Effect of UV on On-Deck Fuel Tanks - Moderated Discussion Areas

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Author Topic:   Effect of UV on On-Deck Fuel Tanks

mark11 posted 02-17-2004 09:38 AM ET (US)
I have the original red gas tank under the seat on my 1982 Montauk. Recently a dealer (not BW) told me that I should replace this tank because the sun affects the bottom of the tank and causes damage. Is this a real concern? If so any proven solutions beyond his suggestion of a new $300.00 tank would be appreciated.
jameso posted 02-17-2004 10:06 AM ET (US)
mark,
Never heard of the sun having any effect on the bottom of the tank??? Sunshine and resulting UV damage usually occurs to the part exposed to direct sunlight.
If you aren't having problems and the tank has no soft spots or such let it be.
Jim
JBCornwell posted 02-17-2004 03:31 PM ET (US)
Hi, Mark.
Ditto JamesO.
If you do decide to replace it, it is probably a Tempo 27-28gallon. $200 or less at most marine outlets.
Red sky at night. . .
JB
daverdla posted 02-17-2004 10:31 PM ET (US)
I think Mark may be referring to an old Pate fiberglass tank which were red. I heard the same thing about the fiberglass failing due to exposure. I don't know if it's true. You could try calling Pate and asking them. Their number is somewhere on this site.
Dave
Sal DiMercurio posted 02-17-2004 10:40 PM ET (US)
I normally have a spare 20 gallon Tempo under my seat but some SOB not only took the fuel, they also took the full tank.
I went to West Marine & picked up a 28 gallon tempo tank for $299 & haven't seen them any cheaper.
Sal
JBCornwell posted 02-18-2004 07:11 AM ET (US)
West has them for $194.99 in the new 2004 catalog.
Red sky at night. . .
JB
daverdla posted 02-18-2004 07:12 AM ET (US)
Pate Plastics
360 NW 71 St.
Miami, FL 33150
305-754-0896
jimh posted 02-18-2004 09:31 AM ET (US)
[Changed TOPIC; was "red montauk gas tank ?"]
I would assume you are talking about a plastic fuel tank ("red gas tank') and not a Pate fiberglass fuel tank finished in red gel coat. I think the ratio of red plastic tanks to red Pate tanks is something on the order of ten million-to-one. If you are actually that one in ten-million situation, please let us know.
UV radiation ("the sun") affects plastic, but I can not understand how it would affect the bottom of the tank. That is about the only place on a tank that is not exposed to the sun.
Your non-Boston Whaler dealer's advice does not sound too reliable to me.
This is not to say that an older plastic (or fiberglass) fuel tank is impervious to decay. Gasoline is quite a good solvent and has very low viscosity, so it usually manages to find any leaks in a tank quite quickly. Leaking gasoline leaves quite an odor so I am sure you will become aware of a leak in your tank quite promptly after it begins.
In the reference section of the website you will find a well researched article that discusses the many options available for on-deck fuel tanks.
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/onDeckFuelTank.html
Please note that in 1982 the Boston Whaler MONTAUK was not sold by the factory with a gas tank pre-rigged. Your tank ("original red gas tank") was supplied by the dealer or whoever rigged the boat with the engine. The tank could have been made by a number of vendors.
4Runner posted 02-18-2004 01:05 PM ET (US)
You can get the 27 gallon Tempo tank from Bass Pro Shop for $99.99 + around $10 shipping.
mark11 posted 02-18-2004 02:05 PM ET (US)
you guys are awsome.
I think it is the pate tank. (Dark red fiberglass). I called pate today (thanks daverdla). they told me not to worry if there is no leak. (it doesn't) they said that an older tank can develop a film of gunk on the bottom from the gas and oil/dirt build up. They also told be how to clean it.
use enough acetone to cover the bottom, shake continously for about five minutes than empty. rinse with H2O and empty again. Fill the tank with H2O and palmolive soap and empty. Rinse again, empty and let dry. It should be as good as new.
This is my 1st whaler and I can tell I'm oing to learn a lot on this site.
Thanks,
Mark
daverdla posted 02-18-2004 11:00 PM ET (US)
Mark, I'm glad I was able to help. It's rare, but it happens. Some things to look for to be sure it's a pate, a vertical decal indicating the amount of fuel (if enough of the decal is left, you may be able see the "PATE" name), metal gas cap, two fuel ports on top of the tank, one will be plugged, the bottom of the tank is slightly above the deck, the tank actually rests on the perimeter of the base. It may also have handles, or whats left of them, on either side at the top of the tank.
Ten million to one, those are pretty long odds. Too bad Mark wasted his money on a boat and not on a lottery ticket:) BTW, my pate tank, RIP, was originally red. It had been painted white by the previous owner. Hey, I just thought of something - two guys on the same forum with those unbelievably rare red pate tanks. I wonder what the odds of that happening are .... jimh?
Dave
mark11 posted 02-19-2004 08:32 AM ET (US)

It's a Pate alright. I never really thought to look for a brand name (duh) It is exactly as you discribed. I think I'm going to have to clean it up and keep it since it seems to be a rare find.
Mark
jimh posted 02-19-2004 09:17 AM ET (US)
Mark--Dave--Send me a digital image of that red Pate fiberglass tank and I will add it to the Reference article.
webfoot posted 02-22-2004 07:31 PM ET (US)
Wow, are the red pate tanks really that rare? I own an '81 Montauk with one. translucent red fiberglass, and definately a Pate.
dreamer posted 02-24-2004 12:39 AM ET (US)
I have an old "attwood" 6 gal. tank (red-color). Placed it on the side of my house exposed to rising sun and setting sun for 1 summer and it turned chalky white.
daverdla posted 02-24-2004 07:08 AM ET (US)
If anybody's interested, there's a montauk on ebay right now with a red pate tank. It's not actually painted red, just unpainted fiberglass.
Dave
ratherwhalering posted 02-24-2004 01:24 PM ET (US)
An interesting tid bit I discovered while talking with the folks at Pate some time ago about modifying the tank specifically for a 17-Montauk. The tank is a two part system. The first part comes out of the mold as a fiberglass shell, or "cover", which is later painted (not gelcoat). The bottom of the tank is inlaid and bonded to the cover, just above the level of the lower "lip" of the outer shell, so the fuel is suspended or "slung" above the level of the deck. The idea is to prohibit contact between any part of the tank that holds fuel and the deck of your boat.
By the way, for about $200.00 bucks (if I remember the price right) Pate is happy to take delivery of your old tank, repair, refurbish, repaint, re-rig, and then ship it back to you.
daverdla posted 02-24-2004 07:15 PM ET (US)
It's a clever system. They only need to change the height of the tank to change the capacity. The bottom is the same for all of the montauk tanks.
I never threw out that old pate tank, for $200 it might be worth getting it fixed.
Dave
mark11 posted 02-24-2004 09:48 PM ET (US)
This whole thing started when I was told that that tank needed to be replaced. Now I'm going to clean it this weekend and keep it on the boat. I plan to have my wife make a cover for it to prevent any UV issues in the future. In just over a week this forum has already tought methe value of keeping my montauk as original as possible.
Mark
ratherwhalering posted 02-25-2004 03:00 PM ET (US)
Clever indeed...unfortunatly the method of production greatly complicates Pate's ability to provide a "notch" so the fuel line can reach the hawse pipe without drilling a new hole into the bilge tube.

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Author	Topic: Effect of UV on On-Deck Fuel Tanks
mark11	posted 02-17-2004 09:38 AM ET (US) I have the original red gas tank under the seat on my 1982 Montauk. Recently a dealer (not BW) told me that I should replace this tank because the sun affects the bottom of the tank and causes damage. Is this a real concern? If so any proven solutions beyond his suggestion of a new $300.00 tank would be appreciated.
jameso	posted 02-17-2004 10:06 AM ET (US) mark, Never heard of the sun having any effect on the bottom of the tank??? Sunshine and resulting UV damage usually occurs to the part exposed to direct sunlight. If you aren't having problems and the tank has no soft spots or such let it be. Jim
JBCornwell	posted 02-17-2004 03:31 PM ET (US) Hi, Mark. Ditto JamesO. If you do decide to replace it, it is probably a Tempo 27-28gallon. $200 or less at most marine outlets. Red sky at night. . . JB
daverdla	posted 02-17-2004 10:31 PM ET (US) I think Mark may be referring to an old Pate fiberglass tank which were red. I heard the same thing about the fiberglass failing due to exposure. I don't know if it's true. You could try calling Pate and asking them. Their number is somewhere on this site. Dave
Sal DiMercurio	posted 02-17-2004 10:40 PM ET (US) I normally have a spare 20 gallon Tempo under my seat but some SOB not only took the fuel, they also took the full tank. I went to West Marine & picked up a 28 gallon tempo tank for $299 & haven't seen them any cheaper. Sal
JBCornwell	posted 02-18-2004 07:11 AM ET (US) West has them for $194.99 in the new 2004 catalog. Red sky at night. . . JB
daverdla	posted 02-18-2004 07:12 AM ET (US) Pate Plastics 360 NW 71 St. Miami, FL 33150 305-754-0896
jimh	posted 02-18-2004 09:31 AM ET (US) [Changed TOPIC; was "red montauk gas tank ?"] I would assume you are talking about a plastic fuel tank ("red gas tank') and not a Pate fiberglass fuel tank finished in red gel coat. I think the ratio of red plastic tanks to red Pate tanks is something on the order of ten million-to-one. If you are actually that one in ten-million situation, please let us know. UV radiation ("the sun") affects plastic, but I can not understand how it would affect the bottom of the tank. That is about the only place on a tank that is not exposed to the sun. Your non-Boston Whaler dealer's advice does not sound too reliable to me. This is not to say that an older plastic (or fiberglass) fuel tank is impervious to decay. Gasoline is quite a good solvent and has very low viscosity, so it usually manages to find any leaks in a tank quite quickly. Leaking gasoline leaves quite an odor so I am sure you will become aware of a leak in your tank quite promptly after it begins. In the reference section of the website you will find a well researched article that discusses the many options available for on-deck fuel tanks. http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/onDeckFuelTank.html Please note that in 1982 the Boston Whaler MONTAUK was not sold by the factory with a gas tank pre-rigged. Your tank ("original red gas tank") was supplied by the dealer or whoever rigged the boat with the engine. The tank could have been made by a number of vendors.
4Runner	posted 02-18-2004 01:05 PM ET (US) You can get the 27 gallon Tempo tank from Bass Pro Shop for $99.99 + around $10 shipping.
mark11	posted 02-18-2004 02:05 PM ET (US) you guys are awsome. I think it is the pate tank. (Dark red fiberglass). I called pate today (thanks daverdla). they told me not to worry if there is no leak. (it doesn't) they said that an older tank can develop a film of gunk on the bottom from the gas and oil/dirt build up. They also told be how to clean it. use enough acetone to cover the bottom, shake continously for about five minutes than empty. rinse with H2O and empty again. Fill the tank with H2O and palmolive soap and empty. Rinse again, empty and let dry. It should be as good as new. This is my 1st whaler and I can tell I'm oing to learn a lot on this site. Thanks, Mark
daverdla	posted 02-18-2004 11:00 PM ET (US) Mark, I'm glad I was able to help. It's rare, but it happens. Some things to look for to be sure it's a pate, a vertical decal indicating the amount of fuel (if enough of the decal is left, you may be able see the "PATE" name), metal gas cap, two fuel ports on top of the tank, one will be plugged, the bottom of the tank is slightly above the deck, the tank actually rests on the perimeter of the base. It may also have handles, or whats left of them, on either side at the top of the tank. Ten million to one, those are pretty long odds. Too bad Mark wasted his money on a boat and not on a lottery ticket:) BTW, my pate tank, RIP, was originally red. It had been painted white by the previous owner. Hey, I just thought of something - two guys on the same forum with those unbelievably rare red pate tanks. I wonder what the odds of that happening are .... jimh? Dave
mark11	posted 02-19-2004 08:32 AM ET (US) It's a Pate alright. I never really thought to look for a brand name (duh) It is exactly as you discribed. I think I'm going to have to clean it up and keep it since it seems to be a rare find. Mark
jimh	posted 02-19-2004 09:17 AM ET (US) Mark--Dave--Send me a digital image of that red Pate fiberglass tank and I will add it to the Reference article.
webfoot	posted 02-22-2004 07:31 PM ET (US) Wow, are the red pate tanks really that rare? I own an '81 Montauk with one. translucent red fiberglass, and definately a Pate.
dreamer	posted 02-24-2004 12:39 AM ET (US) I have an old "attwood" 6 gal. tank (red-color). Placed it on the side of my house exposed to rising sun and setting sun for 1 summer and it turned chalky white.
daverdla	posted 02-24-2004 07:08 AM ET (US) If anybody's interested, there's a montauk on ebay right now with a red pate tank. It's not actually painted red, just unpainted fiberglass. Dave
ratherwhalering	posted 02-24-2004 01:24 PM ET (US) An interesting tid bit I discovered while talking with the folks at Pate some time ago about modifying the tank specifically for a 17-Montauk. The tank is a two part system. The first part comes out of the mold as a fiberglass shell, or "cover", which is later painted (not gelcoat). The bottom of the tank is inlaid and bonded to the cover, just above the level of the lower "lip" of the outer shell, so the fuel is suspended or "slung" above the level of the deck. The idea is to prohibit contact between any part of the tank that holds fuel and the deck of your boat. By the way, for about $200.00 bucks (if I remember the price right) Pate is happy to take delivery of your old tank, repair, refurbish, repaint, re-rig, and then ship it back to you.
daverdla	posted 02-24-2004 07:15 PM ET (US) It's a clever system. They only need to change the height of the tank to change the capacity. The bottom is the same for all of the montauk tanks. I never threw out that old pate tank, for $200 it might be worth getting it fixed. Dave
mark11	posted 02-24-2004 09:48 PM ET (US) This whole thing started when I was told that that tank needed to be replaced. Now I'm going to clean it this weekend and keep it on the boat. I plan to have my wife make a cover for it to prevent any UV issues in the future. In just over a week this forum has already tought methe value of keeping my montauk as original as possible. Mark
ratherwhalering	posted 02-25-2004 03:00 PM ET (US) Clever indeed...unfortunatly the method of production greatly complicates Pate's ability to provide a "notch" so the fuel line can reach the hawse pipe without drilling a new hole into the bilge tube.