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Author Topic:   Trailer winch for Outrage 22 Cuddy

andygere posted 03-08-2013 03:20 PM ET (US)
It's time to replace my current trailer winch, which is an off brand copy of the Fulton winch originally installed on my galvanized EZ loader bunk trailer. I noticed some deformity in the spool that I'm not comfortable with, so I plan to replace it with a better unit.
First, what is the appropriate rating for this application? I estimate a 2000 or 2500 lb will be required.
Second, which brand and style will perform the best? Dutton- Lainson and Fulton appear to be among the better made winches, are there others recommended?
I have a two-speed model now, and will definitely purchase a two-speed replacement. The choices seem to be either a direct drive model (where the crank handle is moved from one axle to the other to change the ratio) but most of the winches I've seen are the self locking type, where the drive axle can be engaged with either of two gear sets to change the ratio. The link below shows the direct drive style made by DL.
http://www.etrailer.com/Winches/Dutton-Lainson/DL14825.html
Pros and cons of these two styles? Another unit I'm considering is the self locking Fulton referenced below. Does anybody have experience with this brand and model?
http://www.easternmarine.com/fulton-t2005z-winch-with-strap-t2005z0101
I'm open to all suggestions and recommendations. I don't trailer the boat often, but when I do, I'm frequently by myself. My 4-bunk trailer allows me to drive the boat most of the way on at most ramps, and I typically crank only the last 2 or 3 feet of the retrieval. At a very low tide, it may be as much as 5 or 6 feet.
contender posted 03-08-2013 05:52 PM ET (US)
The best winch I have found (and I know the ones you have mention/talking about) is a Shelby, by Shelby Industries, still made in the USA (I think Kansas) and I think you can get one up to 3500 lbs., 1-2-3 speeds winches. I have/own two 2500 lbs 2 speeds winches, one I made my own electric winch by using a 1953 Ford starter motor (has a ex long shaft and no electric solenoid attached) with a remote switch, puts the boat on the trailer in about 15 seconds, I can run the winch in both speeds and still use a handle if needed. Trust me on this one...Good luck
L H G posted 03-08-2013 06:53 PM ET (US)
I use 2-speed 2500lb Dutton-Lainson, and use the 10,000lb yellow strap. I like the removable handle and they don't have that noisy clutch stop lever, which is never used.
andygere posted 03-09-2013 12:26 AM ET (US)
Larry, how does the crank attach? Do you remove it after loading the boat, or does it stay on the winch?
Contender, the Shelby winches look good, I haven't seen them before. Did you buy direct from the company?
Tom W Clark posted 03-09-2013 10:04 AM ET (US)
I have used Dutton-Lainson, Fulton and Shelby winches through the years. They are all good products.
What size winch you need depends more on how your trailer is set up than on the size of your boat. My Load-Rite galvanized trailer still has its original winch from 1990. It is a huge two speed thing that I never use the low gear on.
In fact, with my Stoltz keel rollers, I rarely ever use more than about 6 feet of the winch strap and could probably get away with a little 1200 pound single speed winch.
Virtually all two speed winches use the quick disconnect winch handles because the theory is that you will need to switch from one speed to the next and to do that you move the handle from one gear to the other.
These handles have a spring-loaded retainer that works fairly well. They get sometimes get stolen in parking lots so a lot of guys get in the habit of not leaving them on their winches. I've never had that problem, knock wood.
contender posted 03-09-2013 01:55 PM ET (US)
Andy, I can not remember were I got my 1st Shelby winch, needed another one and some parts to make my electric winch and I spoke to them at the warehouse out in the west, I think I purchase the 2nd winch from directly from them. very nice people...The winch handle on the Shelby requires an aircraft nut to tighten on to the shaft, the winch speed is changed by moving the center gear to another drive gear. The only difference is when you change gears you have to turn the handle in a different direction.
andygere posted 03-12-2013 05:04 PM ET (US)
Does anybody have input on the corrosion resistance of any of these brands?
Fulton claims "Zinc plating provides superior corrosion resistance. "
DL claims "Zinc plated yellow chromate TUFFPLATE finish has three times the corrosion resistance of standard zinc plated trivalent chrome process and 30 percent greater corrosion resistance when compared to powder coated finish. Results of lab test using 5 percent neutral salt spray confirms our TUFFPLATE finish provides in excess of 500 hours against First Red Rust and in excess of 100 hours of First White Corrosion."
Shelby Industries simply says "2300# Winch, Narrow Reel, 20' Strap Installed, Zinc"
Regular zinc plated hardware rusts almost instantly in a marine environment, and is typically a very thin coating. Hot-dipped galvanizing is much more robust, but it looks like the major manufacturers aren't using this anymore. DL's TUFFPLATE sounds a bit better, offering 3x the almost non-existent corrosion protection of standard zinc plating. I keep my current off-brand winch under a canvas cover, and it's still rusting away in my driveway. It's parked about 200 yards from the ocean, so it's in a marine environment all the time.
jimp posted 03-13-2013 09:47 AM ET (US)
I went with a Powerwinch. With the steep launch ramps here I used to crank between 135 and 145 cranks to get my 1990 Revenge 22 - W.T. up. That got the heart pumping and the arms in shape. Left arm, take the slack out. Right arm until taut and a strain. Left arm until tired, Both arms until done. At the start of the season I couldn't do it all at once, but towards the end of the season, no stopping, all 145 in one go.
Anyway, the best gift I ever received for the boat. Though I do strain my thumb sometimes holding down the lever.
The differences from my application to yours is that I trailer the boat every weekend and yours stays in the water and you launch a few times a year.
Before the Powerwinch I had a 2-speed Fulton that worked fine, but I only used one speed. Well positioned, free running keel rollers make a big difference too. As Tom W says, they're all good products.
JimP
contender posted 03-15-2013 07:28 PM ET (US)
Andy: change of the times the companies are giving you the cheaper bolts to save money, go out and get some galvanize ones, also get a can of LPS #3 and coat the winch/cable with it, will never rust.
As Jimp stated he went with a powerwinch, This is why I made my own. The problem with the power winch is the motor goes out its the biggest pain in the a$$ to winch your boat on the trailer. (Try it once Jim) Also the motor is small and can over heat depending on the load. I used a car starter and I'm able to use a handle as well if the starter does not work...To each there own
jimp posted 03-15-2013 08:27 PM ET (US)
Contender -
I hear you. I keep my old winch in the back of the truck with a set of wrenches during boating season. The Powerwinch has been great for the past 6 years while my shoulders have not been great!
And one correction, it was a 2-speed Shelby.
JimP
Russ 13 posted 03-15-2013 09:37 PM ET (US)
I have had good luck with the Shelby's, I like the solid handle mount, as the gear change is done by moving the
shaft that the handle attaches too.
Well built & solid, they seem to withstand salt well also.
andygere posted 03-17-2013 03:35 PM ET (US)
Thanks for the input guys, I'm sticking with a manual winch because I don't use the trailer that much, and my local ramp lets me float the boat most of the way on.

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Author	Topic: Trailer winch for Outrage 22 Cuddy
andygere	posted 03-08-2013 03:20 PM ET (US) It's time to replace my current trailer winch, which is an off brand copy of the Fulton winch originally installed on my galvanized EZ loader bunk trailer. I noticed some deformity in the spool that I'm not comfortable with, so I plan to replace it with a better unit. First, what is the appropriate rating for this application? I estimate a 2000 or 2500 lb will be required. Second, which brand and style will perform the best? Dutton- Lainson and Fulton appear to be among the better made winches, are there others recommended? I have a two-speed model now, and will definitely purchase a two-speed replacement. The choices seem to be either a direct drive model (where the crank handle is moved from one axle to the other to change the ratio) but most of the winches I've seen are the self locking type, where the drive axle can be engaged with either of two gear sets to change the ratio. The link below shows the direct drive style made by DL. http://www.etrailer.com/Winches/Dutton-Lainson/DL14825.html Pros and cons of these two styles? Another unit I'm considering is the self locking Fulton referenced below. Does anybody have experience with this brand and model? http://www.easternmarine.com/fulton-t2005z-winch-with-strap-t2005z0101 I'm open to all suggestions and recommendations. I don't trailer the boat often, but when I do, I'm frequently by myself. My 4-bunk trailer allows me to drive the boat most of the way on at most ramps, and I typically crank only the last 2 or 3 feet of the retrieval. At a very low tide, it may be as much as 5 or 6 feet.
contender	posted 03-08-2013 05:52 PM ET (US) The best winch I have found (and I know the ones you have mention/talking about) is a Shelby, by Shelby Industries, still made in the USA (I think Kansas) and I think you can get one up to 3500 lbs., 1-2-3 speeds winches. I have/own two 2500 lbs 2 speeds winches, one I made my own electric winch by using a 1953 Ford starter motor (has a ex long shaft and no electric solenoid attached) with a remote switch, puts the boat on the trailer in about 15 seconds, I can run the winch in both speeds and still use a handle if needed. Trust me on this one...Good luck
L H G	posted 03-08-2013 06:53 PM ET (US) I use 2-speed 2500lb Dutton-Lainson, and use the 10,000lb yellow strap. I like the removable handle and they don't have that noisy clutch stop lever, which is never used.
andygere	posted 03-09-2013 12:26 AM ET (US) Larry, how does the crank attach? Do you remove it after loading the boat, or does it stay on the winch? Contender, the Shelby winches look good, I haven't seen them before. Did you buy direct from the company?
Tom W Clark	posted 03-09-2013 10:04 AM ET (US) I have used Dutton-Lainson, Fulton and Shelby winches through the years. They are all good products. What size winch you need depends more on how your trailer is set up than on the size of your boat. My Load-Rite galvanized trailer still has its original winch from 1990. It is a huge two speed thing that I never use the low gear on. In fact, with my Stoltz keel rollers, I rarely ever use more than about 6 feet of the winch strap and could probably get away with a little 1200 pound single speed winch. Virtually all two speed winches use the quick disconnect winch handles because the theory is that you will need to switch from one speed to the next and to do that you move the handle from one gear to the other. These handles have a spring-loaded retainer that works fairly well. They get sometimes get stolen in parking lots so a lot of guys get in the habit of not leaving them on their winches. I've never had that problem, knock wood.
contender	posted 03-09-2013 01:55 PM ET (US) Andy, I can not remember were I got my 1st Shelby winch, needed another one and some parts to make my electric winch and I spoke to them at the warehouse out in the west, I think I purchase the 2nd winch from directly from them. very nice people...The winch handle on the Shelby requires an aircraft nut to tighten on to the shaft, the winch speed is changed by moving the center gear to another drive gear. The only difference is when you change gears you have to turn the handle in a different direction.
andygere	posted 03-12-2013 05:04 PM ET (US) Does anybody have input on the corrosion resistance of any of these brands? Fulton claims "Zinc plating provides superior corrosion resistance. " DL claims "Zinc plated yellow chromate TUFFPLATE finish has three times the corrosion resistance of standard zinc plated trivalent chrome process and 30 percent greater corrosion resistance when compared to powder coated finish. Results of lab test using 5 percent neutral salt spray confirms our TUFFPLATE finish provides in excess of 500 hours against First Red Rust and in excess of 100 hours of First White Corrosion." Shelby Industries simply says "2300# Winch, Narrow Reel, 20' Strap Installed, Zinc" Regular zinc plated hardware rusts almost instantly in a marine environment, and is typically a very thin coating. Hot-dipped galvanizing is much more robust, but it looks like the major manufacturers aren't using this anymore. DL's TUFFPLATE sounds a bit better, offering 3x the almost non-existent corrosion protection of standard zinc plating. I keep my current off-brand winch under a canvas cover, and it's still rusting away in my driveway. It's parked about 200 yards from the ocean, so it's in a marine environment all the time.
jimp	posted 03-13-2013 09:47 AM ET (US) I went with a Powerwinch. With the steep launch ramps here I used to crank between 135 and 145 cranks to get my 1990 Revenge 22 - W.T. up. That got the heart pumping and the arms in shape. Left arm, take the slack out. Right arm until taut and a strain. Left arm until tired, Both arms until done. At the start of the season I couldn't do it all at once, but towards the end of the season, no stopping, all 145 in one go. Anyway, the best gift I ever received for the boat. Though I do strain my thumb sometimes holding down the lever. The differences from my application to yours is that I trailer the boat every weekend and yours stays in the water and you launch a few times a year. Before the Powerwinch I had a 2-speed Fulton that worked fine, but I only used one speed. Well positioned, free running keel rollers make a big difference too. As Tom W says, they're all good products. JimP
contender	posted 03-15-2013 07:28 PM ET (US) Andy: change of the times the companies are giving you the cheaper bolts to save money, go out and get some galvanize ones, also get a can of LPS #3 and coat the winch/cable with it, will never rust. As Jimp stated he went with a powerwinch, This is why I made my own. The problem with the power winch is the motor goes out its the biggest pain in the a$$ to winch your boat on the trailer. (Try it once Jim) Also the motor is small and can over heat depending on the load. I used a car starter and I'm able to use a handle as well if the starter does not work...To each there own
jimp	posted 03-15-2013 08:27 PM ET (US) Contender - I hear you. I keep my old winch in the back of the truck with a set of wrenches during boating season. The Powerwinch has been great for the past 6 years while my shoulders have not been great! And one correction, it was a 2-speed Shelby. JimP
Russ 13	posted 03-15-2013 09:37 PM ET (US) I have had good luck with the Shelby's, I like the solid handle mount, as the gear change is done by moving the shaft that the handle attaches too. Well built & solid, they seem to withstand salt well also.
andygere	posted 03-17-2013 03:35 PM ET (US) Thanks for the input guys, I'm sticking with a manual winch because I don't use the trailer that much, and my local ramp lets me float the boat most of the way on.