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Author Topic:   Hydraulic Steering for Single Engine

floater88 posted 09-23-2012 06:44 PM ET (US)
I'm looking into a project for the winter and would like to install hydraulic steering on my 1988 Revenge 20 W-T with a 1991 Mercury 200. Anyone with a similair boat and set up let me know of a model number or type that would be the easiest to install More worried about the steering wheel end then the motor end but any tips and info would be great. Thanks.
contender posted 09-23-2012 08:02 PM ET (US)
Best to go to the telefex hydraulic steering site and look up the cylinder number for your year and model engine, (you would think they are more universal but they are not) There are also 3 helms to chose from 9(do not remember the raios right now think they are 1.4,1.7,and maybe 2.0?) You need to get the correct cylinder number, Not hard to install but you will need two people, one to turn the steering helm while the other bleeds the system. Have some extra rags handy and an empty clean bottle to catch the over flow of oil. (you will need to purchase two pints) Make up a nice funnel so you can fill your system and go for it, its not hard. There are three types of hoses you can get, one is a hard plastic that you can cut to length and custom fit, the other are precut and measured hoses. I went with the hard plastic, cheaper and they work just fine. I then covered mine with a sprial plastic rap to protect them. The fittings were either $4 or $8 each can not remember now but you will need 4, also made need 2 90's for the hose to the cylinder. The other way to go is measure you hose lenght and go to a custom hydraulic hose place and have some made up....good luck
ericflys posted 09-23-2012 08:58 PM ET (US)
I perfer Uflex brand, seems like the seals in the helm hold up better...
Tom W Clark posted 09-23-2012 09:52 PM ET (US)
For a single Mercury 200 on a Revenge 20 Walk-Through, I recommend the Teleflex SeaStar HH5273 2.0 helm and the HC5345 front mount cylinder. As an alternative, you can also use the HC5370 side mount cylinder.
floater88 posted 09-24-2012 07:16 AM ET (US)
Thanks for the info guys. Will post pics when i'm done.
jimh posted 09-24-2012 09:21 AM ET (US)
Many Boston Whaler boats with hydraulic steering were originally rigged with a side-mount actuator, but they seem to have gone out of fashion these days, and you most commonly see a center-mount actuator.
The side-mount actuator has the advantage that the hydraulic cables do not move; they and the actuator ram are in a fixed position. The center-mount actuator moves with the engine as its pivots, and its hydraulic cables drag back and forth with the movement. The disadvantage--if any--of the side mount is the hydraulic pumping needed is asymmetrical, making the wheel take about a half-turn to one turn more in one direction than the other to move the engine to the extremes. This causes a problem for use with an auto-pilot. In actual use, I don't think a helmsman notices the slight difference in movement of the engine in one direction over the other.
The side-mount actuator makes for a cleaner installation, in my opinion, but if you are ever thinking of using an auto-pilot you will want the center-mount actuator.
Peter posted 09-24-2012 02:20 PM ET (US)
Both of my 1987 Outrage 18s came with center mount hydraulic actuators, not side mount. I don't think I ever saw a side mount actuator on a Whaler until I got my 1989 Whaler 27 WD.
andygere posted 09-24-2012 02:50 PM ET (US)
When I installed a SeaStar System on my Outrage 22 Cuddy, I ordered it from this company: www.boatstoreusa.com
They had the lowest prices I could find at the time, but more importantly, they gave great over the phone advice, and were willing to substitute the hoses I needed into one of the standard kits at no extra charge.
When deciding between a center mount vs. side mount actuator, you should note that the side mount cylinder is more exposed, and could be damaged by an unknowing swimmer who finds it to be a convenient hand hold or step while climbing into the boat. This photo of jimh's Revenge shows the actuator cylinder extending out to the left side of the outboard. http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/images/ETEC250HO/ ETEC250Transom640x475.jpg This photo of my Outrage shows the center mount actuator for comparison. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Repower/IMG_1541.jpg I have not found that the hoses moving in the splashewll to be a problem, and in six years of operation I haven't observed any noticeable wear on the hoses.
floater88 posted 09-24-2012 04:42 PM ET (US)
Great info guys. My only concern is that I have a 15 hp Kicker on the port side. Can a side mount be mounted either way?
Tom W Clark posted 09-24-2012 05:02 PM ET (US)
Yes it can but you have to remove and reverse the tilt tube.
contender posted 09-24-2012 07:58 PM ET (US)
Floater: I would think so, my have to reverse the connections but should work...
floater88 posted 09-24-2012 09:37 PM ET (US)
Ok I took a look at the Teleflex website and it looks straight forward. Thanks for tips and info.
jimh posted 09-25-2012 12:45 AM ET (US)
An important part of installation of hydraulic steering is bleeding air from the system. This can be tedious to perform, and, if a lot of hydraulic fluid is wasted, it can get expensive. But it is important to get all air from the system, otherwise the steering will be sloppy. Teleflex has new fittings they call Bleed-T's that help make bleeding the system easier and allow for recovery of the expelled fluid. Bleeding is usually the last step; don't overlook it.
floater88 posted 09-25-2012 06:54 AM ET (US)
Ok thanks Jimh. I took another look at the Teleflex site but can't find the kit number that would contain the HH5273 Helm and the HC5345 or HC5370 cylinder. I checked some other suppliers and it looks way cheaper to get a complete kit instead of separate parts. Anyone know what the kit number may be? Thanks
jimh posted 09-25-2012 07:52 AM ET (US)
I have not made study of the various models of helm pumps from Teleflex a science project, but as I recall the principal difference among them is the rate of pumping volume per turn of the wheel. The greater the volume of hydraulic fluid pumped out of the helm per turn of the wheel, the greater the distance the steering actuator will move per turn of the wheel. There is also some difference among the various actuators in the volume of hydraulic fluid needed. The result is that a certain combination of helm pump and actuator will produce a certain number of turns of the wheel lock-to-lock. I believe the notion is that on very fast boats there is some preference to have fewer turns of the wheel lock-to-lock in order that the steering of the boat be faster, that is, the helmsman won't have to turn the wheel as much to turn the boat.
L H G posted 09-25-2012 03:04 PM ET (US)
I think you want either the 6400 Kit(Sea Star I) or the 7400 Kit (Pro), which has the 2.0 helm. My choice would be the 6400, which is what Whaler has used for years for a single engine hydraulic setup. The Pro kit is for bass boats.
http://www.lowcostboatingstore.com/Hydraulic-Steering_c_9.html
floater88 posted 09-25-2012 05:27 PM ET (US)
Took another look today at the motor and the single cylinder looks like it would bolt right on. That dual one that attaches to that front arm on the motor doesn't look like it would reach that arm cus it's kinda short and doesn't stick out at all. I'm gonna go with the single cylinder. Thanks guys
andygere posted 09-25-2012 06:50 PM ET (US)
One advantage of the Pro kit is fewer turns (4.25 vs. 5) lock to lock compared to the standard kit. It also comes with kevlar reinforced hoses. It's $15 more on the site LHG referenced, a pretty nice upgrade for the money.
floater88 posted 09-25-2012 09:40 PM ET (US)
What are those numbers after the helm pump number? 1.75? 2.0? I was recommended the 2.0 for my set up. What diff would it make going bigger or smaller? Number of turns of the wheel?
Tom W Clark posted 09-25-2012 10:08 PM ET (US)
The SeaStar helm sizing is the cubic inch capacity of the helm itself, it is not a ratio. The helm is nothing but a hydraulic pump that moves fluid. The greater the capacity, the more fluid is moved per revolution of the wheel and the greater the movement of the motor per revolution of the wheel.
The SeaStar helm sizes offered by Teleflex are:
1.4 cu. in.
1.7 cu. in.
2.0 cu. in.
2.4 cu. in.
The 1.7 is by far the most common in single cylinder installations. Used with a single cylinder it takes about 5 turns of the steering wheel to go from one stop to the other.
The 2.4 was originally designed for twin motor/twin cylinder applications of high horsepower motors. It takes about 7 turns in that situation. Used with a single cylinder, it becomes a 3.5 turns lock-to-lock system.
The 1.4 was made for a while; I'm not sure they still offer it. It results in super geared-down steering and light effort but it's like driving a bus the get a course change.
For a 22 or 25 foot Whaler with a single, I'd go with the 2.0 helm which offers slightly faster steering response with very little, if any added effort. I'm planning on swapping out the 1.7 helm on my boat for a 2.0 even though I have twin 150s. I hate the slow steering of the 1.7 helm.
andygere posted 09-25-2012 10:47 PM ET (US)
I've got the 2.0 helm (standard in the Pro kit that I bought) and it's really nice. Responsive steering, especially in close quarters like getting in and out of a tight slip, and very low steering effort. It's really a smooth system, and a good fit for my Outrage 22/Evinrude 200.
floater88 posted 09-25-2012 11:11 PM ET (US)
Once again great info guys. I'm still worried about the Tiller Tag that sticks out of my 1991 Merc 200. It's looks awfully short. It looks like it's half the size of the ones on your Etecs. I'll give them a call and see what the Manufacturer sais. Thanks
L H G posted 09-26-2012 12:57 AM ET (US)
Mercury makes a tiller extension piece, with two bolts, for most steering applications. The Teleflex installation drawings for the cylinder will tell you if the Mercury part is needed.
I think the Baystar hlem is 1.4 displacement.
Tom W Clark posted 09-26-2012 11:36 AM ET (US)
The Teleflex BayStar system is NOT suitable for the 200 HP outboard. You need either a SeaStar or SeaStar PRO system.
Tom W Clark posted 09-26-2012 11:43 AM ET (US)
The tiller extension is not required for a 1991 Mercury 200. No other hardware is required.
Tom W Clark posted 09-26-2012 11:57 AM ET (US)
Here is the actual installation Manual for the SeaStar system:
http://www.teleflexmarine.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/296784-AO.pdf
Page 10 shows how a 1991 Mercury 200 would be rigged.
floater88 posted 09-26-2012 04:13 PM ET (US)
I downloaded that manual and on page ten on Figure 7a it shows my motor but the tang that part 2* bolts through is not long like that one in the pic. In figure 7B it looks like they bolted on that tang part and part 2* bolts through that. Looks like I need to get that extra bolt on piece. Thanks
Tom W Clark posted 09-26-2012 06:24 PM ET (US)
No, your motor is not shown in Figure 7a, that is a 1984-1989 Mercury.
Your 1991 Mercury is shown in the main diagram.
floater88 posted 09-26-2012 07:05 PM ET (US)
Yes but the tang [unclear] is not as long as the one shown in the diagram. In the diagram it shows it sticking out past the tilt tube and on my engine it doesn't even reach the tilt tube. On diagram 7b it shows a tang bracket bolted with two bolts; that is the part I need. I'm going to the Marina tomorrow with this picture and see if they can order me that part. Thanks
Tom W Clark posted 09-26-2012 07:10 PM ET (US)
If your steering arm does not look like this, then you don't have a 1991 Mercury 200.
http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Merc2/Mercury/V-200%20(2. 5L)%201991%20ONLY/0C291520%20THRU%200D081999/ Swivel%20Bracket(Casting%20%231499-8710-6)/parts.html
ericflys posted 09-26-2012 10:44 PM ET (US)
I'll restate what I said earlier, I think the Uflex brand is better. It is also offered with different displacement size helms. Uflex is the OEM supplier for many outboard brands steering systems, which then put their outboard brand name on it.
Both Ufelx and Teleflex are proven systems, and I'd stick to those two brands.
I think the Hynautic system was the best of all, but they were bought out by Teleflex as they were their biggest competitor.
floater88 posted 09-27-2012 05:15 PM ET (US)
Ok here are a couple of pics I took today. That diagram Tom posted is exactly what I have. My concern is how short that Steering arm is. In one of the pics you will see how it barely reaches the tilt tube. Will the Seastar Pro front mount reach that bolt hole where the steering pivot arm goes into? I checked with the Marina today and they sell an extension part that bolts onto that Steering Arm that is use in dual engine applications that will lengthen it by about 5 inches. So the point of all this is do i need to get that part or will the Seastar just bolt right on?
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o316/sterios/IMG00202-20120927-0747.jpg
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o316/sterios/IMG00201-20120927-0747.jpg
L H G posted 09-27-2012 07:00 PM ET (US)
You do not need the steering arm extension kit with any single cylinder. They are for twin engine installations.
See page 10 of the Manual linked above. The exploded drawing is a little deceptive, but if you needed that part, they would show it.
Tom W Clark posted 09-27-2012 11:54 PM ET (US)
I do not understand where the confusion is. Teleflex makes it very clear what additional parts you need: nothing.
The diagram is not a scale drawing of a 1991 Mercury 200; it is perspective drawing representative of all the parts necessary and in what order they are assembled. It covers several different brands, models and years of outboards, not just a 1991 Mercury 200.

quote:
...do i need to get that part or will the SeaStar just bolt right on?
For the third time, the SeaStar cylinder will simply bolt onto your steering arm just as your mechanical steering link does now. No additional parts are needed.
floater88 posted 09-28-2012 07:46 AM ET (US)
Ok. I took that diagram as being accurate in size and shape. I was worried about ordering one from the States and not being able to return it if it didn't fit. Thanks for all the info and tips.
L H G posted 09-28-2012 06:04 PM ET (US)
I think Teleflex hydraulic steering is a Canadian operation, based in BC.
hauptjm posted 10-03-2012 02:35 PM ET (US)
Teleflex Incorporated is headquartered in Pennsylvania.
L H G posted 10-03-2012 03:28 PM ET (US)
Here you go, Jim:
http://www.teleflexcanada.com/products.html
Marko888 posted 10-04-2012 01:08 AM ET (US)
I'm a little late to the party here, but I went through this 2 months ago.
As many have stated, the correct model Seastar cylinder should bolt straight on to your engine...*provided you buy the correct model of cylinder*
There are several versions of the cylinder, some common, some not so much.
My 3 minute research indicates you to need to HC5345 cylinder. (please confirm this for yourself) Though the other models look almost the same, they will vary dimensionally.
I ended up with an HC5345 (most common model) that my Pop got for me at a great deal... but needed an HC5348 (rare model) for my 1986 Johnson. The parts to convert from HC5345 to HC5348 were available for a reasonable price, but you cannot buy them from anyone other than a Teleflex repair centre (dealer) who can buy these parts from Teleflex here in BC. It would be way smarter/easier to get the correct cylinder from the start.
If in doubt, call Teleflex support. I did, and they were VERY helpful.
I have the 1.7 helm on an Outrage 18. The 2.0 would be better...I purchased a slightly used one for half price, but it has too many turns lock to lock...need a suicide wheel when dockside!
I'm very happy with the system overall.
Tom W Clark posted 10-04-2012 01:11 AM ET (US)
Teleflex is a huge conglomerate.
Teleflex Marine, a part of Teleflex, is a global company with locations around the globe. Their customer service is located in Litchfield, Illinois.
http://www.teleflexmarine.com/support/customer-service/
Larry is correct that Teleflex Canada, the Canadian division of Teleflex Marine, is located in Canada.
Marko888 posted 10-04-2012 02:06 PM ET (US)
The technical help I received was from Teleflex's office in Vancouver.
(604) 248-3858
floater88 posted 10-04-2012 03:16 PM ET (US)
Thanks Marko888 for the tips. I've got it narrowed down to the HK7400 Pro kit. Best price so far is about 893 bucks. Still looking.
acseatsri posted 10-05-2012 06:25 PM ET (US)
Re bleeding- the best way I've found is to buy a piece of 5/16" vinyl tubing at Hd or Lowes to put on the end of the bleeder nipple and then run it back into the helm pump- this makes it a no-mess operation that can be accomplished with 1 person.
masbama posted 10-07-2012 12:31 PM ET (US)
I recently put Sea Star steering on my 18 Dauntless.I like it but the helm started making loud clicking noises and the steering was not as easy as when first tried so they are sending a replacement helm and my guy will install it.Why is this system so expensive? It is basically the helm, a couple of hoses, the engine steering cylinder and fluid. Runs over $500.
Jefecinco posted 10-07-2012 07:01 PM ET (US)
Masbama--There is a lot of quality in that system. Having suffered a failed helm pump it may not seem like that right now. Good service and technical support also costs as well as a warranty that pays for them to send you a replacement rather than requiring you to return the original helm pump for warranty repair leaving you unable to use your Dauntless for who knows how long.
I have the same system. It was not an option with my Verado powered Whaler but having used it for a couple of years I would gladly pay more than $500 to have it.
Butch
jimh posted 10-07-2012 10:21 PM ET (US)
I don't understand why there would be an inquiry why a very nicely made hydraulic steering system--the complete system--would have to cost $500 in an age when people pay $9 for a bottle of beer, $4 for a cup of coffee, or $2 for a bottle of water.
masbama posted 10-08-2012 08:47 AM ET (US)
jimh-just asking a question.
Butch-thanks!
jimh posted 10-08-2012 12:24 PM ET (US)
You asked a rhetorical question. You really gave your opinion--that the $500 system is and expensive component of a boat. I don't think a $500 hydraulic steering system is particularly expensive in terms of boat hardware in this day and age. They are not mass produced in mass-market volume. They're something of a boutique product. The Teleflex products are generally excellent and just about the industry standard.
Tom W Clark posted 10-09-2012 12:52 PM ET (US)
Where are these SeaStar steering systems that only cost $500?
Not only is that not expensive, that is an amazing bargain; SeaStar steering systems typically sell for $800 to $1200.

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Author	Topic: Hydraulic Steering for Single Engine
floater88	posted 09-23-2012 06:44 PM ET (US) I'm looking into a project for the winter and would like to install hydraulic steering on my 1988 Revenge 20 W-T with a 1991 Mercury 200. Anyone with a similair boat and set up let me know of a model number or type that would be the easiest to install More worried about the steering wheel end then the motor end but any tips and info would be great. Thanks.
contender	posted 09-23-2012 08:02 PM ET (US) Best to go to the telefex hydraulic steering site and look up the cylinder number for your year and model engine, (you would think they are more universal but they are not) There are also 3 helms to chose from 9(do not remember the raios right now think they are 1.4,1.7,and maybe 2.0?) You need to get the correct cylinder number, Not hard to install but you will need two people, one to turn the steering helm while the other bleeds the system. Have some extra rags handy and an empty clean bottle to catch the over flow of oil. (you will need to purchase two pints) Make up a nice funnel so you can fill your system and go for it, its not hard. There are three types of hoses you can get, one is a hard plastic that you can cut to length and custom fit, the other are precut and measured hoses. I went with the hard plastic, cheaper and they work just fine. I then covered mine with a sprial plastic rap to protect them. The fittings were either $4 or $8 each can not remember now but you will need 4, also made need 2 90's for the hose to the cylinder. The other way to go is measure you hose lenght and go to a custom hydraulic hose place and have some made up....good luck
ericflys	posted 09-23-2012 08:58 PM ET (US) I perfer Uflex brand, seems like the seals in the helm hold up better...
Tom W Clark	posted 09-23-2012 09:52 PM ET (US) For a single Mercury 200 on a Revenge 20 Walk-Through, I recommend the Teleflex SeaStar HH5273 2.0 helm and the HC5345 front mount cylinder. As an alternative, you can also use the HC5370 side mount cylinder.
floater88	posted 09-24-2012 07:16 AM ET (US) Thanks for the info guys. Will post pics when i'm done.
jimh	posted 09-24-2012 09:21 AM ET (US) Many Boston Whaler boats with hydraulic steering were originally rigged with a side-mount actuator, but they seem to have gone out of fashion these days, and you most commonly see a center-mount actuator. The side-mount actuator has the advantage that the hydraulic cables do not move; they and the actuator ram are in a fixed position. The center-mount actuator moves with the engine as its pivots, and its hydraulic cables drag back and forth with the movement. The disadvantage--if any--of the side mount is the hydraulic pumping needed is asymmetrical, making the wheel take about a half-turn to one turn more in one direction than the other to move the engine to the extremes. This causes a problem for use with an auto-pilot. In actual use, I don't think a helmsman notices the slight difference in movement of the engine in one direction over the other. The side-mount actuator makes for a cleaner installation, in my opinion, but if you are ever thinking of using an auto-pilot you will want the center-mount actuator.
Peter	posted 09-24-2012 02:20 PM ET (US) Both of my 1987 Outrage 18s came with center mount hydraulic actuators, not side mount. I don't think I ever saw a side mount actuator on a Whaler until I got my 1989 Whaler 27 WD.
andygere	posted 09-24-2012 02:50 PM ET (US) When I installed a SeaStar System on my Outrage 22 Cuddy, I ordered it from this company: www.boatstoreusa.com They had the lowest prices I could find at the time, but more importantly, they gave great over the phone advice, and were willing to substitute the hoses I needed into one of the standard kits at no extra charge. When deciding between a center mount vs. side mount actuator, you should note that the side mount cylinder is more exposed, and could be damaged by an unknowing swimmer who finds it to be a convenient hand hold or step while climbing into the boat. This photo of jimh's Revenge shows the actuator cylinder extending out to the left side of the outboard. http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/images/ETEC250HO/ ETEC250Transom640x475.jpg This photo of my Outrage shows the center mount actuator for comparison. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/andygere/Repower/IMG_1541.jpg I have not found that the hoses moving in the splashewll to be a problem, and in six years of operation I haven't observed any noticeable wear on the hoses.
floater88	posted 09-24-2012 04:42 PM ET (US) Great info guys. My only concern is that I have a 15 hp Kicker on the port side. Can a side mount be mounted either way?
Tom W Clark	posted 09-24-2012 05:02 PM ET (US) Yes it can but you have to remove and reverse the tilt tube.
contender	posted 09-24-2012 07:58 PM ET (US) Floater: I would think so, my have to reverse the connections but should work...
floater88	posted 09-24-2012 09:37 PM ET (US) Ok I took a look at the Teleflex website and it looks straight forward. Thanks for tips and info.
jimh	posted 09-25-2012 12:45 AM ET (US) An important part of installation of hydraulic steering is bleeding air from the system. This can be tedious to perform, and, if a lot of hydraulic fluid is wasted, it can get expensive. But it is important to get all air from the system, otherwise the steering will be sloppy. Teleflex has new fittings they call Bleed-T's that help make bleeding the system easier and allow for recovery of the expelled fluid. Bleeding is usually the last step; don't overlook it.
floater88	posted 09-25-2012 06:54 AM ET (US) Ok thanks Jimh. I took another look at the Teleflex site but can't find the kit number that would contain the HH5273 Helm and the HC5345 or HC5370 cylinder. I checked some other suppliers and it looks way cheaper to get a complete kit instead of separate parts. Anyone know what the kit number may be? Thanks
jimh	posted 09-25-2012 07:52 AM ET (US) I have not made study of the various models of helm pumps from Teleflex a science project, but as I recall the principal difference among them is the rate of pumping volume per turn of the wheel. The greater the volume of hydraulic fluid pumped out of the helm per turn of the wheel, the greater the distance the steering actuator will move per turn of the wheel. There is also some difference among the various actuators in the volume of hydraulic fluid needed. The result is that a certain combination of helm pump and actuator will produce a certain number of turns of the wheel lock-to-lock. I believe the notion is that on very fast boats there is some preference to have fewer turns of the wheel lock-to-lock in order that the steering of the boat be faster, that is, the helmsman won't have to turn the wheel as much to turn the boat.
L H G	posted 09-25-2012 03:04 PM ET (US) I think you want either the 6400 Kit(Sea Star I) or the 7400 Kit (Pro), which has the 2.0 helm. My choice would be the 6400, which is what Whaler has used for years for a single engine hydraulic setup. The Pro kit is for bass boats. http://www.lowcostboatingstore.com/Hydraulic-Steering_c_9.html
floater88	posted 09-25-2012 05:27 PM ET (US) Took another look today at the motor and the single cylinder looks like it would bolt right on. That dual one that attaches to that front arm on the motor doesn't look like it would reach that arm cus it's kinda short and doesn't stick out at all. I'm gonna go with the single cylinder. Thanks guys
andygere	posted 09-25-2012 06:50 PM ET (US) One advantage of the Pro kit is fewer turns (4.25 vs. 5) lock to lock compared to the standard kit. It also comes with kevlar reinforced hoses. It's $15 more on the site LHG referenced, a pretty nice upgrade for the money.
floater88	posted 09-25-2012 09:40 PM ET (US) What are those numbers after the helm pump number? 1.75? 2.0? I was recommended the 2.0 for my set up. What diff would it make going bigger or smaller? Number of turns of the wheel?
Tom W Clark	posted 09-25-2012 10:08 PM ET (US) The SeaStar helm sizing is the cubic inch capacity of the helm itself, it is not a ratio. The helm is nothing but a hydraulic pump that moves fluid. The greater the capacity, the more fluid is moved per revolution of the wheel and the greater the movement of the motor per revolution of the wheel. The SeaStar helm sizes offered by Teleflex are: 1.4 cu. in. 1.7 cu. in. 2.0 cu. in. 2.4 cu. in. The 1.7 is by far the most common in single cylinder installations. Used with a single cylinder it takes about 5 turns of the steering wheel to go from one stop to the other. The 2.4 was originally designed for twin motor/twin cylinder applications of high horsepower motors. It takes about 7 turns in that situation. Used with a single cylinder, it becomes a 3.5 turns lock-to-lock system. The 1.4 was made for a while; I'm not sure they still offer it. It results in super geared-down steering and light effort but it's like driving a bus the get a course change. For a 22 or 25 foot Whaler with a single, I'd go with the 2.0 helm which offers slightly faster steering response with very little, if any added effort. I'm planning on swapping out the 1.7 helm on my boat for a 2.0 even though I have twin 150s. I hate the slow steering of the 1.7 helm.
andygere	posted 09-25-2012 10:47 PM ET (US) I've got the 2.0 helm (standard in the Pro kit that I bought) and it's really nice. Responsive steering, especially in close quarters like getting in and out of a tight slip, and very low steering effort. It's really a smooth system, and a good fit for my Outrage 22/Evinrude 200.
floater88	posted 09-25-2012 11:11 PM ET (US) Once again great info guys. I'm still worried about the Tiller Tag that sticks out of my 1991 Merc 200. It's looks awfully short. It looks like it's half the size of the ones on your Etecs. I'll give them a call and see what the Manufacturer sais. Thanks
L H G	posted 09-26-2012 12:57 AM ET (US) Mercury makes a tiller extension piece, with two bolts, for most steering applications. The Teleflex installation drawings for the cylinder will tell you if the Mercury part is needed. I think the Baystar hlem is 1.4 displacement.
Tom W Clark	posted 09-26-2012 11:36 AM ET (US) The Teleflex BayStar system is NOT suitable for the 200 HP outboard. You need either a SeaStar or SeaStar PRO system.
Tom W Clark	posted 09-26-2012 11:43 AM ET (US) The tiller extension is not required for a 1991 Mercury 200. No other hardware is required.
Tom W Clark	posted 09-26-2012 11:57 AM ET (US) Here is the actual installation Manual for the SeaStar system: http://www.teleflexmarine.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/296784-AO.pdf Page 10 shows how a 1991 Mercury 200 would be rigged.
floater88	posted 09-26-2012 04:13 PM ET (US) I downloaded that manual and on page ten on Figure 7a it shows my motor but the tang that part 2* bolts through is not long like that one in the pic. In figure 7B it looks like they bolted on that tang part and part 2* bolts through that. Looks like I need to get that extra bolt on piece. Thanks
Tom W Clark	posted 09-26-2012 06:24 PM ET (US) No, your motor is not shown in Figure 7a, that is a 1984-1989 Mercury. Your 1991 Mercury is shown in the main diagram.
floater88	posted 09-26-2012 07:05 PM ET (US) Yes but the tang [unclear] is not as long as the one shown in the diagram. In the diagram it shows it sticking out past the tilt tube and on my engine it doesn't even reach the tilt tube. On diagram 7b it shows a tang bracket bolted with two bolts; that is the part I need. I'm going to the Marina tomorrow with this picture and see if they can order me that part. Thanks
Tom W Clark	posted 09-26-2012 07:10 PM ET (US) If your steering arm does not look like this, then you don't have a 1991 Mercury 200. http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Merc2/Mercury/V-200%20(2. 5L)%201991%20ONLY/0C291520%20THRU%200D081999/ Swivel%20Bracket(Casting%20%231499-8710-6)/parts.html
ericflys	posted 09-26-2012 10:44 PM ET (US) I'll restate what I said earlier, I think the Uflex brand is better. It is also offered with different displacement size helms. Uflex is the OEM supplier for many outboard brands steering systems, which then put their outboard brand name on it. Both Ufelx and Teleflex are proven systems, and I'd stick to those two brands. I think the Hynautic system was the best of all, but they were bought out by Teleflex as they were their biggest competitor.
floater88	posted 09-27-2012 05:15 PM ET (US) Ok here are a couple of pics I took today. That diagram Tom posted is exactly what I have. My concern is how short that Steering arm is. In one of the pics you will see how it barely reaches the tilt tube. Will the Seastar Pro front mount reach that bolt hole where the steering pivot arm goes into? I checked with the Marina today and they sell an extension part that bolts onto that Steering Arm that is use in dual engine applications that will lengthen it by about 5 inches. So the point of all this is do i need to get that part or will the Seastar just bolt right on? http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o316/sterios/IMG00202-20120927-0747.jpg http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o316/sterios/IMG00201-20120927-0747.jpg
L H G	posted 09-27-2012 07:00 PM ET (US) You do not need the steering arm extension kit with any single cylinder. They are for twin engine installations. See page 10 of the Manual linked above. The exploded drawing is a little deceptive, but if you needed that part, they would show it.
Tom W Clark	posted 09-27-2012 11:54 PM ET (US) I do not understand where the confusion is. Teleflex makes it very clear what additional parts you need: nothing. The diagram is not a scale drawing of a 1991 Mercury 200; it is perspective drawing representative of all the parts necessary and in what order they are assembled. It covers several different brands, models and years of outboards, not just a 1991 Mercury 200. quote: ...do i need to get that part or will the SeaStar just bolt right on? For the third time, the SeaStar cylinder will simply bolt onto your steering arm just as your mechanical steering link does now. No additional parts are needed.
floater88	posted 09-28-2012 07:46 AM ET (US) Ok. I took that diagram as being accurate in size and shape. I was worried about ordering one from the States and not being able to return it if it didn't fit. Thanks for all the info and tips.
L H G	posted 09-28-2012 06:04 PM ET (US) I think Teleflex hydraulic steering is a Canadian operation, based in BC.
hauptjm	posted 10-03-2012 02:35 PM ET (US) Teleflex Incorporated is headquartered in Pennsylvania.
L H G	posted 10-03-2012 03:28 PM ET (US) Here you go, Jim: http://www.teleflexcanada.com/products.html
Marko888	posted 10-04-2012 01:08 AM ET (US) I'm a little late to the party here, but I went through this 2 months ago. As many have stated, the correct model Seastar cylinder should bolt straight on to your engine...provided you buy the correct model of cylinder There are several versions of the cylinder, some common, some not so much. My 3 minute research indicates you to need to HC5345 cylinder. (please confirm this for yourself) Though the other models look almost the same, they will vary dimensionally. I ended up with an HC5345 (most common model) that my Pop got for me at a great deal... but needed an HC5348 (rare model) for my 1986 Johnson. The parts to convert from HC5345 to HC5348 were available for a reasonable price, but you cannot buy them from anyone other than a Teleflex repair centre (dealer) who can buy these parts from Teleflex here in BC. It would be way smarter/easier to get the correct cylinder from the start. If in doubt, call Teleflex support. I did, and they were VERY helpful. I have the 1.7 helm on an Outrage 18. The 2.0 would be better...I purchased a slightly used one for half price, but it has too many turns lock to lock...need a suicide wheel when dockside! I'm very happy with the system overall.
Tom W Clark	posted 10-04-2012 01:11 AM ET (US) Teleflex is a huge conglomerate. Teleflex Marine, a part of Teleflex, is a global company with locations around the globe. Their customer service is located in Litchfield, Illinois. http://www.teleflexmarine.com/support/customer-service/ Larry is correct that Teleflex Canada, the Canadian division of Teleflex Marine, is located in Canada.
Marko888	posted 10-04-2012 02:06 PM ET (US) The technical help I received was from Teleflex's office in Vancouver. (604) 248-3858
floater88	posted 10-04-2012 03:16 PM ET (US) Thanks Marko888 for the tips. I've got it narrowed down to the HK7400 Pro kit. Best price so far is about 893 bucks. Still looking.
acseatsri	posted 10-05-2012 06:25 PM ET (US) Re bleeding- the best way I've found is to buy a piece of 5/16" vinyl tubing at Hd or Lowes to put on the end of the bleeder nipple and then run it back into the helm pump- this makes it a no-mess operation that can be accomplished with 1 person.
masbama	posted 10-07-2012 12:31 PM ET (US) I recently put Sea Star steering on my 18 Dauntless.I like it but the helm started making loud clicking noises and the steering was not as easy as when first tried so they are sending a replacement helm and my guy will install it.Why is this system so expensive? It is basically the helm, a couple of hoses, the engine steering cylinder and fluid. Runs over $500.
Jefecinco	posted 10-07-2012 07:01 PM ET (US) Masbama--There is a lot of quality in that system. Having suffered a failed helm pump it may not seem like that right now. Good service and technical support also costs as well as a warranty that pays for them to send you a replacement rather than requiring you to return the original helm pump for warranty repair leaving you unable to use your Dauntless for who knows how long. I have the same system. It was not an option with my Verado powered Whaler but having used it for a couple of years I would gladly pay more than $500 to have it. Butch
jimh	posted 10-07-2012 10:21 PM ET (US) I don't understand why there would be an inquiry why a very nicely made hydraulic steering system--the complete system--would have to cost $500 in an age when people pay $9 for a bottle of beer, $4 for a cup of coffee, or $2 for a bottle of water.
masbama	posted 10-08-2012 08:47 AM ET (US) jimh-just asking a question. Butch-thanks!
jimh	posted 10-08-2012 12:24 PM ET (US) You asked a rhetorical question. You really gave your opinion--that the $500 system is and expensive component of a boat. I don't think a $500 hydraulic steering system is particularly expensive in terms of boat hardware in this day and age. They are not mass produced in mass-market volume. They're something of a boutique product. The Teleflex products are generally excellent and just about the industry standard.
Tom W Clark	posted 10-09-2012 12:52 PM ET (US) Where are these SeaStar steering systems that only cost $500? Not only is that not expensive, that is an amazing bargain; SeaStar steering systems typically sell for $800 to $1200.