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Author Topic:   Water In Fuel Tank

ThomV posted 06-26-2010 09:03 AM ET (US)
I have a 17-foot OUTRAGE and have been having a horrible time with polluted gas. The boat is on a lift on a river of the Chesapeake Bay. We don't get to use it as much as we used to. Barely once a month. I re-powered it two seasons ago with an Evinrude 115-HP E-TEC, which has been great.
Well, last September we went out and got a half-mile from the dock when the motor quit. A neighbor towed us back and I sent the marina to deal with the problem. He brought a 6-gallon tank and ran the boat to the ramp with it. When he got to the shop he told me there was a lot of water in the tank. He drained it treated it and all was good. One ride after that, and, due to work schedules, I didn't get back to pull the boat for the winter before the river froze so I filled the tank, treated [the fuel], and winterized on the lift. This spring, I prepared the boat for the season, after which it started right up. Next day went for a ride, and [the E-TEC engine] stalled in the same place. Polluted gas again.
The real problem I believe is I think the gas in the inboard 60-gallon tank is being polluted with water. It may also have broken down some since it sat many months, although I don't have that problem with a truck that sits for months at a time without use.
[Give me ideas] on how water might be getting in the tank. Could the overflow valve be allowing water in? It is well above the water on a lift so might be a bit of a reach. The other thought I have is there may be water sitting in the hull around the tank. I would appreciate any ideas you have.
Thom
Martino posted 06-26-2010 05:13 PM ET (US)
Bad fuel cap seal would be high on my list. Depending on the location of the tank, that would let rain water in.
nitro vinny posted 06-26-2010 08:21 PM ET (US)
Not well versed in the fuel situation, however, I've heard much discussion on this site involving water separating from gasoline-ethanol fuel. I'm sure you'll be educated from those more educated on the subject.
AZdave posted 06-27-2010 01:56 AM ET (US)
My 18' Outrage had a badly deteriorated fuel fill hose. This is hidden in the gunwhale and deck, but I think it was the source of a gallon or more of water in the belly tank. I had symptoms similar to yours, the engine would cut out after operating normally for a period of time. This was due to sediment collecting on a filter screen in the fuel pick-up. It was worse in rough water due to the mixing of sediment with the fuel, and would resolve if the motor were stopped. The sediment would simply drop off the screen. I have new hoses and a good fuel filter. The screen is gone, and I have not had fuel issues for some time. You may have rainwater entering the tank while your boat is on its lift.
jimh posted 06-27-2010 08:05 AM ET (US)
What was the date of manufacture of the boat?
jimh posted 06-27-2010 08:23 AM ET (US)
There are three modes for water to appear in a fuel tank:
--the water comes with the gasoline you buy, and you pump it right into the tank;
--the tank [or some other component in the fuel system] has a leak and water leaks into the tank, but leaks are usually bi-directional and allow gasoline to leak out, too. Since gasoline has a strong vapor odor, you can usually smell the leaking gasoline; or,
--the diurnal temperature variation causes some water to condense out of the air above the tank.
If a retailer sells gasoline contaminated with water, they usually have more than one customer affected, and word gets around about the problem. Check with other customers of the fuel retailer to see if they got water in their gasoline.
In the situation discussed here, the water appears only after the boat has sat motionless for long time. This could be due to a leak in the top surface of the tank which is above the normal level of the fuel.
Since you stop boating in September, it sounds like you live in a northern climate. I don't think diurnal temperature variations could produce enough water to severely contaminate the fuel. You need a significant exchange of air above the tank every day, lots of humidity, and lots of temperature change to turn the fuel tank into a water producing machine.
Tonym posted 06-27-2010 05:47 PM ET (US)
Did you change the fuel-water separator on the boat? I am assuming there is one built into the [E-TEC] fuel system. I am not familiar with E-TEC engines. [A fuel-water separating filter] should be changed every spring. At least that [is] what I do.
Tonym
jimh posted 06-27-2010 06:42 PM ET (US)
I am familiar with E-TEC engines. An E-TEC 115-HP engine has an internal fuel filter. The fuel filter has a screw-on canister-type filter element. The recommended service interval on the fuel filter is every three years or 300 hours. The filter contains a sensor that alerts the operator if there is water in the fuel. I do not concur with the recommendation to change the internal fuel filter once every year in the Spring
I do not concur with the recommendation to change an external fuel once a year in the Spring. I would only change the filter if the pressure drop across the filter became excessive, which could occur if the filter element becomes blocked with contaminants.
I believe the goal of the discussion is to discover the method that water enters the fuel system. This is the root problem.
Phil T posted 06-27-2010 06:59 PM ET (US)
If there is a sensor for water as Jim states, why would Thom need a mechanic to tell him about it? Shouldn't an aural alarm have sounded or a message appeared on a gauge?
Thom- do you have new gauges? Do you have a water separator filter installed?
If Thom did fill the tank and then add a treatment (as stated above) that could be the problem. One needs to add the treatment before the fuel.
TC posted 07-05-2010 11:25 AM ET (US)
I agree with AZDave, you should check the fuel filler hose. I had the same problem last season with my 18 Guardian. It wasa real chore, but I haven't had a problem since.
jimh posted 07-05-2010 09:29 PM ET (US)
ASIDE to Phil: If the E-TEC engine fuel filter detects water in the fuel it sets CODE 37 in the EMM diagnostics. It sets engine diagnostic LED 3 to ON while the engine is running, and illuminates the CHECK ENGINE lamp on the System Check gauge or sends the CHECK ENGINE message to the I-Command gauge.
Again, the goal of this discussion is to discover the method by which water is entering the fuel on Thom's boat. We are trying to help Thom figure out where the water is coming from.

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Author	Topic: Water In Fuel Tank
ThomV	posted 06-26-2010 09:03 AM ET (US) I have a 17-foot OUTRAGE and have been having a horrible time with polluted gas. The boat is on a lift on a river of the Chesapeake Bay. We don't get to use it as much as we used to. Barely once a month. I re-powered it two seasons ago with an Evinrude 115-HP E-TEC, which has been great. Well, last September we went out and got a half-mile from the dock when the motor quit. A neighbor towed us back and I sent the marina to deal with the problem. He brought a 6-gallon tank and ran the boat to the ramp with it. When he got to the shop he told me there was a lot of water in the tank. He drained it treated it and all was good. One ride after that, and, due to work schedules, I didn't get back to pull the boat for the winter before the river froze so I filled the tank, treated [the fuel], and winterized on the lift. This spring, I prepared the boat for the season, after which it started right up. Next day went for a ride, and [the E-TEC engine] stalled in the same place. Polluted gas again. The real problem I believe is I think the gas in the inboard 60-gallon tank is being polluted with water. It may also have broken down some since it sat many months, although I don't have that problem with a truck that sits for months at a time without use. [Give me ideas] on how water might be getting in the tank. Could the overflow valve be allowing water in? It is well above the water on a lift so might be a bit of a reach. The other thought I have is there may be water sitting in the hull around the tank. I would appreciate any ideas you have. Thom
Martino	posted 06-26-2010 05:13 PM ET (US) Bad fuel cap seal would be high on my list. Depending on the location of the tank, that would let rain water in.
nitro vinny	posted 06-26-2010 08:21 PM ET (US) Not well versed in the fuel situation, however, I've heard much discussion on this site involving water separating from gasoline-ethanol fuel. I'm sure you'll be educated from those more educated on the subject.
AZdave	posted 06-27-2010 01:56 AM ET (US) My 18' Outrage had a badly deteriorated fuel fill hose. This is hidden in the gunwhale and deck, but I think it was the source of a gallon or more of water in the belly tank. I had symptoms similar to yours, the engine would cut out after operating normally for a period of time. This was due to sediment collecting on a filter screen in the fuel pick-up. It was worse in rough water due to the mixing of sediment with the fuel, and would resolve if the motor were stopped. The sediment would simply drop off the screen. I have new hoses and a good fuel filter. The screen is gone, and I have not had fuel issues for some time. You may have rainwater entering the tank while your boat is on its lift.
jimh	posted 06-27-2010 08:05 AM ET (US) What was the date of manufacture of the boat?
jimh	posted 06-27-2010 08:23 AM ET (US) There are three modes for water to appear in a fuel tank: --the water comes with the gasoline you buy, and you pump it right into the tank; --the tank [or some other component in the fuel system] has a leak and water leaks into the tank, but leaks are usually bi-directional and allow gasoline to leak out, too. Since gasoline has a strong vapor odor, you can usually smell the leaking gasoline; or, --the diurnal temperature variation causes some water to condense out of the air above the tank. If a retailer sells gasoline contaminated with water, they usually have more than one customer affected, and word gets around about the problem. Check with other customers of the fuel retailer to see if they got water in their gasoline. In the situation discussed here, the water appears only after the boat has sat motionless for long time. This could be due to a leak in the top surface of the tank which is above the normal level of the fuel. Since you stop boating in September, it sounds like you live in a northern climate. I don't think diurnal temperature variations could produce enough water to severely contaminate the fuel. You need a significant exchange of air above the tank every day, lots of humidity, and lots of temperature change to turn the fuel tank into a water producing machine.
Tonym	posted 06-27-2010 05:47 PM ET (US) Did you change the fuel-water separator on the boat? I am assuming there is one built into the [E-TEC] fuel system. I am not familiar with E-TEC engines. [A fuel-water separating filter] should be changed every spring. At least that [is] what I do. Tonym
jimh	posted 06-27-2010 06:42 PM ET (US) I am familiar with E-TEC engines. An E-TEC 115-HP engine has an internal fuel filter. The fuel filter has a screw-on canister-type filter element. The recommended service interval on the fuel filter is every three years or 300 hours. The filter contains a sensor that alerts the operator if there is water in the fuel. I do not concur with the recommendation to change the internal fuel filter once every year in the Spring I do not concur with the recommendation to change an external fuel once a year in the Spring. I would only change the filter if the pressure drop across the filter became excessive, which could occur if the filter element becomes blocked with contaminants. I believe the goal of the discussion is to discover the method that water enters the fuel system. This is the root problem.
Phil T	posted 06-27-2010 06:59 PM ET (US) If there is a sensor for water as Jim states, why would Thom need a mechanic to tell him about it? Shouldn't an aural alarm have sounded or a message appeared on a gauge? Thom- do you have new gauges? Do you have a water separator filter installed? If Thom did fill the tank and then add a treatment (as stated above) that could be the problem. One needs to add the treatment before the fuel.
TC	posted 07-05-2010 11:25 AM ET (US) I agree with AZDave, you should check the fuel filler hose. I had the same problem last season with my 18 Guardian. It wasa real chore, but I haven't had a problem since.
jimh	posted 07-05-2010 09:29 PM ET (US) ASIDE to Phil: If the E-TEC engine fuel filter detects water in the fuel it sets CODE 37 in the EMM diagnostics. It sets engine diagnostic LED 3 to ON while the engine is running, and illuminates the CHECK ENGINE lamp on the System Check gauge or sends the CHECK ENGINE message to the I-Command gauge. Again, the goal of this discussion is to discover the method by which water is entering the fuel on Thom's boat. We are trying to help Thom figure out where the water is coming from.