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Author Topic:   Smart Trim Tabs for Montauk or SS 15' Hull

EJO posted 08-14-2014 10:48 AM ET (US)
Has anybody out there ever mounted so "self adjustable" trim tabs on their 15 ft Whaler (or even 16') Montauk or Super Sport?
I'm thinking of installing a pair of Nauticus SX9510-40 in the hopes to get better out of the hole performance and get on to plane better with a full boat load (5/6 people). Nauticus said they have helped many customers put them on whaler boats over the years with much success. I believe they talk about the 17' and up models. You need 10" of height clearance from the bottom of the boat up where the actuator mounts and with my swim ladder that means it would be mounted just to the right of the ladder. i.e. close to center of the boat right next to the 60 HP where the different rise step is.
I don't want to buy these tabs and put mounting holes in my transom before I know it has been tried out on a BW (Montauk 150) 15 ft. hull.
B-4 somebody refers me to the 2009 and 2010 threads about why and why not to use these Smart tabs let me tell you I did read all of it but my concern is where to place them on my 15 ft. hull as I cannot do it on the outside of my transom due to where my factory mounted swim-ladder sits hence I need to know if somebody installed a set on a 15' Montauk hull.
I know it will help with porpoising and getting onto plane with less passenger shifting around.
Please show some transom pictures with mounted Smart Tabs.
Jefecinco posted 08-14-2014 07:49 PM ET (US)
I would not consider tabs, smart or otherwise until I had my engine mounting height and propeller optimally tuned-in.
If my boats performance with everything properly set up continued to disappoint me I would consider tabs to improve hole shot and low speed plane capability.
However, for a small boat I would prefer to use Lenco electric tabs rather than Smart Tabs.
Butch
EJO posted 08-15-2014 09:10 AM ET (US)
Butch I'm tuned in with motor height and prop as have been talked about in many threads on this site.
My Stiletto SS prop gives me a 5800 to 5900 WOT with proper trimming, 350 lbs of person & gear and my two full tanks and @ that time a speed of 29.3 knots (33.7 mph)is achieved, but she has a tendency to porpoise at that time also.
Of coarse she runs better with two people and the second person on the bow-pad, but sometimes that 2nd person wants to sit next to me on the RPS and then she porpoises again although not that much of a problem as the admiral doesn't want to go WOT anyway.
Electric trim tabs are/were great on my big cabin cruiser but not on a small 15' boat as they are too expensive , too much extra electrics, take up too much space on small CC and as balance and weight distribution make such a difference in a small boat like the 15' or even 17' it is better to have a less expensive solution that constantly "adjusts itself".
I could probably adjust the Lenco's continuously as I already do with engine trimming but it would be nice to just hit the throttle to 3,500 rpm, trim the engine slightly and let her cruise even when somebody gets up from the cooler and gets a drink. (change of balance)
Jefecinco posted 08-15-2014 09:39 AM ET (US)
Good luck and I certainly understand about keeping things simple. The nice thing about the Lenco Tabs as opposed to Bennet Tabs is the space saving features of a purely electrical tab system. They are not complex and are easy to install. Cost is higher than fixed tabs but lower than hydraulic tabs or was the last time I checked.
I'm not that familiar with Smart Tabs but understand they are "always" deployed in the downward position on both sides. For a lighter load having tabs deployed may not be ideal all the time.
Back in the day wedges were sometimes used to correct trim when a constant correction was advisable. The advantage of wedges was primarily the low cost.
Butch
EJO posted 08-15-2014 10:18 AM ET (US)
Thanks Butch I agree, all my other larger boats always have/had the hydraulic Bennet-tabs of much larger surface areas. I have to say I'm not familiar (have seen working) with the electric Lenco tabs but still feel that is a cost overkill on my little whaler.
As to the self adjustable tabs they need to be "dialed" in as they really not deployed downwards all the time.
I know somebody that put them on a blowup dinghy (soft bottom, not RIB) with great results and talked to a guy with an older 16ft Lund with only a 25HP and he said it improved his performance twice-fold.
Christopher Smith and Garfield Wood knew all about wedges and steps in their race boats.
thegage posted 08-15-2014 02:49 PM ET (US)
Lenco tabs are overkill for a 15 ft. Whaler. Smart Tabs can work well if employed carefully.
I have a 16SL, notorious for a slight stern heaviness and tendency to porpoise. I have an E-TEC 90 mounted all the way up and through experimentation have found two options to address the issue. The first is a 4-blade Rogue prop, 15" pitch. The second is a Stiletto Advantage II, also 15" pitch, combined with Smart Tabs, 40 springs set at their least resistance setting.
The Rogue is a "stern lifting" prop, and performs as advertised, jumping up on plane and eliminating any porpoising, but it's a bit too effective, as even with the engine all the way trimmed out I can't get the bow up to its most efficient level. The Stiletto/Smart Tabs combination also jumps on plane (perhaps even quicker, as the Stiletto is ventilated), with a more acceptable range of bow angle to engine trim. Emotionally I didn't want the Smart Tabs to work better, as I'd like to not have something hanging off my hull, but intellectually I can't deny their effectiveness. I do a lot of tubing and skiing with my boat, and the Stiletto/Tabs combination is just about perfect. Plus the Stiletto gives a couple mph extra at WOT, which helps with the emotional reconciliation!
I know my hull is different and heavier, and I have a two-stroke, which has a better torque curve, but I think Smart Tabs are just what you need, assuming you can get the installation to work with your swim ladder. I know you've also posted over at Whaler Central. If you check my personal page over there you can see how I dealt with the installation.
John K.
EJO posted 08-18-2014 03:12 PM ET (US)
Thank you John

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Author	Topic: Smart Trim Tabs for Montauk or SS 15' Hull
EJO	posted 08-14-2014 10:48 AM ET (US) Has anybody out there ever mounted so "self adjustable" trim tabs on their 15 ft Whaler (or even 16') Montauk or Super Sport? I'm thinking of installing a pair of Nauticus SX9510-40 in the hopes to get better out of the hole performance and get on to plane better with a full boat load (5/6 people). Nauticus said they have helped many customers put them on whaler boats over the years with much success. I believe they talk about the 17' and up models. You need 10" of height clearance from the bottom of the boat up where the actuator mounts and with my swim ladder that means it would be mounted just to the right of the ladder. i.e. close to center of the boat right next to the 60 HP where the different rise step is. I don't want to buy these tabs and put mounting holes in my transom before I know it has been tried out on a BW (Montauk 150) 15 ft. hull. B-4 somebody refers me to the 2009 and 2010 threads about why and why not to use these Smart tabs let me tell you I did read all of it but my concern is where to place them on my 15 ft. hull as I cannot do it on the outside of my transom due to where my factory mounted swim-ladder sits hence I need to know if somebody installed a set on a 15' Montauk hull. I know it will help with porpoising and getting onto plane with less passenger shifting around. Please show some transom pictures with mounted Smart Tabs.
Jefecinco	posted 08-14-2014 07:49 PM ET (US) I would not consider tabs, smart or otherwise until I had my engine mounting height and propeller optimally tuned-in. If my boats performance with everything properly set up continued to disappoint me I would consider tabs to improve hole shot and low speed plane capability. However, for a small boat I would prefer to use Lenco electric tabs rather than Smart Tabs. Butch
EJO	posted 08-15-2014 09:10 AM ET (US) Butch I'm tuned in with motor height and prop as have been talked about in many threads on this site. My Stiletto SS prop gives me a 5800 to 5900 WOT with proper trimming, 350 lbs of person & gear and my two full tanks and @ that time a speed of 29.3 knots (33.7 mph)is achieved, but she has a tendency to porpoise at that time also. Of coarse she runs better with two people and the second person on the bow-pad, but sometimes that 2nd person wants to sit next to me on the RPS and then she porpoises again although not that much of a problem as the admiral doesn't want to go WOT anyway. Electric trim tabs are/were great on my big cabin cruiser but not on a small 15' boat as they are too expensive , too much extra electrics, take up too much space on small CC and as balance and weight distribution make such a difference in a small boat like the 15' or even 17' it is better to have a less expensive solution that constantly "adjusts itself". I could probably adjust the Lenco's continuously as I already do with engine trimming but it would be nice to just hit the throttle to 3,500 rpm, trim the engine slightly and let her cruise even when somebody gets up from the cooler and gets a drink. (change of balance)
Jefecinco	posted 08-15-2014 09:39 AM ET (US) Good luck and I certainly understand about keeping things simple. The nice thing about the Lenco Tabs as opposed to Bennet Tabs is the space saving features of a purely electrical tab system. They are not complex and are easy to install. Cost is higher than fixed tabs but lower than hydraulic tabs or was the last time I checked. I'm not that familiar with Smart Tabs but understand they are "always" deployed in the downward position on both sides. For a lighter load having tabs deployed may not be ideal all the time. Back in the day wedges were sometimes used to correct trim when a constant correction was advisable. The advantage of wedges was primarily the low cost. Butch
EJO	posted 08-15-2014 10:18 AM ET (US) Thanks Butch I agree, all my other larger boats always have/had the hydraulic Bennet-tabs of much larger surface areas. I have to say I'm not familiar (have seen working) with the electric Lenco tabs but still feel that is a cost overkill on my little whaler. As to the self adjustable tabs they need to be "dialed" in as they really not deployed downwards all the time. I know somebody that put them on a blowup dinghy (soft bottom, not RIB) with great results and talked to a guy with an older 16ft Lund with only a 25HP and he said it improved his performance twice-fold. Christopher Smith and Garfield Wood knew all about wedges and steps in their race boats.
thegage	posted 08-15-2014 02:49 PM ET (US) Lenco tabs are overkill for a 15 ft. Whaler. Smart Tabs can work well if employed carefully. I have a 16SL, notorious for a slight stern heaviness and tendency to porpoise. I have an E-TEC 90 mounted all the way up and through experimentation have found two options to address the issue. The first is a 4-blade Rogue prop, 15" pitch. The second is a Stiletto Advantage II, also 15" pitch, combined with Smart Tabs, 40 springs set at their least resistance setting. The Rogue is a "stern lifting" prop, and performs as advertised, jumping up on plane and eliminating any porpoising, but it's a bit too effective, as even with the engine all the way trimmed out I can't get the bow up to its most efficient level. The Stiletto/Smart Tabs combination also jumps on plane (perhaps even quicker, as the Stiletto is ventilated), with a more acceptable range of bow angle to engine trim. Emotionally I didn't want the Smart Tabs to work better, as I'd like to not have something hanging off my hull, but intellectually I can't deny their effectiveness. I do a lot of tubing and skiing with my boat, and the Stiletto/Tabs combination is just about perfect. Plus the Stiletto gives a couple mph extra at WOT, which helps with the emotional reconciliation! I know my hull is different and heavier, and I have a two-stroke, which has a better torque curve, but I think Smart Tabs are just what you need, assuming you can get the installation to work with your swim ladder. I know you've also posted over at Whaler Central. If you check my personal page over there you can see how I dealt with the installation. John K.
EJO	posted 08-18-2014 03:12 PM ET (US) Thank you John