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Author Topic:   Honda 90-HP Water Pump

Ventura posted 04-19-2014 06:53 PM ET (US)
[On a HONDA 90-HP outboard motor] when running the engine from a hose attachment, should the weep hole always be shooting out water? Or, is my water pump bad and I am just bypassing it with water pressure?
[Thanks]. Jim
jimh posted 04-20-2014 11:33 AM ET (US)
I think when you write "weep hole" you are probably referring to a nozzle outlet in the cooling water system that is more typically called a confidence stream or by a few other vulgar names. The confidence stream is usually present when there is sufficient water pressure in the cooling system to force water through the nozzle of the outlet, creating a small stream or spray of cooling water. There are actually several purposes for this outlet:
--it provides a venting of air from the cooling system (as it is often fed from a point near the top of the cooing system) to prevent sections of the cooling system from becoming air locked;
--it provides a visual indication to the operator that there is water flow in the cooling system at a reasonable pressure; and
--it sometimes helps to regulate the pressure in the cooling system by restricting the outlet flow through its nozzle, thus keeping the cooling system pressure higher than would occur with an unrestricted outlet.
It is hard to say with certainty on a particular brand of, model of, or horsepower engine exactly how the confidence stream will appear when the engine is being run using some sort of hose adaptor. There are at least two types of hose adpators.
If the hose adaptor is the type that envelopes the cooling water inlets on the gear case, providing water upstream of the water pump, it is possible for the water pressure in the hose to push water past a water pump that is not working well, giving one the impression that the engine water pump is working normally.
If the hose adaptor is some sort of direct connection into the cooling system downstream of the water pump, the water from the hose and its pressure may have more influence on the cooling system and the confidence stream indicator than the water pressure from the water pump. It is typical that the hose water will flow in the cooling system in the reverse direction from normal. This is often called back flushing. In this situation, water may flow out of the normal water inlets on the gear case. It is hard to predict how much pressure will occur in the cooling system in this case. Since flow and pressure in the cooling system affect the water flow through the nozzle of the confidence stream outlet, it is hard to predict the stream volume or strength.
jimh posted 04-20-2014 11:35 AM ET (US)
What type of hose adaptor are you using?
kmev posted 04-20-2014 08:33 PM ET (US)
Are you running the motor with the hose attached to the black hose attachment below the powerhead, or to "muffs" attached to the lower unit?
The hose attachment below the powerhead is not for running the motor - it's for flushing the motor of saltwater without running the engine. To run the motor on the trailer, use muffs. If you don't have the owner's manual, you can download it from the Honda Marine website.
Ventura posted 04-20-2014 08:34 PM ET (US)
Hi Jim
Thanks for the info I am using an adaptor around the foot of the engine. It is up stream if the water pump. The engine has not been run in 6 years and started on the 3rd try. Just a little concerned I did not see Water coming out of the confidence port. I checked the thermostat and it is fine. Our water pressure here is low we have a well. There is a flush port on the engine . Is there a chemical flush I could run through the engine to clean it out?
Thanks
Jim
2manyboats posted 04-21-2014 05:04 AM ET (US)
The water pump indicator on our Honda 130 stops up quiet easily. A foot long piece of weed-eater line is what I use to clear it. On rare occasions I have have to disconnect the hose to the indicator under the cowling to clear an obstruction. If the motor didn't run hot( no alarms) on the hose I would doubt there is a blockage in the cooling passages in the powerhead, just a blockage in the indicator circuit. I would think it would be wise to change the water pump impeller after sitting for 6 years. On most Hondas changing it is easy. Our 2002 130 takes me less than 30 minutes.
Landlocked posted 04-21-2014 10:21 AM ET (US)
If its set up for 6 years, I'd suspect web worms or some type of insect has taken up residency in the tubing not too far from the outlet. A stiff piece of wire will probably solve the problem.
Ll.
jimh posted 04-22-2014 06:42 PM ET (US)
Implied in the initial article is the notion that the confidence stream is working when the boat is in the water. But, as several have noted, the confidence stream may be simply blocked, and it won't work either in the water or on a hose adaptor that envelopes the water inlets.
Clearing debris from the confidence stream orifice is often necessary. Due to the small diameter of the orifice, it only takes a small piece of debris, a little pebble, or some sand to block the flow.
andrey320 posted 04-24-2014 06:40 PM ET (US)
So... what happens when you flush using the flush port?
(FYI - you most likely do not have to run the engine when flushing using the hose adapter)

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Author	Topic: Honda 90-HP Water Pump
Ventura	posted 04-19-2014 06:53 PM ET (US) [On a HONDA 90-HP outboard motor] when running the engine from a hose attachment, should the weep hole always be shooting out water? Or, is my water pump bad and I am just bypassing it with water pressure? [Thanks]. Jim
jimh	posted 04-20-2014 11:33 AM ET (US) I think when you write "weep hole" you are probably referring to a nozzle outlet in the cooling water system that is more typically called a confidence stream or by a few other vulgar names. The confidence stream is usually present when there is sufficient water pressure in the cooling system to force water through the nozzle of the outlet, creating a small stream or spray of cooling water. There are actually several purposes for this outlet: --it provides a venting of air from the cooling system (as it is often fed from a point near the top of the cooing system) to prevent sections of the cooling system from becoming air locked; --it provides a visual indication to the operator that there is water flow in the cooling system at a reasonable pressure; and --it sometimes helps to regulate the pressure in the cooling system by restricting the outlet flow through its nozzle, thus keeping the cooling system pressure higher than would occur with an unrestricted outlet. It is hard to say with certainty on a particular brand of, model of, or horsepower engine exactly how the confidence stream will appear when the engine is being run using some sort of hose adaptor. There are at least two types of hose adpators. If the hose adaptor is the type that envelopes the cooling water inlets on the gear case, providing water upstream of the water pump, it is possible for the water pressure in the hose to push water past a water pump that is not working well, giving one the impression that the engine water pump is working normally. If the hose adaptor is some sort of direct connection into the cooling system downstream of the water pump, the water from the hose and its pressure may have more influence on the cooling system and the confidence stream indicator than the water pressure from the water pump. It is typical that the hose water will flow in the cooling system in the reverse direction from normal. This is often called back flushing. In this situation, water may flow out of the normal water inlets on the gear case. It is hard to predict how much pressure will occur in the cooling system in this case. Since flow and pressure in the cooling system affect the water flow through the nozzle of the confidence stream outlet, it is hard to predict the stream volume or strength.
jimh	posted 04-20-2014 11:35 AM ET (US) What type of hose adaptor are you using?
kmev	posted 04-20-2014 08:33 PM ET (US) Are you running the motor with the hose attached to the black hose attachment below the powerhead, or to "muffs" attached to the lower unit? The hose attachment below the powerhead is not for running the motor - it's for flushing the motor of saltwater without running the engine. To run the motor on the trailer, use muffs. If you don't have the owner's manual, you can download it from the Honda Marine website.
Ventura	posted 04-20-2014 08:34 PM ET (US) Hi Jim Thanks for the info I am using an adaptor around the foot of the engine. It is up stream if the water pump. The engine has not been run in 6 years and started on the 3rd try. Just a little concerned I did not see Water coming out of the confidence port. I checked the thermostat and it is fine. Our water pressure here is low we have a well. There is a flush port on the engine . Is there a chemical flush I could run through the engine to clean it out? Thanks Jim
2manyboats	posted 04-21-2014 05:04 AM ET (US) The water pump indicator on our Honda 130 stops up quiet easily. A foot long piece of weed-eater line is what I use to clear it. On rare occasions I have have to disconnect the hose to the indicator under the cowling to clear an obstruction. If the motor didn't run hot( no alarms) on the hose I would doubt there is a blockage in the cooling passages in the powerhead, just a blockage in the indicator circuit. I would think it would be wise to change the water pump impeller after sitting for 6 years. On most Hondas changing it is easy. Our 2002 130 takes me less than 30 minutes.
Landlocked	posted 04-21-2014 10:21 AM ET (US) If its set up for 6 years, I'd suspect web worms or some type of insect has taken up residency in the tubing not too far from the outlet. A stiff piece of wire will probably solve the problem. Ll.
jimh	posted 04-22-2014 06:42 PM ET (US) Implied in the initial article is the notion that the confidence stream is working when the boat is in the water. But, as several have noted, the confidence stream may be simply blocked, and it won't work either in the water or on a hose adaptor that envelopes the water inlets. Clearing debris from the confidence stream orifice is often necessary. Due to the small diameter of the orifice, it only takes a small piece of debris, a little pebble, or some sand to block the flow.
andrey320	posted 04-24-2014 06:40 PM ET (US) So... what happens when you flush using the flush port? (FYI - you most likely do not have to run the engine when flushing using the hose adapter)