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Author Topic:   Tinting Gel Coat

floatinghat posted 05-29-2008 07:36 PM ET (US)
My [1977] Montauk has a significant number of spider cracks and crazing cracks in the interior. I would like to fill the larger cracks and did in with some Spectrum Desert Tan patch. I am not happy with the color match as the patch is noticeably lighter in color. The method I used was routing out the crack with a dremel bit, wiping with acetone, filling and then sanding. How does one go about tinting the patch material? I would also like to patch a couple of the [existing] repairs on the hull. What color is the hull on a 1977 Montauk? Outrage gray?

pglein posted 05-30-2008 11:39 AM ET (US)
You may want to try polishing the area. Perhaps the surface of the original gelcoat has faded, but a good polishing will bring out the original color and blend it into the rest of the boat.
Tom W Clark posted 05-30-2008 11:53 AM ET (US)
You can lighten and darken the Spectrum Gel Coat or Gel Coat Patch Paste by adding a wee bit of white or black tint to it. Spectrum can sell you these tints or you can buy the tints off the shelf at West Marine and other chandleries.
Sunlight can darken or lighten the Desert Tan gel coat of a Whaler. I agree that sanding and polishing the area to be repaired first is critical to determining the correct color.
A 1977 Montauk was molded with Outrage Grey on the exterior of the hull and Desert Tan on the interior.
Wasatch Whaler posted 05-30-2008 02:43 PM ET (US)
I previously purchased the pre-tinted Spectrum paste and was disappointed by the color match. It is very easy to work with in terms of repairing scratches and gouges, but if the color isn't right then it's only marginally worth it, at least to me.
I need to do some small gel coat repairs to a 1976 I recently bought. I'm going to take the boat to a friend who manages an auto paint supply store and have her tint the gel coat.
She has been to numerous schools and does this professionally. Her company sells the PPG line of automotive paint, and the PPG Concept line of toners is approved to tint gel coat.
She has done this before with other customers and has used the PPG toners, as well as the tints you can buy from West Marine which people have brought in.
Her opinion is the PPG toners allow more accuracy as the West Marine type are really strong, and literally one drop makes a big change. They also have many more colors of toners to work with.
I'm trying to make the repairs invisible, so "close enough" isn't.
jimh posted 05-31-2008 10:06 AM ET (US)
I have found that you can make many shades of off white resin by using acrylic pigment in RAW SIENNA as the coloring agent and tinting into a titanium white resin. Mix a very small amount of the raw sienna pigment with a small amount of titanium white resin. Then use this mix to tint another batch of white resin. It is much easier to control the tint if you don't try to tint using the pure pigment color as the tinting agent. Dilute the pigment with some white resin, and use the diluted pigment-resin mix as the tinting agent into white resin.
If you don't have raw sienna as a pigment, mix up a bit of red, yellow, and black until you have a raw sienna hue.
When matching colors the light source is important. Since the boat will mainly be seen in daylight, use daylight as the light source when trying to match colors. Don't mix the tint indoors under incandescent light and expect it to match in sunlight.
The surface luster and reflectivity will influence the color appearance. Since the resin will appear wet and shiny, you should polish the boat surface to a nice luster and shine to appreciate its color before trying to match it against the wet resin.

lurkynot posted 06-02-2008 11:37 AM ET (US)
I have been struggling this week to match the color on my 18 Dauntless 2001. 5 small areas of the boat chips cracks not much larger than a nickle.
To make things even more complicated I believe the color above and below the rub rail was done with diferent batches of original gelcoat thus appearing "whiter" above than is below.
I have found the best angle of the sun is mid morning or late afternoon when the light was hitting the surface in a truer angle or - normal to the surfaces. I found a paint strip at my local Aco hardware store here in Michigan - "Mountain Peak White" that matched the upper portion with plans to add a bit more beige to a small portion of the lion share of the primary match.
Using tiny and I mean tiny toothpick droplets of brown yellow and beige tints from the gelcoat supplier locally I set up 2 oz cups of the mix recording the number of drops of each tint and applying it to the paint strip blow drying it and repeating until the desired color was re-born. I now have nearly a quart of the color that matches the portion of the boat above the rubrail and will use a small portion of it to tint just a bit darker for the lower portion since I have only 2 small areas requiring an application.
A colleague from work will be helping me spray and finish as a nice day and avalibilty of time allows.
floatinghat posted 06-03-2008 03:29 PM ET (US)
Lurky,
I like the idea of using paint "chips" to match the existing gel coat, Ace and Home Depot watch out.
I have done some sanding and buffing and the color is way off, although I now see the value in the light source. I plan on using a combination of these suggestions in good light should help. Glad it is only June :), I will follow up when done.
lurkynot posted 06-07-2008 09:52 AM ET (US)
floatinghat, I cannot take credit for the paint chip tip. That goes to Jim the moderator of this site. It does make things a whole lot easier to dial in the match.
This approach allows you to get pretty close without having to compare the mix to the boat in differing lighting conditions which will take you one way one time of the day and another color another part of the day forcing you to throw in the towel and shoot a color you that may not suit your situation.
When I mixed the gelcoat I concentrating on getting it as close as I could to the chosen paint chip. When I felt it was close I confirmed by smearing a good size sample of it near the area I was repairing to confirm it color adjusting if needed and removing it with acetone afterwards.
When you have the correct match the color you smear on will match the surrounding gelcoat in any lighting conditions. Do not be afraid of leaving the test "smear" on for long periods of time acetone will take it off. I actually left my on for a day since it was not catalyzed it wiped off with the solvent.
The key to adding pigment is to go slow and use small batches to get the feel for what tints will take the base toward the eventual color you desire and then mix the required volume to math precisely.
This is where Jim's experience paid dividends again. I used small cups from West Marine specifically made for holding resins other materials will react to resins and melt. 8oz cutting them to about the 4 oz mark essentially in half and adding the base to the 2 oz mark and carefully adding and counting the drops from a toothpick - literally of differing tints from the gelcoat supplier. If the color went to far off course I started the procedure over and on the third try nailed it and used the recorded number of drops of each pigment in the ratio needed to mix the required volume for the job.
Good luck. Let me know how it goes.
Tony

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Author	Topic: Tinting Gel Coat
floatinghat	posted 05-29-2008 07:36 PM ET (US) My [1977] Montauk has a significant number of spider cracks and crazing cracks in the interior. I would like to fill the larger cracks and did in with some Spectrum Desert Tan patch. I am not happy with the color match as the patch is noticeably lighter in color. The method I used was routing out the crack with a dremel bit, wiping with acetone, filling and then sanding. How does one go about tinting the patch material? I would also like to patch a couple of the [existing] repairs on the hull. What color is the hull on a 1977 Montauk? Outrage gray?
pglein	posted 05-30-2008 11:39 AM ET (US) You may want to try polishing the area. Perhaps the surface of the original gelcoat has faded, but a good polishing will bring out the original color and blend it into the rest of the boat.
Tom W Clark	posted 05-30-2008 11:53 AM ET (US) You can lighten and darken the Spectrum Gel Coat or Gel Coat Patch Paste by adding a wee bit of white or black tint to it. Spectrum can sell you these tints or you can buy the tints off the shelf at West Marine and other chandleries. Sunlight can darken or lighten the Desert Tan gel coat of a Whaler. I agree that sanding and polishing the area to be repaired first is critical to determining the correct color. A 1977 Montauk was molded with Outrage Grey on the exterior of the hull and Desert Tan on the interior.
Wasatch Whaler	posted 05-30-2008 02:43 PM ET (US) I previously purchased the pre-tinted Spectrum paste and was disappointed by the color match. It is very easy to work with in terms of repairing scratches and gouges, but if the color isn't right then it's only marginally worth it, at least to me. I need to do some small gel coat repairs to a 1976 I recently bought. I'm going to take the boat to a friend who manages an auto paint supply store and have her tint the gel coat. She has been to numerous schools and does this professionally. Her company sells the PPG line of automotive paint, and the PPG Concept line of toners is approved to tint gel coat. She has done this before with other customers and has used the PPG toners, as well as the tints you can buy from West Marine which people have brought in. Her opinion is the PPG toners allow more accuracy as the West Marine type are really strong, and literally one drop makes a big change. They also have many more colors of toners to work with. I'm trying to make the repairs invisible, so "close enough" isn't.
jimh	posted 05-31-2008 10:06 AM ET (US) I have found that you can make many shades of off white resin by using acrylic pigment in RAW SIENNA as the coloring agent and tinting into a titanium white resin. Mix a very small amount of the raw sienna pigment with a small amount of titanium white resin. Then use this mix to tint another batch of white resin. It is much easier to control the tint if you don't try to tint using the pure pigment color as the tinting agent. Dilute the pigment with some white resin, and use the diluted pigment-resin mix as the tinting agent into white resin. If you don't have raw sienna as a pigment, mix up a bit of red, yellow, and black until you have a raw sienna hue. When matching colors the light source is important. Since the boat will mainly be seen in daylight, use daylight as the light source when trying to match colors. Don't mix the tint indoors under incandescent light and expect it to match in sunlight. The surface luster and reflectivity will influence the color appearance. Since the resin will appear wet and shiny, you should polish the boat surface to a nice luster and shine to appreciate its color before trying to match it against the wet resin.
lurkynot	posted 06-02-2008 11:37 AM ET (US) I have been struggling this week to match the color on my 18 Dauntless 2001. 5 small areas of the boat chips cracks not much larger than a nickle. To make things even more complicated I believe the color above and below the rub rail was done with diferent batches of original gelcoat thus appearing "whiter" above than is below. I have found the best angle of the sun is mid morning or late afternoon when the light was hitting the surface in a truer angle or - normal to the surfaces. I found a paint strip at my local Aco hardware store here in Michigan - "Mountain Peak White" that matched the upper portion with plans to add a bit more beige to a small portion of the lion share of the primary match. Using tiny and I mean tiny toothpick droplets of brown yellow and beige tints from the gelcoat supplier locally I set up 2 oz cups of the mix recording the number of drops of each tint and applying it to the paint strip blow drying it and repeating until the desired color was re-born. I now have nearly a quart of the color that matches the portion of the boat above the rubrail and will use a small portion of it to tint just a bit darker for the lower portion since I have only 2 small areas requiring an application. A colleague from work will be helping me spray and finish as a nice day and avalibilty of time allows.
floatinghat	posted 06-03-2008 03:29 PM ET (US) Lurky, I like the idea of using paint "chips" to match the existing gel coat, Ace and Home Depot watch out. I have done some sanding and buffing and the color is way off, although I now see the value in the light source. I plan on using a combination of these suggestions in good light should help. Glad it is only June :), I will follow up when done.
lurkynot	posted 06-07-2008 09:52 AM ET (US) floatinghat, I cannot take credit for the paint chip tip. That goes to Jim the moderator of this site. It does make things a whole lot easier to dial in the match. This approach allows you to get pretty close without having to compare the mix to the boat in differing lighting conditions which will take you one way one time of the day and another color another part of the day forcing you to throw in the towel and shoot a color you that may not suit your situation. When I mixed the gelcoat I concentrating on getting it as close as I could to the chosen paint chip. When I felt it was close I confirmed by smearing a good size sample of it near the area I was repairing to confirm it color adjusting if needed and removing it with acetone afterwards. When you have the correct match the color you smear on will match the surrounding gelcoat in any lighting conditions. Do not be afraid of leaving the test "smear" on for long periods of time acetone will take it off. I actually left my on for a day since it was not catalyzed it wiped off with the solvent. The key to adding pigment is to go slow and use small batches to get the feel for what tints will take the base toward the eventual color you desire and then mix the required volume to math precisely. This is where Jim's experience paid dividends again. I used small cups from West Marine specifically made for holding resins other materials will react to resins and melt. 8oz cutting them to about the 4 oz mark essentially in half and adding the base to the 2 oz mark and carefully adding and counting the drops from a toothpick - literally of differing tints from the gelcoat supplier. If the color went to far off course I started the procedure over and on the third try nailed it and used the recorded number of drops of each pigment in the ratio needed to mix the required volume for the job. Good luck. Let me know how it goes. Tony