water or something cap and make a "small" Hawse Pipe hole. I will also check out the article in the Reference. The inside of my boat is finished as far as paint goes, will be getting it back on Wednesday so 1 or 2 more weeks and it will be done. Frustrating, I lost all pics due to a hard drive crash of the progress on this restoration. Bummer.... Thanks again. Tully Mars
tully_mars	posted 10-15-2002 09:36 AM ET (US) The article in the reference section was awesome, and the pictures were great. I went and got a plastic white thru hull and am going to put that in, question though on sealing around it. I am thinking of using Marine-tex to seal/rebuild the vertical area newly created in the tunnel around the thru hull after drilling. Is Marine-tex as good as any other epoxy for this? I looked at the West Systems epoxy but that is really expensive for such little use here. Also, I would like to use the Marine-Tex for filling the rivet-hulls on the rub rail because I plan to use stainless screws on the new one. Will marine-tex hold over time to seal and be good enough for drilling if I hit one of the old holes? I am planning on drilling not in the old places, but wanted to use something strong in case I did hit one. Thanks in advance all. Tully Mars
Sixer	posted 10-15-2002 10:18 AM ET (US) the hawser hole, hawser whole, hauser pipe, hawser fitting, hawser whatever; will also protect your fuel line from chafing. You don't want to be sitting on a 20 gal bomb!!!
Tom W Clark	posted 10-16-2002 12:25 AM ET (US) Tully Mars, I don't think you want to use either Marine-Tex or West System epoxy (or any other type of epoxy) to seal the exposed foam. Epoxy is a very strong adhesive and filling material. (Marine-Tex is just an epoxy putty.) All you are trying to do is seal the area, not glue the fitting in or fill a void. What you want to use is a caulk, preferably one that will not prevent you from removing the thru-hull/haswe hole at some point in the future. A polyurethane caulk like 3M 4200 or Sika 231 would do well, as would a household grade of silicone caulk. Polysulfide caulks are not recommended for plastic parts like your thru-hull as they may "melt" it. You should probably drill the hole before you decide what is really needed. You may not expose much foam at all. Remember, all you want to do is protect the foam from any water contact. Use the polyurethane caulk on the rub rail as well. It will be far less work, seal the holes better and cost less. The old rivet holes should be on a pretty regular layout so if you install new screws between them using the same spacing you will not run the risk of hitting one of the old holes.
tully_mars	posted 10-17-2002 03:27 PM ET (US) Conclusion all. Kudos to Tom Clark, his experience is great. Used a 1 3/8" hole saw which was perfect. Found out there was no foam exposed only about 1 1/4" of wood in the deck which was a nice surprise to me. According the wood locating diagram on this site for the 16' Whaler, there are only 2 strips of 4 1/2" wood in the deck. In my boat here (1972 16') the whole deck is wood. Was much easier than I expected. Thanks again all. Now on to the rub rail, report to come.... Tully Mars
tully_mars	posted 10-21-2002 08:59 AM ET (US) Ok all, my rub rail is no the boat. 5200 in old screw holes etc... Let me tell you, that is the first and last rub rail I will ever do. It looks great and the finished product is 1st class, but what a load of trouble and royal pain in the ####. LOL, took an entire afternoon, about 6 hours and a heat gun works so so. The hard part was the track itself, it was so conformed to the coil in the box we couldn't get enough to straighten out for the heat gun to really help. Anyhow, it does look good though I doubted myself in the middle of it. So the restoration in 90% complete, pictures to come next week upon completion. Tully Mars