Deck Repair: Removing Old Plywood Reinforcement with Multi-Tool

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Author Topic:   Deck Repair: Removing Old Plywood Reinforcement with Multi-Tool

jwestwood posted 02-07-2014 04:26 PM ET (US)
In all the information posted about replacing the plywood portion of decks, it seems that the most difficult part of the project is removing the old plywood. Has anyone used what is called a Multi Tool? It would seem to be the perfect tool to tackle that awful task of separating the plywood from the fiberglass. If anyone has experience using this fool for this job, are there any tricks that I should be aware of up front? Thanks and think spring!!
Whalrman posted 02-07-2014 08:59 PM ET (US)
Well, I was going to refer you to Jeff Rohfling's well illustrated narrative on this subject but, I can't seem to find it any where on this site. He went into great detail on how to tackle this project and what tools worked and some tricks of the trade. Glad I was able to see and read it when I did my Outrage 19 a few years ago. Good luck with your project and take your time, don't rush it.
jimh posted 02-08-2014 08:36 AM ET (US)
Jeff's article is listed in the table of contents for the REFERENCE section
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/
under the subheading REPAIRS/MODIFICATIONS, with the entry reading:
OUTRAGE 22 Under-Deck Restoration by Jeff Rohlfing
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/outrageRestore.html
jwestwood posted 02-08-2014 09:34 AM ET (US)
Thanks for the replies. I have read Jeff's well done piece on this project where he describes the labor intense nature of chiseling the wood from the deck bottom. My question is about an alternative to the chiseling process. Perhaps the use of this newer 'Multi Tool" in place of the chisel would make this project much simpler. It seems to me that it might. Any thoughts.
jwestwood posted 02-08-2014 09:43 AM ET (US)
Forgive me for the poor description for the tool in question. I think a better name is "oscillating cutting tool". Perhaps that helps.
Jefecinco posted 02-08-2014 09:51 AM ET (US)
You can always just give it a try. Use a lot of caution until you learn how to use the tool effectively.
It's just a guess but I would think Jeff would have considered that approach and rejected it for some good reason. Multitools are not so expensive as to prohibit some experimentation. Perhaps someone who has done the job will chime in.
Deck repairs of this type are not limited to Boston Whaler boats so a web-wide search with particular attention to Utube may be useful.
Butch
boatdryver posted 02-08-2014 09:55 AM ET (US)
You may be on to something there, jwestwood. Those tools have really proliferated in the last 3-4 years.
I've used my tool of that type for something equivalent to chiseling as well as using the saw blade, and I've watched tradesmen use the tool for shortening man hours in several situations.
Mine is a Porter Cable and has a speed adjustment. I think you could just try it at a low power setting like Whalrman says.
Maybe you could email Jeff Rohlfing and ask his advice.
JimL
Chuck Tribolet posted 02-08-2014 11:20 AM ET (US)
The reason these tools have proliferated is that Fein's patent
expired. They are called multitools because for many years
Fein made (and sold for a high price) the Fein Multimaster.
I've had one for a long time and it's been handy for a lot of
things, on and off the whaler.
Unfortunately, the attachments aren't interchangeable between
most brands. Oh well.
Chuck
Tom W Clark posted 02-09-2014 01:06 PM ET (US)
I've owned a Fein Multimaster for years and it is a great tool for some tasks, but not for this, not even close. It's a detailing tool for working on very small areas. You need something with a lot of horsepower to cover a lot of ground.
Try a pneumatic hammer with some sort of improvised chisel attachment. That would get the job done
Phil T posted 02-09-2014 01:16 PM ET (US)
How about a power planer? For example: http://makitatools.com/en-us/Modules/Tools/ToolDetails.aspx?Name=KP0800K
Tom W Clark posted 02-09-2014 01:32 PM ET (US)
Yes, a power plane will work fine--so long as you maintain a flat surface and have already cleared the perimeter first. Most power planes will not cut any deeper than 3/32"
That Makita model is the exact tool I have owned since 1988 and still use today.
Whalrman posted 02-09-2014 02:50 PM ET (US)
Thanks jimh for pointing it out, kinda helps to have my glasses on and clean. The tools I used for this project were a skill saw with a carbide blade, rubber mallet, 4" tile chisel, 1 1/2" wide wood chisel, work gloves and was done in a day (long!!). Be very careful as you can EASILY go in to the outer deck shell and tear it up.
crabby posted 02-09-2014 08:44 PM ET (US)
Just take a circular saw set to the correct depth and make a bunch of little checkerboards out of the ply. Then take a large chisel/floor scraper/adze-like device and scrape the chunks out.
Been there, done it, no need to get high tech. Then use a sander, grinder, belt sander to clean up the remaining bits.
Binkster posted 02-10-2014 06:45 PM ET (US)
Crabbys solution is the best, I believe, except I use Harbor Freighs multi tool for under $20. It'll pop rotted plywood off in a heartbeat.
( Try a pneumatic hammer with some sort of improvised chisel attachment. That would get the job done)
Forget this tool, I have one (a small air chisel) and it will go through the glass if you're not careful. I used mine mostly for chipping out stucco around windows for window removal/replacement during my remodeling days.
A portable power planer won't work either on rotted wood. The wet wood will gum up the tool, and if you cut even slightly into the glass, goodbuy blade, and they're expensive.
Jeff's methode worked, but its too "cave man" for me.
I used Crabbys solution on the rotted plywood on the backside of my 15 footer's fiberglass front hatch cover, and used the multi tool to remove the rotted wood. I realize the hatch cover is alot smaller, but it took all of 10 minutes to remove the scored, rotted wood.
I then glassed a layer of of woven roving and 2 layers of 1 1/2 oz mat (no wood).
rich
dfmcintyre posted 02-10-2014 06:54 PM ET (US)
When you're ready to glass in the new wood, call me. Ideas. --Don
jimh posted 02-10-2014 08:45 PM ET (US)
I don't know what the Multi Tool is or looks like. I might not be the only reader who is unfamiliar. Can one of you fellows talking about a Multi Tool please give us a pointer to one. I'd like to see that this $20 device looks like.
Tom W Clark posted 02-10-2014 08:52 PM ET (US)
My Fein Multimaster looks like this:
http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/product.do?part=370655
But it costs $220 not $20.
Tom W Clark posted 02-10-2014 08:57 PM ET (US)

quote:
A portable power planer won't work either...and if you cut even slightly into the glass, goodbuy blade, and they're expensive.
But here is something that does cost only $20, replacement knives for my 26 year old power plane:
http://www.tools-plus.com/makita-d-17239.html
After having them resharpened three or four times, they do need replacing.
Oh, they go through fiberglass just fine, so be careful.
Binkster posted 02-12-2014 11:24 AM ET (US)
Here is a link to the Harbor Freight Multi Tool
http://www.harborfreight.com/oscillating-multifunction-power-tool-60428. html
I bought mine with a 25% discount coupon so
totaled out at $15 plus tax.
If it was a tool that I used often I would have one like Mr. Clark has. I have used mine only twice. the first time to remove the foam from the tunnel I created when I converted my 15 footer to a center console. After cutting out the floor section I took a handsaw and made a cut through the foam down to the boat bottom around the perimeter of the cut out floor. Then I made a series of cross section cuts through the foam. I then took my Harbor Freight Multi Tool to the foam and it removed it all in a matter of a few minutes, down to the boat bottom, clean as a whistle. the other time I used it was on the underside of the hatch in the bow of the same boat. The reinforcement was glassed over plywood which was rotted. I took the multitool to that and easily chipped out all the plywood in no time. BTW the instructions say to wear gloves becuase of vibration. I didn't, and even though I didn't used the tool for very long, my hands vibrated for quite a while.
The multi tool has multi uses so they say, it even sands concrete? I can only say that the vibrating blade with the little teeth worked great for what I used it for.
Folks look down their noses at Harbor Freight. Seems like Fein tools have snob appeal and make you a better craftman. Total nonsence. I was in the construction business for 35 years and bought the best tools available becuase I used them every day. But even the best tools wear out. I had to do a remodel job on one of my rentals last year and my 25 year old Senco framing nailer finally quit for good. I bought a Harbor Freight framing gun for about $100 it works very well. Their cutoff saw looks like junk though, buy a good one.
rich
Jefecinco posted 02-12-2014 06:32 PM ET (US)
On sale right now for 19.99 on the link you provided.
I buy a few things from HF, mostly things where perfect fit and finish doesn't matter or things that I seldom use or intend to use once. I hate to borrow or lend a tool and the prices of HF tools are often about as low as a couple of rentals.
I'm not a tool snob though I like precision in wrenches. Sockets and combination wrenches that slip or break are dangerous and I've a couple of old hands with a lot of scarring to prove the point. Experience seems to lower the frequency of accidents.
Butch
Jefecinco posted 02-13-2014 06:01 PM ET (US)
There is a coupon in the latest issue of "BOATING" for the HF Multitool at $14.99. The coupon is good through 5-21-2014.
I'm getting one for that price.
Butch

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Author	Topic: Deck Repair: Removing Old Plywood Reinforcement with Multi-Tool
jwestwood	posted 02-07-2014 04:26 PM ET (US) In all the information posted about replacing the plywood portion of decks, it seems that the most difficult part of the project is removing the old plywood. Has anyone used what is called a Multi Tool? It would seem to be the perfect tool to tackle that awful task of separating the plywood from the fiberglass. If anyone has experience using this fool for this job, are there any tricks that I should be aware of up front? Thanks and think spring!!
Whalrman	posted 02-07-2014 08:59 PM ET (US) Well, I was going to refer you to Jeff Rohfling's well illustrated narrative on this subject but, I can't seem to find it any where on this site. He went into great detail on how to tackle this project and what tools worked and some tricks of the trade. Glad I was able to see and read it when I did my Outrage 19 a few years ago. Good luck with your project and take your time, don't rush it.
jimh	posted 02-08-2014 08:36 AM ET (US) Jeff's article is listed in the table of contents for the REFERENCE section http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/ under the subheading REPAIRS/MODIFICATIONS, with the entry reading: OUTRAGE 22 Under-Deck Restoration by Jeff Rohlfing http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/outrageRestore.html
jwestwood	posted 02-08-2014 09:34 AM ET (US) Thanks for the replies. I have read Jeff's well done piece on this project where he describes the labor intense nature of chiseling the wood from the deck bottom. My question is about an alternative to the chiseling process. Perhaps the use of this newer 'Multi Tool" in place of the chisel would make this project much simpler. It seems to me that it might. Any thoughts.
jwestwood	posted 02-08-2014 09:43 AM ET (US) Forgive me for the poor description for the tool in question. I think a better name is "oscillating cutting tool". Perhaps that helps.
Jefecinco	posted 02-08-2014 09:51 AM ET (US) You can always just give it a try. Use a lot of caution until you learn how to use the tool effectively. It's just a guess but I would think Jeff would have considered that approach and rejected it for some good reason. Multitools are not so expensive as to prohibit some experimentation. Perhaps someone who has done the job will chime in. Deck repairs of this type are not limited to Boston Whaler boats so a web-wide search with particular attention to Utube may be useful. Butch
boatdryver	posted 02-08-2014 09:55 AM ET (US) You may be on to something there, jwestwood. Those tools have really proliferated in the last 3-4 years. I've used my tool of that type for something equivalent to chiseling as well as using the saw blade, and I've watched tradesmen use the tool for shortening man hours in several situations. Mine is a Porter Cable and has a speed adjustment. I think you could just try it at a low power setting like Whalrman says. Maybe you could email Jeff Rohlfing and ask his advice. JimL
Chuck Tribolet	posted 02-08-2014 11:20 AM ET (US) The reason these tools have proliferated is that Fein's patent expired. They are called multitools because for many years Fein made (and sold for a high price) the Fein Multimaster. I've had one for a long time and it's been handy for a lot of things, on and off the whaler. Unfortunately, the attachments aren't interchangeable between most brands. Oh well. Chuck
Tom W Clark	posted 02-09-2014 01:06 PM ET (US) I've owned a Fein Multimaster for years and it is a great tool for some tasks, but not for this, not even close. It's a detailing tool for working on very small areas. You need something with a lot of horsepower to cover a lot of ground. Try a pneumatic hammer with some sort of improvised chisel attachment. That would get the job done
Phil T	posted 02-09-2014 01:16 PM ET (US) How about a power planer? For example: http://makitatools.com/en-us/Modules/Tools/ToolDetails.aspx?Name=KP0800K
Tom W Clark	posted 02-09-2014 01:32 PM ET (US) Yes, a power plane will work fine--so long as you maintain a flat surface and have already cleared the perimeter first. Most power planes will not cut any deeper than 3/32" That Makita model is the exact tool I have owned since 1988 and still use today.
Whalrman	posted 02-09-2014 02:50 PM ET (US) Thanks jimh for pointing it out, kinda helps to have my glasses on and clean. The tools I used for this project were a skill saw with a carbide blade, rubber mallet, 4" tile chisel, 1 1/2" wide wood chisel, work gloves and was done in a day (long!!). Be very careful as you can EASILY go in to the outer deck shell and tear it up.
crabby	posted 02-09-2014 08:44 PM ET (US) Just take a circular saw set to the correct depth and make a bunch of little checkerboards out of the ply. Then take a large chisel/floor scraper/adze-like device and scrape the chunks out. Been there, done it, no need to get high tech. Then use a sander, grinder, belt sander to clean up the remaining bits.
Binkster	posted 02-10-2014 06:45 PM ET (US) Crabbys solution is the best, I believe, except I use Harbor Freighs multi tool for under $20. It'll pop rotted plywood off in a heartbeat. ( Try a pneumatic hammer with some sort of improvised chisel attachment. That would get the job done) Forget this tool, I have one (a small air chisel) and it will go through the glass if you're not careful. I used mine mostly for chipping out stucco around windows for window removal/replacement during my remodeling days. A portable power planer won't work either on rotted wood. The wet wood will gum up the tool, and if you cut even slightly into the glass, goodbuy blade, and they're expensive. Jeff's methode worked, but its too "cave man" for me. I used Crabbys solution on the rotted plywood on the backside of my 15 footer's fiberglass front hatch cover, and used the multi tool to remove the rotted wood. I realize the hatch cover is alot smaller, but it took all of 10 minutes to remove the scored, rotted wood. I then glassed a layer of of woven roving and 2 layers of 1 1/2 oz mat (no wood). rich
dfmcintyre	posted 02-10-2014 06:54 PM ET (US) When you're ready to glass in the new wood, call me. Ideas. --Don
jimh	posted 02-10-2014 08:45 PM ET (US) I don't know what the Multi Tool is or looks like. I might not be the only reader who is unfamiliar. Can one of you fellows talking about a Multi Tool please give us a pointer to one. I'd like to see that this $20 device looks like.
Tom W Clark	posted 02-10-2014 08:52 PM ET (US) My Fein Multimaster looks like this: http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/product.do?part=370655 But it costs $220 not $20.
Tom W Clark	posted 02-10-2014 08:57 PM ET (US) quote: A portable power planer won't work either...and if you cut even slightly into the glass, goodbuy blade, and they're expensive. But here is something that does cost only $20, replacement knives for my 26 year old power plane: http://www.tools-plus.com/makita-d-17239.html After having them resharpened three or four times, they do need replacing. Oh, they go through fiberglass just fine, so be careful.
Binkster	posted 02-12-2014 11:24 AM ET (US) Here is a link to the Harbor Freight Multi Tool http://www.harborfreight.com/oscillating-multifunction-power-tool-60428. html I bought mine with a 25% discount coupon so totaled out at $15 plus tax. If it was a tool that I used often I would have one like Mr. Clark has. I have used mine only twice. the first time to remove the foam from the tunnel I created when I converted my 15 footer to a center console. After cutting out the floor section I took a handsaw and made a cut through the foam down to the boat bottom around the perimeter of the cut out floor. Then I made a series of cross section cuts through the foam. I then took my Harbor Freight Multi Tool to the foam and it removed it all in a matter of a few minutes, down to the boat bottom, clean as a whistle. the other time I used it was on the underside of the hatch in the bow of the same boat. The reinforcement was glassed over plywood which was rotted. I took the multitool to that and easily chipped out all the plywood in no time. BTW the instructions say to wear gloves becuase of vibration. I didn't, and even though I didn't used the tool for very long, my hands vibrated for quite a while. The multi tool has multi uses so they say, it even sands concrete? I can only say that the vibrating blade with the little teeth worked great for what I used it for. Folks look down their noses at Harbor Freight. Seems like Fein tools have snob appeal and make you a better craftman. Total nonsence. I was in the construction business for 35 years and bought the best tools available becuase I used them every day. But even the best tools wear out. I had to do a remodel job on one of my rentals last year and my 25 year old Senco framing nailer finally quit for good. I bought a Harbor Freight framing gun for about $100 it works very well. Their cutoff saw looks like junk though, buy a good one. rich
Jefecinco	posted 02-12-2014 06:32 PM ET (US) On sale right now for 19.99 on the link you provided. I buy a few things from HF, mostly things where perfect fit and finish doesn't matter or things that I seldom use or intend to use once. I hate to borrow or lend a tool and the prices of HF tools are often about as low as a couple of rentals. I'm not a tool snob though I like precision in wrenches. Sockets and combination wrenches that slip or break are dangerous and I've a couple of old hands with a lot of scarring to prove the point. Experience seems to lower the frequency of accidents. Butch
Jefecinco	posted 02-13-2014 06:01 PM ET (US) There is a coupon in the latest issue of "BOATING" for the HF Multitool at $14.99. The coupon is good through 5-21-2014. I'm getting one for that price. Butch