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Author Topic:   Snapped Trailer Tongue

jimp posted 07-07-2013 11:11 AM ET (US)
After a few hours of boating Saturday afternoon, it was time to go home. I loaded my 1990 Revenge 22 - W.T. and headed down the short road from the launch ramp to the main road. The road was "under construction" with three small one-lane Bailey bridges with very rough approaches http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bailey_bridge
I was on the approach to the first, going through some pot holes at about 10-mph, when there was suddenly a big lurch and grinding sound. The "Kelsey J" was suddenly lower in the rear view mirror. I stopped in the middle of the bridge (only about 50-ft long), not much choice, to survey the situation.
The tongue tube had snapped at the forward end of the winch stand, 3/4 of the way around (only connected on the top). V-shaped, still connected to the truck, but the area by the wind stand on the ground. I was blocking the bridge and had to get off, so with two folks, who had stopped, I slowly dragged the trailer 100-yards to the side of the road.
Now what to do? Another guy stopped (owns the local glass company where I buy glass) and said, "I live just up the road, I'll get a jack." I couldn't use the jack stand on the boat as it was on the tongue and the tongue was on the ground. He came back and we jacked up the front end of the trailer to get the tongue straight again, blocked it up and got the trailer hitch off the truck. Looks like I needed major repairs, and Russ said that the only guy he knew that might be around to do some welding on a Saturday afternoon was Sherm, so he called (from his house as there was no cell service) and left a message. I drove 20 miles home to get some tools, figuring I'd take the tongue off and have it available for repairs. So home and back, getting to the boat at 4:30 PM. I removed the PowerWinch, jack stand, winch stand and wiring (cut it). I got the tongue off (Break-Free and propane torch without shearing any bolts) then on the way home I stopped by Sherm's welding shop at 6 PM - and the doors were open! Sherm said, "Well I expect you want me to do this now? I got a 2-month backlog." Not much I could say as he lifted the 7-1/2 foot tongue out of the back of the truck and set to work. 1 hour and $105 later, he had it welded up.
Back to the boat 20-miles away to put everything together which went better than expected. Finally got home at 9 PM with the boat. But through this all, it was still daylight as sunset in Juneau is 10 PM.
What are the chances of finding a welding shop open at 6 PM on a Saturday night?
I don't want to think of what would have happened at highway speed.
JimP
dfmcintyre posted 07-07-2013 12:12 PM ET (US)
Jim -
Any chance of posting some links to images of the break?
Thanks- Don
dfmcintyre posted 07-07-2013 12:13 PM ET (US)
And....any conclusions on what was the underlying reason it snapped?
Regards - Don
swist posted 07-07-2013 12:23 PM ET (US)
I'm wondering if the weight distribution was correct. I can lift my trailer tongue off the ground (more typically off the hitch ball) under my own power. Too much weight on the tongue might stress it over time.
Jerry Townsend posted 07-07-2013 01:27 PM ET (US)
JimP - You were lucky - as you know. A commercial welding shop being open at that hour is rare. Now, had you been closer, you could have brought it over to my home any time. But $105 is not that bad - assuming it was a good repair.
Check the tongue weight - it should be between 5 and 10 percent of the total trailer weight. You might have a bit more and I would suspect that might be the case. The reason is that the bending stresses will be pretty high in the region of the tongue that failed.
I suspect that your trailer is a tandem - but hitting chuck-holes puts a impact load on vehicles and trailers.
There is good information regarding tongue weight and adjusting the tongue weight in the CW reference section.
Your tongue may have been weakened by someone drilling holes.
If I were repairing such a weakened tongue - I would consider welding two pieces of 2 x 2 x 1/4 angle iron and as long as possible - say 2 -3 feet - on the bottom and sides of the damaged tongue.
jimp posted 07-07-2013 01:39 PM ET (US)
Good points, all.
I don't have a scale to weigh the tongue, but my guess is in the 10% range of 400 pounds (I can't lift it). I have a long tongue due to the pulpit on the Revenge. Right now I'm going to move the boat about 4" farther back due to the u-bolts for the winch stand not fitting over the repair.
The trailer is 22 years old.
The repair included welding the break on three sides and adding 6" of 1/4" angle iron and plate on the three cracked sides.
No pictures of the break.
Stress over the years, heavy tongue weight, and extra long tongue contributed.
JimP
Jerry Townsend posted 07-07-2013 04:46 PM ET (US)
Jim - careful in your adjustments. Moving the axle 4 inches can cause a big change. Too light of a tongue load can cause the trailer to sway. Consider using the information JimH has in the CW reference section. --- Jerry/Idaho
jimp posted 07-07-2013 05:25 PM ET (US)
Thanks, Jerry. WILCO.
Didn't move the axle, just the winch stand 4" back, couldn't go forward.
Is there a potential problem with the last 6 inches of transom not having bunks under it?
JimP
Jerry Townsend posted 07-07-2013 07:15 PM ET (US)
Jim - The controlling item is the location of the c/g of the boat relative to the axle and the hitch. That is, moving the boat back 4 inches puts more load on the axle(s) and less on the hitch. And it is conceivable where a 4 inch move would put the entire load on the axle(s). Want to be careful.
In general, it is much preferred to have the transom supported by the bunks - as that is where the weight is engine(s) is concentrated. And here too - there is a lot of information/comments/posts regarding supporting of the transom in the reference section.
Consider having a welding shop modify your winch stand. ---- Jerry/Idaho
jimp posted 07-07-2013 07:35 PM ET (US)
Jerry -
Looks like lots of work coming... I tried to lift the tongue, glued to the ground. Got my young, muscular, 27-yr old neighbor - glued to the ground. Got his strong friend, "Hey, I think it moved!" Figure if each of us could lift 200-pounds, the tongue weight has to be over 600-pounds, minimum, way too much.
I'll read the trailer section thoroughly. The other concern is now the trailer hitch on the rear of the 1995 Ford F-350, it's been on there for 17-years and a bit of rust is showing.
Thanks for direction.
JimP
Jerry Townsend posted 07-07-2013 08:45 PM ET (US)
Jim - I agree, the heavy tongue weight suggests the boat be moved back a bit. But not knowing the weights (tongue, trailer, and boat) means that you have to do it via trial and error.
Not knowing the weights is not insurmountable. You can get an approximate weight of the boat and engine from the manufacturers and make a few educated guesses on the trailer. I will help you as possible. But getting a hitch load would help.
But, it is about time to get a new pickup and hitch - my gosh, those '95 Fords only last so long. But aside from that jab, keep your pickup - and forget the rust on the hitch. Take a wire brush and clean the hitch up as possible and spray some WD-40 - a good rust pentetrator and inhibitor - on it. ---- Jerry/Idaho
jimp posted 07-07-2013 09:12 PM ET (US)
Jerry -
Thanks, again. I'm reading the trailer articles now. Loaded boat & engine I'm estimating 4,000 pounds which is close to what others have gotten. Include the trailer too? Another 1,000.
Get rid of my 1995 Ford F-350 crewcab PowerStroke diesel with only 59,000 miles on it? Not even broken in yet! Though the right rear window switch needs replacement.
JimP
L H G posted 07-08-2013 01:52 AM ET (US)
Jim - It ACTAULLY DID happen to me at 60 MPH and the four of us in the car are lucky to be here today. I was towing my Outrage 18, in the center lane of I-94 in northern IN, going around the bottom of Lake Michigan to get to Traverse City up north in the State. Add in 4th of July start of weekend traffic on one of the busiest roads in the country.
It was 24 years ago almost to the day.
The painted E-Z-Loader trailer was only three years old and had come with the boat when I bought it new. The tongue completely separated from the trailer at the point where the side frames attach, completely rusted through.
The boat started fishtailing wildly, and the traffic to my right gave me room to pull over and get to the shoulder. The boat, still firmly connected at the bow stop, and the stern tie downs, literally held the trailer together. Upon examination, I couldn't believe they made this trailer with such thin walled tubing. Cheap, Cheap.
No matter how good a welder you may have found, your trailer should have a NEW heavy wall 3 x 4 or 3 x 5 galvanized tongue installed. There is now way I would ever trust welding work on a member under that kind of bending stress, which is probably on a tongue with thin wall tubing to begin with, and likely to fail elsewhere. Just do it.
You might also want to get a new trailer. That's what I did after I had a new tongue installed. No more E-Z-Loaders for me! Never.

domlynch posted 07-08-2013 06:35 AM ET (US)
Scary stuff Gents - very fortunate nothing worse happened.
The worst I've had was a wheel bearing failure (caused by myself not knowing how to replace a bearing properly - I've certainly learnt since)- on that occasion I saw the outer face of the wheel/tyre well outside of the mud guard - and did not feel/hear anything unusual - lucky I checked the mirrors & was able to pull aside
We all need to be vigilant.....
swist posted 07-08-2013 08:35 AM ET (US)
Another issue is that the handling of both the trailer and the toll vehicle, *particularly* emergency handling, are compromised if the trailer weight distribution is wrong.
swist posted 07-08-2013 08:36 AM ET (US)
It may be early in the morning, but I don't see how I can type two l's instead of one w. Musta been the cat.
Jerry Townsend posted 07-09-2013 10:57 PM ET (US)
Jim - I have taken your numbers, scaled some information from the Cetacea photos and made a couple of WAGs - and your 600 pound tongue weight is about right. And with a 5000 lb total weight, that is a good hitch load. While the 600 pounds sounds like a lot - you have a lot of boat.
Just repair/replace the tongue and you should be good. --- Jerry/Idaho
jimh posted 07-10-2013 07:09 AM ET (US)
JimP and I have similar boats. I have weighed my boat and trailer and deduced the tongue weight. See
http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/016667.html
The tongue weight was 8.2-percent. I don't think boat trailers need the usually recommended 10-percent tongue weight. Boat trailers tend to have a lower center of gravity and less windage than travel trailers.
My 21-year old E-Z-Loader galvanized steel trailer shows no sign of rust.
jimp posted 07-10-2013 10:00 AM ET (US)
Jerry/JimH - Thanks.
The 22 year old trailer shows no or very little rust. It gets a feshwater washdown EVERYTME it gets dunked insalt water. I have never dunked the tongue in salt water.
EZLoader says the trailer is rated at 4,000 pounds.
JimH - does your Whalerdrive have off the trailer or is it supported?
JimP
jimh posted 07-10-2013 10:42 AM ET (US)
Only the hull is supported by the trailer. The Whaler Drive hangs off the back without support. You can't really support the Whaler Drive on a trailer and still be able to launch in the conventional way, unless you made the Whaler Drive support removable or retractable.
jimp posted 07-10-2013 10:49 AM ET (US)
JimP
My neighbor across the street has a 23' Parker with a bracket (similar to the Whalerdrive) hanging off the stern. Won't that move the center of gravity aft and lighten the tongue load and why "ContinuousWave" has a lighter tongue load than me?
JimP
Plotman posted 07-10-2013 11:04 AM ET (US)
Instead of moving the boat, which may or may not be easy, depending on how your trailer is set up, I'd suggest you look at moving the axles forward or back.
The last trailer I had, the spring hangers were welded to angle iron pieces that could be moved forward and aft relative to the main frame of the trailer. There were holes drilled about every 4 inches to allow you to select the desired position.
It was a matter of removing 4 bolts and then adjusting the carriage as you desired.
I simply lowered the tongue, blocked the rear corners of the trailer, then raised the tongue again to take the weight off the running gear, and I could move it easily.
Took all of 10 minutes.
On my current trailer it was easier to move the winch stand.
jimp posted 07-10-2013 11:13 AM ET (US)
Plotman -
You must have anewer trailer or one that was set up by the manufacturer to make it easy to move the carriage.
My EZLoader was the bunks/rollers attached to the axle setup requiring a lot of work with old rusty bolts.
JimP
Jerry Townsend posted 07-10-2013 12:42 PM ET (US)
JimP -- indeed the Whaler drive will move the cg aft and lighten the tongue load.
The location of the cg relative to the axles is a key dimension - but may not be all that sensitive depending on the other dimensions/weights. ---- Jerry/Idaho
Jerry Townsend posted 07-10-2013 01:03 PM ET (US)
Interestingly - JimH normally, as I recall, transports with his boat's fuel tank about empty - whereas JimP typically has his fuel tanks relatively full (about 70 gallons).
I made a new calculation decreasing the weight by 300 pounds accounting for about 50 gallons of fuel difference - and the hitch load dropped from 647 to about 618 - not much change. ---- Jerry/Idaho
jimp posted 07-28-2013 09:07 PM ET (US)
The tongue has been replaced.
Ordered a new, heavy gauge (.188" wall thickness versus the .125" original) for $300. EZLoader shipped it to Seattle for $40 and then north by barge for another $72. Got here Friday, started measuring and drilling holes. Installed today. New tongue weight approximately 500 pound versus the old ~640.
To get the reduced tongue weight, with Jerry Townsend's calculations, I moved the carriage/chassis 7.9" forward. This was done by:
1. Putting penetrating oil on all the old chassis bolts that hadn't been moved in 21 years. Then let the penetrating oil work overnight. They all came free without much effort. Freshwater washdowns of the trailer after every dunking helped.
2. Blocking up the boat as much as possible using the tongue jack and getting the weight off the bunks and rollers.
3. Disconnecting the forward end of the four bunks as the rear of the bunks is attached to the rear crossmember and the forward end attached to the chassis.
4. Then using a come-along (that was useless) then the jackstand's PowerWinch and a chain attached midway on the chassis (between the two axles). Put some tension on the chain, then persuaded the cross member with a mall. Slow at first, then better.
Any, tongue installed, lights reconnected, and it's time to go fishing.
Thanks very much to JimH and ContinuousWave, you guys for your thoughts, and Jerry/Idaho for his calculations and guidance.
JimP

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Author	Topic: Snapped Trailer Tongue
jimp	posted 07-07-2013 11:11 AM ET (US) After a few hours of boating Saturday afternoon, it was time to go home. I loaded my 1990 Revenge 22 - W.T. and headed down the short road from the launch ramp to the main road. The road was "under construction" with three small one-lane Bailey bridges with very rough approaches http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bailey_bridge I was on the approach to the first, going through some pot holes at about 10-mph, when there was suddenly a big lurch and grinding sound. The "Kelsey J" was suddenly lower in the rear view mirror. I stopped in the middle of the bridge (only about 50-ft long), not much choice, to survey the situation. The tongue tube had snapped at the forward end of the winch stand, 3/4 of the way around (only connected on the top). V-shaped, still connected to the truck, but the area by the wind stand on the ground. I was blocking the bridge and had to get off, so with two folks, who had stopped, I slowly dragged the trailer 100-yards to the side of the road. Now what to do? Another guy stopped (owns the local glass company where I buy glass) and said, "I live just up the road, I'll get a jack." I couldn't use the jack stand on the boat as it was on the tongue and the tongue was on the ground. He came back and we jacked up the front end of the trailer to get the tongue straight again, blocked it up and got the trailer hitch off the truck. Looks like I needed major repairs, and Russ said that the only guy he knew that might be around to do some welding on a Saturday afternoon was Sherm, so he called (from his house as there was no cell service) and left a message. I drove 20 miles home to get some tools, figuring I'd take the tongue off and have it available for repairs. So home and back, getting to the boat at 4:30 PM. I removed the PowerWinch, jack stand, winch stand and wiring (cut it). I got the tongue off (Break-Free and propane torch without shearing any bolts) then on the way home I stopped by Sherm's welding shop at 6 PM - and the doors were open! Sherm said, "Well I expect you want me to do this now? I got a 2-month backlog." Not much I could say as he lifted the 7-1/2 foot tongue out of the back of the truck and set to work. 1 hour and $105 later, he had it welded up. Back to the boat 20-miles away to put everything together which went better than expected. Finally got home at 9 PM with the boat. But through this all, it was still daylight as sunset in Juneau is 10 PM. What are the chances of finding a welding shop open at 6 PM on a Saturday night? I don't want to think of what would have happened at highway speed. JimP
dfmcintyre	posted 07-07-2013 12:12 PM ET (US) Jim - Any chance of posting some links to images of the break? Thanks- Don
dfmcintyre	posted 07-07-2013 12:13 PM ET (US) And....any conclusions on what was the underlying reason it snapped? Regards - Don
swist	posted 07-07-2013 12:23 PM ET (US) I'm wondering if the weight distribution was correct. I can lift my trailer tongue off the ground (more typically off the hitch ball) under my own power. Too much weight on the tongue might stress it over time.
Jerry Townsend	posted 07-07-2013 01:27 PM ET (US) JimP - You were lucky - as you know. A commercial welding shop being open at that hour is rare. Now, had you been closer, you could have brought it over to my home any time. But $105 is not that bad - assuming it was a good repair. Check the tongue weight - it should be between 5 and 10 percent of the total trailer weight. You might have a bit more and I would suspect that might be the case. The reason is that the bending stresses will be pretty high in the region of the tongue that failed. I suspect that your trailer is a tandem - but hitting chuck-holes puts a impact load on vehicles and trailers. There is good information regarding tongue weight and adjusting the tongue weight in the CW reference section. Your tongue may have been weakened by someone drilling holes. If I were repairing such a weakened tongue - I would consider welding two pieces of 2 x 2 x 1/4 angle iron and as long as possible - say 2 -3 feet - on the bottom and sides of the damaged tongue.
jimp	posted 07-07-2013 01:39 PM ET (US) Good points, all. I don't have a scale to weigh the tongue, but my guess is in the 10% range of 400 pounds (I can't lift it). I have a long tongue due to the pulpit on the Revenge. Right now I'm going to move the boat about 4" farther back due to the u-bolts for the winch stand not fitting over the repair. The trailer is 22 years old. The repair included welding the break on three sides and adding 6" of 1/4" angle iron and plate on the three cracked sides. No pictures of the break. Stress over the years, heavy tongue weight, and extra long tongue contributed. JimP
Jerry Townsend	posted 07-07-2013 04:46 PM ET (US) Jim - careful in your adjustments. Moving the axle 4 inches can cause a big change. Too light of a tongue load can cause the trailer to sway. Consider using the information JimH has in the CW reference section. --- Jerry/Idaho
jimp	posted 07-07-2013 05:25 PM ET (US) Thanks, Jerry. WILCO. Didn't move the axle, just the winch stand 4" back, couldn't go forward. Is there a potential problem with the last 6 inches of transom not having bunks under it? JimP
Jerry Townsend	posted 07-07-2013 07:15 PM ET (US) Jim - The controlling item is the location of the c/g of the boat relative to the axle and the hitch. That is, moving the boat back 4 inches puts more load on the axle(s) and less on the hitch. And it is conceivable where a 4 inch move would put the entire load on the axle(s). Want to be careful. In general, it is much preferred to have the transom supported by the bunks - as that is where the weight is engine(s) is concentrated. And here too - there is a lot of information/comments/posts regarding supporting of the transom in the reference section. Consider having a welding shop modify your winch stand. ---- Jerry/Idaho
jimp	posted 07-07-2013 07:35 PM ET (US) Jerry - Looks like lots of work coming... I tried to lift the tongue, glued to the ground. Got my young, muscular, 27-yr old neighbor - glued to the ground. Got his strong friend, "Hey, I think it moved!" Figure if each of us could lift 200-pounds, the tongue weight has to be over 600-pounds, minimum, way too much. I'll read the trailer section thoroughly. The other concern is now the trailer hitch on the rear of the 1995 Ford F-350, it's been on there for 17-years and a bit of rust is showing. Thanks for direction. JimP
Jerry Townsend	posted 07-07-2013 08:45 PM ET (US) Jim - I agree, the heavy tongue weight suggests the boat be moved back a bit. But not knowing the weights (tongue, trailer, and boat) means that you have to do it via trial and error. Not knowing the weights is not insurmountable. You can get an approximate weight of the boat and engine from the manufacturers and make a few educated guesses on the trailer. I will help you as possible. But getting a hitch load would help. But, it is about time to get a new pickup and hitch - my gosh, those '95 Fords only last so long. But aside from that jab, keep your pickup - and forget the rust on the hitch. Take a wire brush and clean the hitch up as possible and spray some WD-40 - a good rust pentetrator and inhibitor - on it. ---- Jerry/Idaho
jimp	posted 07-07-2013 09:12 PM ET (US) Jerry - Thanks, again. I'm reading the trailer articles now. Loaded boat & engine I'm estimating 4,000 pounds which is close to what others have gotten. Include the trailer too? Another 1,000. Get rid of my 1995 Ford F-350 crewcab PowerStroke diesel with only 59,000 miles on it? Not even broken in yet! Though the right rear window switch needs replacement. JimP
L H G	posted 07-08-2013 01:52 AM ET (US) Jim - It ACTAULLY DID happen to me at 60 MPH and the four of us in the car are lucky to be here today. I was towing my Outrage 18, in the center lane of I-94 in northern IN, going around the bottom of Lake Michigan to get to Traverse City up north in the State. Add in 4th of July start of weekend traffic on one of the busiest roads in the country. It was 24 years ago almost to the day. The painted E-Z-Loader trailer was only three years old and had come with the boat when I bought it new. The tongue completely separated from the trailer at the point where the side frames attach, completely rusted through. The boat started fishtailing wildly, and the traffic to my right gave me room to pull over and get to the shoulder. The boat, still firmly connected at the bow stop, and the stern tie downs, literally held the trailer together. Upon examination, I couldn't believe they made this trailer with such thin walled tubing. Cheap, Cheap. No matter how good a welder you may have found, your trailer should have a NEW heavy wall 3 x 4 or 3 x 5 galvanized tongue installed. There is now way I would ever trust welding work on a member under that kind of bending stress, which is probably on a tongue with thin wall tubing to begin with, and likely to fail elsewhere. Just do it. You might also want to get a new trailer. That's what I did after I had a new tongue installed. No more E-Z-Loaders for me! Never.
domlynch	posted 07-08-2013 06:35 AM ET (US) Scary stuff Gents - very fortunate nothing worse happened. The worst I've had was a wheel bearing failure (caused by myself not knowing how to replace a bearing properly - I've certainly learnt since)- on that occasion I saw the outer face of the wheel/tyre well outside of the mud guard - and did not feel/hear anything unusual - lucky I checked the mirrors & was able to pull aside We all need to be vigilant.....
swist	posted 07-08-2013 08:35 AM ET (US) Another issue is that the handling of both the trailer and the toll vehicle, particularly emergency handling, are compromised if the trailer weight distribution is wrong.
swist	posted 07-08-2013 08:36 AM ET (US) It may be early in the morning, but I don't see how I can type two l's instead of one w. Musta been the cat.
Jerry Townsend	posted 07-09-2013 10:57 PM ET (US) Jim - I have taken your numbers, scaled some information from the Cetacea photos and made a couple of WAGs - and your 600 pound tongue weight is about right. And with a 5000 lb total weight, that is a good hitch load. While the 600 pounds sounds like a lot - you have a lot of boat. Just repair/replace the tongue and you should be good. --- Jerry/Idaho
jimh	posted 07-10-2013 07:09 AM ET (US) JimP and I have similar boats. I have weighed my boat and trailer and deduced the tongue weight. See http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/016667.html The tongue weight was 8.2-percent. I don't think boat trailers need the usually recommended 10-percent tongue weight. Boat trailers tend to have a lower center of gravity and less windage than travel trailers. My 21-year old E-Z-Loader galvanized steel trailer shows no sign of rust.
jimp	posted 07-10-2013 10:00 AM ET (US) Jerry/JimH - Thanks. The 22 year old trailer shows no or very little rust. It gets a feshwater washdown EVERYTME it gets dunked insalt water. I have never dunked the tongue in salt water. EZLoader says the trailer is rated at 4,000 pounds. JimH - does your Whalerdrive have off the trailer or is it supported? JimP
jimh	posted 07-10-2013 10:42 AM ET (US) Only the hull is supported by the trailer. The Whaler Drive hangs off the back without support. You can't really support the Whaler Drive on a trailer and still be able to launch in the conventional way, unless you made the Whaler Drive support removable or retractable.
jimp	posted 07-10-2013 10:49 AM ET (US) JimP My neighbor across the street has a 23' Parker with a bracket (similar to the Whalerdrive) hanging off the stern. Won't that move the center of gravity aft and lighten the tongue load and why "ContinuousWave" has a lighter tongue load than me? JimP
Plotman	posted 07-10-2013 11:04 AM ET (US) Instead of moving the boat, which may or may not be easy, depending on how your trailer is set up, I'd suggest you look at moving the axles forward or back. The last trailer I had, the spring hangers were welded to angle iron pieces that could be moved forward and aft relative to the main frame of the trailer. There were holes drilled about every 4 inches to allow you to select the desired position. It was a matter of removing 4 bolts and then adjusting the carriage as you desired. I simply lowered the tongue, blocked the rear corners of the trailer, then raised the tongue again to take the weight off the running gear, and I could move it easily. Took all of 10 minutes. On my current trailer it was easier to move the winch stand.
jimp	posted 07-10-2013 11:13 AM ET (US) Plotman - You must have anewer trailer or one that was set up by the manufacturer to make it easy to move the carriage. My EZLoader was the bunks/rollers attached to the axle setup requiring a lot of work with old rusty bolts. JimP
Jerry Townsend	posted 07-10-2013 12:42 PM ET (US) JimP -- indeed the Whaler drive will move the cg aft and lighten the tongue load. The location of the cg relative to the axles is a key dimension - but may not be all that sensitive depending on the other dimensions/weights. ---- Jerry/Idaho
Jerry Townsend	posted 07-10-2013 01:03 PM ET (US) Interestingly - JimH normally, as I recall, transports with his boat's fuel tank about empty - whereas JimP typically has his fuel tanks relatively full (about 70 gallons). I made a new calculation decreasing the weight by 300 pounds accounting for about 50 gallons of fuel difference - and the hitch load dropped from 647 to about 618 - not much change. ---- Jerry/Idaho
jimp	posted 07-28-2013 09:07 PM ET (US) The tongue has been replaced. Ordered a new, heavy gauge (.188" wall thickness versus the .125" original) for $300. EZLoader shipped it to Seattle for $40 and then north by barge for another $72. Got here Friday, started measuring and drilling holes. Installed today. New tongue weight approximately 500 pound versus the old ~640. To get the reduced tongue weight, with Jerry Townsend's calculations, I moved the carriage/chassis 7.9" forward. This was done by: 1. Putting penetrating oil on all the old chassis bolts that hadn't been moved in 21 years. Then let the penetrating oil work overnight. They all came free without much effort. Freshwater washdowns of the trailer after every dunking helped. 2. Blocking up the boat as much as possible using the tongue jack and getting the weight off the bunks and rollers. 3. Disconnecting the forward end of the four bunks as the rear of the bunks is attached to the rear crossmember and the forward end attached to the chassis. 4. Then using a come-along (that was useless) then the jackstand's PowerWinch and a chain attached midway on the chassis (between the two axles). Put some tension on the chain, then persuaded the cross member with a mall. Slow at first, then better. Any, tongue installed, lights reconnected, and it's time to go fishing. Thanks very much to JimH and ContinuousWave, you guys for your thoughts, and Jerry/Idaho for his calculations and guidance. JimP