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  REVENGE 19: Water Over Transom

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Author Topic:   REVENGE 19: Water Over Transom
placerville posted 01-07-2005 01:27 AM ET (US)   Profile for placerville   Send Email to placerville  
I just bought a REVENGE 19 with 120-HP 1989 Johnson. I took it out for the first time today, and I had water pouring over the transom when I came up on plane unless I had the motor trimmed all the way down. The motor is a 20-inch shaft and it's sitting on the transom. Even when I have the motor trimmed down, there still seems to be a lot of water getting pushed forward. Any ideas?
Thanks
David Jenkins posted 01-07-2005 08:59 AM ET (US)     Profile for David Jenkins  Send Email to David Jenkins     
Is your boat back-heavy for some reason? When the boat is not moving, does water come into the boat through the two rear drain holes or are those holes completely out of the water?

When you put the engine all the way down, is it in fact going all the way down or do you have a pin inserted in of the the five sets of holes so that the engine can be manually trimmed?

How high does the bow get when you are getting on a plane? Can you still see the horizon while seated?

Peter posted 01-07-2005 09:20 AM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
Sounds like the motor is mounted too low on the transom. If the engine bracket is resting on the top of the transom bottom, it is quite possible that the anti-ventilation plate is below the keel. If so, then what happens is a column of water is running up the leg and being directed into the boat through the engine bracket. This should be easily fixed by raising the engine up on the transom by one-hole.
Tom W Clark posted 01-07-2005 12:14 PM ET (US)     Profile for Tom W Clark  Send Email to Tom W Clark     
Water is coming over the transom because there is excessive weight in the stern.

You don't say what year your Revenge 19 is but I assume it's from the 1970's. I would suspect a waterlogged hull.

David Jenkins posted 01-07-2005 01:01 PM ET (US)     Profile for David Jenkins  Send Email to David Jenkins     
Something is not right with this story.
macfam posted 01-07-2005 07:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for macfam  Send Email to macfam     
I'm with Peter on this one.
lsutiger posted 01-07-2005 08:07 PM ET (US)     Profile for lsutiger  Send Email to lsutiger     
How is the motor mounted? Are the bottom two bolts run from the transom to the two holes that are tapped into the motor? It wouldn't hurt for [the boat's outboard motor to have] another 30-HP. You might try transom wedges and a whale tail. Take the [boat] on a trailer and go to the a local scale and get it weighed. If it is waterlogged you could drill (yikes!) a hole in the hull about 2 inches from the transom on the keel and let it drip. I had a REVENGE 19 that I maintained for 20 years or so and always had a V-6. The boat is rated for 150-HP. Ride in one with a 175-HP motor and it'll scream! Look at the very back of the keel and see if it might have a cup it it that helps spray the water. If you go to a V-6, it is recommmended that you use a dual steering system or hydraulic if you really want to spend money but it is so sweet. Good luck.

The boat likely has a 40 gallon tank and it isn't built on centerline. Where the fuel lines come through the floor on the starboard side of the floor there is a drain plug that drains the gas and floor compartement. If there is an inspection plate you can lift it and look to see if you have water in there. The hole could be clogged up or the plug could be in it.

placerville posted 01-07-2005 09:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for placerville  Send Email to placerville     
Wow. A lot of good info there.

It is a 1975 hull. I have no idea of its history. When I did put it in the water for the first time, the waterline at the transom was over the transom splash well drains. Should there be plugs in those holes? Should they be above the waterline?

I only had 10 gallons of gas back there and a battery, so it wasn't overloaded. Maybe the hull is waterlogged. I noticed a 1/2-inch pipe plug near the bottom of the transom. I'm afraid to open it and watch a waterfall come out.

It did seem like water was deflecting off of the front of the motor. When I did operate it with the motor trimmed all the way down, the bow wasn't too high and it seemed to run well. It topped out at 26-MPH, which seems slow. There's no tachometer.

It sounds like the motor is mounted too high. Where should the anti-ventilation plate be in relation to the bottom of the hull?

I sure appreciated all your expertise.

David Jenkins posted 01-07-2005 09:36 PM ET (US)     Profile for David Jenkins  Send Email to David Jenkins     
The old REVENGE 19 models are bow heavy. Bigshot reported that on his dad's REVENGE 19 he use to leave the plug out of his rear fishwell in an attempt to get more weight in the stern. I bet you could set a couple of kegs of beer back there and not get any water over the transom. Perhaps we are totally misunderstanding what is being described.

I own a 1974 Outrage 19, almost the same boat you have. And your story just does not make any sense to me.

You say that the first time you launched the boat, the waterline was over the drain holes. Why just the "first" time? Did that subsequently change?

What is this 1/2" pipe plug you are talking about?

What do you mean you had 10 gallons in the back? Two five gallon cans? Are you not using the internal 40 gallon tank?

Was water coming in the boat because it was deflecting off of the motor or because it was "pouring" over the top of the transom? Water came in even with the bow being relatively parallel to the horizon?

Why does the boat have no tach?

If this is a genuine story then it is remarkable. A picture would tell 1000 words....

Best of luck to you.

homey posted 01-07-2005 11:23 PM ET (US)     Profile for homey  Send Email to homey     
Is the water pouring in or splashed/sprayed from possible speedo mounted at transom waterline?? Some depth finders and or speedos mounted at the transom waterline can cause a vortex of water.
placerville posted 01-07-2005 11:59 PM ET (US)     Profile for placerville  Send Email to placerville     
No, I'm not a troll. I just didn't get on the web for a while. I bought the boat for what I thought was a good price but didn't put it in the water until yesterday.
I backed it in, and, low and behold, water is coming into the two transom splash well drain holes. You say that those should be above the waterline. I just figured that there were supposed to be drain plugs so I just rammed plastic bags in them and continued with the test run. No, the water didn't come over the transom lip. It didn't come in until I came up on plane, and it came up the engine column as Peter suggested. The trim switch on the throttle handle doesn't work so I went back to the motor and trimmed it down with the motor mounted switch. There's no pin in the lowest hole to limit travel. Then I ran it again and no water water came in but it still seemed like there was a spray pattern coming off the engine column. I had two 6 gallon gas cans. The two wing tanks are empty and in sad shape. David, you mentioned a 40 gal internal tank. Is there something under the floor? The plug I'm referring to is located outboard transom a few inches portside of the centerline of the boat. Homey, there is no transducer back there.

This boat is pretty stripped. No seats, tach, speedometer, compass, crummy unregistered trailer. I bought it cheap as a project boat with the intent to eventually repower and use it mainly as offshore fishing boat that me and my passengers have some protection from the weather.but also to camp a little out of it. Now I'm just hoping I didn't throw cheap money down a hole.

kamie posted 01-08-2005 04:17 AM ET (US)     Profile for kamie  Send Email to kamie     
placerville,

before you decide to junk the hull a couple of questions and some pictures would help.
1. At rest with the engine tilted down does water enter the drains in the splash well?

2. does it enter the drains if you have the engine tilted up?

3. What hole is the motor mounted in? Level with the transom or up one hole?

4. Can you take pictures of the boat in the water so we can see where the waterline is and take a friend with you and see if you can get shots of the water pouring over?

5. What condition are the thru hull drains? Are they in good shape or are they gone and your looking at foam or somthing in the middle.

To answer the question do you have water in the hull,probably but if she got up on plane, I wouldn't worry too much about it. You probably need to replace the drains and check any caulking and any screws or screwholes in the deck as that is a good source for water.

keep us posted

David Jenkins posted 01-08-2005 06:55 AM ET (US)     Profile for David Jenkins  Send Email to David Jenkins     
So when you say that water was "pouring" over the transom what you really meant was that a column of water was running up the engine shaft and coming into the boat. The water was coming in because of the engine setup, not because the boat was sitting too low in the water or because the bow was abnormally high. Right?

But on the other hand you say that the drains were below the waterline? Is that when the boat was halfway in the water but still on the trailer?

You should be able to pull every plug in that boat and get no water on the deck. That boat should be completely self-bailing. So get those plastic bags out of the two drain holes just above the waterline in the transom, open up the one at the bottom of the transom (if a "waterfall" comes out is is just because you are empying the live bait well), and take the plug out that is in front of the ledge that separates the large splashwell area from the rest of the boat (just starboard of the centerline). Open them all up. The boat will not sink.

You should be going close to 40 mph WOT if the engine is performing properly.

Where are you located?

placerville posted 01-08-2005 04:08 PM ET (US)     Profile for placerville  Send Email to placerville     
Before I answer those questions I'll tell you what I just did. I removed the plug I mentioned at the bottom of the transom. Less than a cup came out. I probed the hole with a rod and it went in about a foot into spongy material. The rod had a faint fiberglass smell. When the motor was mounted on the boat, a thin metal plate was placed both on the outside and inside of the transom. There are several bolts holding this plate in place.These could be a source of water in the hull. The motor is resting on the lip of the transom and the anti-ventilation plate is about 2-inches below the bottom of the hull.

Answers:
When I first backed it into the water, the motor was tilted up and the stern was just starting to float but the bow end was still somewhat on the trailer so that might have contributed to the stern being down. I just saw water coming into the drain holes so I jumped in the truck and hauled her out, bailed and then plugged the holes. The drain holes look intact, no obvious cracks.

David you're correct that water was coming up the engine column.

I need to take her out and try some of your suggestions. It seems like from what you're all saying, that the motor is too low.

Is that deep well in the back centerline a bait well, splash well or a place for a fuel tank?
I live east of Sacramento.
Thanks again for the input.

BOB KEMMLER JR posted 01-08-2005 04:17 PM ET (US)     Profile for BOB KEMMLER JR    
spongy?not good at all.
Peter posted 01-08-2005 04:42 PM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
The motor is mounted too low. Your anti-ventilation plate should be even with or just very slightly above the keel. Sounds like you would benefit by moving the motor up two holes.
David Jenkins posted 01-08-2005 06:14 PM ET (US)     Profile for David Jenkins  Send Email to David Jenkins     
Don't worry too much about the spongy foam; more than likely it is just spongy for 1/4 of an inch or so where it was in constant contact with the water. I'm guessing that what you were probing was the drain tube from the live bait well. It runs for about a foot though foam and then comes out inside the live bait well. It is to be expected that the copper lining has deteriorated and needs to be replaced. That is easy to do and we can guide you through it when the time comes.

The internal tank is midship. You can see screws in the deck holding down the access to it. It is six or eight feet long and about two feet wide. It will need to be replaced if it has not already been replaced. That is not a big deal, either.

As for water coming in the two drains at the waterline, that will definitely happen when you have the bow of the boat still on the trailer. That is normal. Keep those drains open.

My 19' was in the water for 30 years and had holes all over it and it had "soggy" foam where the copper drain tubes had deteriorated and it still floats like a cork with no plugs in it anywhere. So I am willing to bet that your boat is fine and that you just need to raise the engine two or three holes to stop that water from splashing in. But don't drill any new holes in the transom to accomplish that. Use a setback plate if necessary.

By all means, post a picture somewhere and let's have a look at it. You've got a classic boat and if you think that it will be too much trouble to refurbish then put it up for sale on this forum and someone here will take it off your hands!

placerville posted 01-08-2005 07:11 PM ET (US)     Profile for placerville  Send Email to placerville     
OK. I'm encouraged again. I'm anxious to get it out on the water and test your ideas. I'll get some pics when I do.
Guess I'll keep it, but when this boat is all fixed up, I'll will be selling my Montauk.
Royce posted 01-08-2005 09:33 PM ET (US)     Profile for Royce  Send Email to Royce     
Did you buy this boat from a seller near Morgan Hill?

Royce

placerville posted 01-09-2005 02:49 AM ET (US)     Profile for placerville  Send Email to placerville     
Sacramento. Why do you ask?
jimh posted 01-10-2005 08:52 AM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
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