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Author Topic:   1985 18 OUTRAGE; HONDA Four-Stroke

half shell posted 07-05-2005 09:02 AM ET (US)
Hello is anyone running a classic 18 outrage with a honda four stroke? If you are what size engine,performance,and static trim,and does the weight lend the boat to porpoise?
Thanks Bob
bwc8418 posted 07-06-2005 12:28 PM ET (US)
I have a 1984 18' Outrage, I am running a 2004 Honda 150, With just me on board and less than 10 gallons of gas, I have reg 48 MPH, by paddlewheel, and speedo of 47 MPH, still not bad. With five people and 1/2 tank + gear,I registered about 43, 44 MPH.
Static trim is probably less than an inch above where it used to be with the Johnson 150.
As far as porpoise, it will do that if you trim up too far, but with it trimmed normal it has not been a problem. I have the engine set up one hole up, and am running a Ballistic prop 14 1/2 X 19.
I am very happy with this set up.
pwitort posted 07-10-2005 03:24 PM ET (US)
do you get a listing to port when running at 20+ knots? i have that with my 150hp yamaha; i dont have trim tabs, but do have a 'dolphin or perhaps dolfin' extended plastic plate on the motor that was supposed to cure the problem, but didnt. I can sort of minimize the problem with the power tilt adjustment on the main motor, but if adjusted too much, the boat will start 'dolphining', so there is a limit/tradeoff now. Im trying to understand if a heavier motor will help or hinder the problem.
jimh posted 07-10-2005 05:06 PM ET (US)
The classic OUTRAGE 18 seems to have plenty of buoyancy to tolerate the 490-pounds of that Honda. Do you have any GPS data on speeds?
junerscuner posted 07-10-2005 08:38 PM ET (US)
I have a Honda 150 on 87 18 Outrage that is 3 months old. I do not have any listing. Still trying to find the right propeller. With a Honda 14.25X19 propeller 2 men, half tank of gas,2 ice chest with ice,and fishing gear the motor turned 5500-5600 rpm,45mph.With a third person 40 to 42 mph using a gps.Got a Solas New Saturn 14.25X17,the hole shot was much better but speed dropped 42mph and 6200 rpm 2 guys,with 3 guys 6000 to 6100 rpm 40mph.
I did see what bwc8418 said and checking into that ballistic prop.
I forgot to say I have trim tabs. I just removed 12X9 insta-trim and installed some Lenco 12X12 troll n tab.
The Lenco are a bit bigger and were install on the edge
of the boat.The performance is 100 times better.Now that I have had both electric and hydraulic,I like electric much more because the reaction is much quicker.I will never have a boat without trim tab.
Also far as the troll motors, there great,plenty of thrust and speed. The only problem is learning the foot control.
Relaced a 96 mercury 225 because I believed I was in a grey area with insuance,that was before ContinuousWave.
I was not real trilled spending $10,700 for the Honda after
having my new to me 87 outrage for a month,but I love this motor.The Honda start right up without priming fuel bulb,while it idle you can not hear it.At WOT all you hear is wind.The thing slip gas.
Can not go wrong with the Honda.Have any question e-mail me.
Q
bwc8418 posted 07-11-2005 07:04 AM ET (US)
I do experience listing to port until I trim her out, 20 knots sounds about right. I don't have tabs or a dolphin.
I do not have any GPS data, only the Honda Speedo, and the paddlewheel on the depthfinder.
pwitort posted 07-12-2005 02:35 PM ET (US)
thanks all.

concerning the:
The performance is 100 times better (trim tabs)
Can you explain what you are referring to here (and sell me on the idea of separate trim tabs :)
do you mainly use the trim tabs instead of the motor trim?
are they individually adjustable so you can correct the 'listing to port' problem?
as to the 150 honda going in the 87 outrage... do you have a kicker on this too? With my current yamaha (390 pounds )and 110 pound kicker, if two big men go to the back of the boat i can get water coming over the 'second ' transom (ie the other wall of the splashwell- not the transom; this is if i leave the drain plugs out of the splashwell. I'm concerned that with another 100 pounds hanging off the end of the boat, I will be making the problem measurably worse.

This raises another question.... I usually run in saltwater ( Oregon and California coast)... which, if any, of the 5 plugs do you recommend running without?
thanks,
paul
junerscuner posted 07-12-2005 10:31 PM ET (US)
the performance is better because of two thing i think,
the troll n tab are bigger 12x12 vs 12x9,the other reason i thing is the 12x9 were install on transon to far inware,they were about 14 inch from the side of the boat.i thing the previsous owner wanted to screw to wood.i install the troll n tabs edge on both sides where there no wood in that part of the transon.
sell you on trim tab ? with the 12x9 i would not trim the motor lower for a hole shot. i would trim the motor for speed then if i was porpoising you push both down buttons a bit to correct.if listing to one side push one of the down button to correct.just installed the lenco last week have not played with them to much yet.but ido like them more.
go to bennettrimtabs.com and lencomarine.com they will explain everything about trim tabs.
i do not have a kicker.what does two big men weight?I am 285 and and friend is 200lbs i do have water in the splash well but it does not come over.i use a plug in front and one in the sump. i will be putting three scupper on the transon.the scupper are one valve so to speak.it will not let water in but if water get in it go right out
this boat was design to use single or twin engines.two 75hp e-tec would come in at 640 lbs.you need to check out the water coming out the splash well

Q
jimh posted 07-12-2005 10:53 PM ET (US)
Sometimes a very heavy motor will make a relatively light boat like an OUTRAGE 18 be somewhat heavy in the stern. Typically a stern heavy boat will benefit from the effect of trim tabs. You should think of trim tabs as stern lifters--that is what they do. They cannot really raise the bow, they lower the bow by raising the stern. When you adjust the trim tabs you either remove their effect entirely, which puts the bow back where it naturally would go, or you engage the trim tabs to lift the stern, which effectively lowers the bow.
Trim tabs are adjusted individually so that they can be used to offset any side-to-side trim problems. A Boston Whaler boat will often have substantial lean to windward and be quite sensitive to weight distribution. You can overcome some of this with trim tabs, or, more directly, you can redistribute crew weight.
The choice of propeller can also have an effect on the boat's trim when underway. Some propellers provide more stern lift than others. If you have a boat rigged with a heavy motor, it may be advisable to use a propeller that has more stern lift. You won't need a bow-lift propeller, because the weight of the engine will create bow lift in the form of the static trim being bow-high.
As for porpoising--the repeated oscillation of the bow up and down which occurs in certain trim and wave conditions--this can happen in any boat and usually can be corrected with careful engine trim. It seems to be more problematic is some hulls. I would not characterize the classic OUTRAGE 18 hull as being prone to porpoising.
Information about how to use the thru-hull drains in a Boston Whaler boat is contained in the owner's manual. There is a complete reproduction of the Boston Whaler owner's manual available here on the website. A thorough reading of this document will answer many questions.
Owner's Manual
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/manual18-25/
pwitort posted 07-15-2005 12:03 AM ET (US)
the water does not come over when people are standing there although the splash well would get a lot of water in it ( with 110# of lead and me by the splashwell - 330# total weight there was about 16 gallons of water in the splashwell ( I measured it)).add two more guys and Ill bet the amount of water doubles or more and gets alarmingly deep. Ill have to try that next time at the dock. That water is the equivalent of another light person or two in the back of the boat. This is part of what is convincing me to keep the splash well emptied out. Why do they call it a splashwell if its got to be kept dry? :)

Junerspooner- do you go in the ocean or mainly rivers/lakes? do you use a sump and plugs in the splashwell? Is the 10" jack used to give you use of the splashwell for storage? You have a lot of extra weight back there, ... what engine/weight do you have?

The remaining area of concern is the listing. I was able to trim up to eliminate most of the listing, but still had some left (had to stop because of porpising). The 'sweet spot' of no porpise still leaves a little list... next action is to adjust the trim tab (anode) on whatever new motor I get.... got my fingers crossed there, shure would like to avoid putting another 100 pounds back there for trim tabs :(

junerscuner posted 07-16-2005 05:00 PM ET (US)
Hey Paul got Honda 150
The trim tab do not weight 100 lbs, I have two trolling motors, one on each tab.
I plug the sump the splashwell are unplugged.
The jack plate was on the boat when I got it but it is great for storage ,two 54 qt ice chest fit in splashwell.
Right now been fishing the marshs of southeast Louisiana,plan to go Gulf of Mexico soon. When I First got
the 18 OR I did alot of boat riding in Lake Pontchartrain,it in the city of New Orleans.On Easter sunday had 3to 5 foot seas 3 adults 2 Kids .No problem with water coming out splashwell.It can be as bad as the gulf.
Two points,water does not come over the transon when you stop fast, maybe you have water trapped in gas tank area or the form is water logged.
Going fishing tomorrow,I will try to remember to take some pistures.
Q
pwitort posted 07-20-2005 10:40 AM ET (US)
Relatives visiting so just saw the great picts now ... those trolling motors look like afterburners for a boat...with the right gauge wire I'll bet they could add 15mph to your top end :)
Those are hefty trim tabs, look like they would do the job.
jimh posted 07-20-2005 11:18 AM ET (US)
Removed a lot of gobbledygook trying to link to
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/leesam9999/my_photos

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Author	Topic: 1985 18 OUTRAGE; HONDA Four-Stroke
half shell	posted 07-05-2005 09:02 AM ET (US) Hello is anyone running a classic 18 outrage with a honda four stroke? If you are what size engine,performance,and static trim,and does the weight lend the boat to porpoise? Thanks Bob
bwc8418	posted 07-06-2005 12:28 PM ET (US) I have a 1984 18' Outrage, I am running a 2004 Honda 150, With just me on board and less than 10 gallons of gas, I have reg 48 MPH, by paddlewheel, and speedo of 47 MPH, still not bad. With five people and 1/2 tank + gear,I registered about 43, 44 MPH. Static trim is probably less than an inch above where it used to be with the Johnson 150. As far as porpoise, it will do that if you trim up too far, but with it trimmed normal it has not been a problem. I have the engine set up one hole up, and am running a Ballistic prop 14 1/2 X 19. I am very happy with this set up.
pwitort	posted 07-10-2005 03:24 PM ET (US) do you get a listing to port when running at 20+ knots? i have that with my 150hp yamaha; i dont have trim tabs, but do have a 'dolphin or perhaps dolfin' extended plastic plate on the motor that was supposed to cure the problem, but didnt. I can sort of minimize the problem with the power tilt adjustment on the main motor, but if adjusted too much, the boat will start 'dolphining', so there is a limit/tradeoff now. Im trying to understand if a heavier motor will help or hinder the problem.
jimh	posted 07-10-2005 05:06 PM ET (US) The classic OUTRAGE 18 seems to have plenty of buoyancy to tolerate the 490-pounds of that Honda. Do you have any GPS data on speeds?
junerscuner	posted 07-10-2005 08:38 PM ET (US) I have a Honda 150 on 87 18 Outrage that is 3 months old. I do not have any listing. Still trying to find the right propeller. With a Honda 14.25X19 propeller 2 men, half tank of gas,2 ice chest with ice,and fishing gear the motor turned 5500-5600 rpm,45mph.With a third person 40 to 42 mph using a gps.Got a Solas New Saturn 14.25X17,the hole shot was much better but speed dropped 42mph and 6200 rpm 2 guys,with 3 guys 6000 to 6100 rpm 40mph. I did see what bwc8418 said and checking into that ballistic prop. I forgot to say I have trim tabs. I just removed 12X9 insta-trim and installed some Lenco 12X12 troll n tab. The Lenco are a bit bigger and were install on the edge of the boat.The performance is 100 times better.Now that I have had both electric and hydraulic,I like electric much more because the reaction is much quicker.I will never have a boat without trim tab. Also far as the troll motors, there great,plenty of thrust and speed. The only problem is learning the foot control. Relaced a 96 mercury 225 because I believed I was in a grey area with insuance,that was before ContinuousWave. I was not real trilled spending $10,700 for the Honda after having my new to me 87 outrage for a month,but I love this motor.The Honda start right up without priming fuel bulb,while it idle you can not hear it.At WOT all you hear is wind.The thing slip gas. Can not go wrong with the Honda.Have any question e-mail me. Q
bwc8418	posted 07-11-2005 07:04 AM ET (US) I do experience listing to port until I trim her out, 20 knots sounds about right. I don't have tabs or a dolphin. I do not have any GPS data, only the Honda Speedo, and the paddlewheel on the depthfinder.
pwitort	posted 07-12-2005 02:35 PM ET (US) thanks all. concerning the: The performance is 100 times better (trim tabs) Can you explain what you are referring to here (and sell me on the idea of separate trim tabs :) do you mainly use the trim tabs instead of the motor trim? are they individually adjustable so you can correct the 'listing to port' problem? as to the 150 honda going in the 87 outrage... do you have a kicker on this too? With my current yamaha (390 pounds )and 110 pound kicker, if two big men go to the back of the boat i can get water coming over the 'second ' transom (ie the other wall of the splashwell- not the transom; this is if i leave the drain plugs out of the splashwell. I'm concerned that with another 100 pounds hanging off the end of the boat, I will be making the problem measurably worse. This raises another question.... I usually run in saltwater ( Oregon and California coast)... which, if any, of the 5 plugs do you recommend running without? thanks, paul
junerscuner	posted 07-12-2005 10:31 PM ET (US) the performance is better because of two thing i think, the troll n tab are bigger 12x12 vs 12x9,the other reason i thing is the 12x9 were install on transon to far inware,they were about 14 inch from the side of the boat.i thing the previsous owner wanted to screw to wood.i install the troll n tabs edge on both sides where there no wood in that part of the transon. sell you on trim tab ? with the 12x9 i would not trim the motor lower for a hole shot. i would trim the motor for speed then if i was porpoising you push both down buttons a bit to correct.if listing to one side push one of the down button to correct.just installed the lenco last week have not played with them to much yet.but ido like them more. go to bennettrimtabs.com and lencomarine.com they will explain everything about trim tabs. i do not have a kicker.what does two big men weight?I am 285 and and friend is 200lbs i do have water in the splash well but it does not come over.i use a plug in front and one in the sump. i will be putting three scupper on the transon.the scupper are one valve so to speak.it will not let water in but if water get in it go right out this boat was design to use single or twin engines.two 75hp e-tec would come in at 640 lbs.you need to check out the water coming out the splash well Q
jimh	posted 07-12-2005 10:53 PM ET (US) Sometimes a very heavy motor will make a relatively light boat like an OUTRAGE 18 be somewhat heavy in the stern. Typically a stern heavy boat will benefit from the effect of trim tabs. You should think of trim tabs as stern lifters--that is what they do. They cannot really raise the bow, they lower the bow by raising the stern. When you adjust the trim tabs you either remove their effect entirely, which puts the bow back where it naturally would go, or you engage the trim tabs to lift the stern, which effectively lowers the bow. Trim tabs are adjusted individually so that they can be used to offset any side-to-side trim problems. A Boston Whaler boat will often have substantial lean to windward and be quite sensitive to weight distribution. You can overcome some of this with trim tabs, or, more directly, you can redistribute crew weight. The choice of propeller can also have an effect on the boat's trim when underway. Some propellers provide more stern lift than others. If you have a boat rigged with a heavy motor, it may be advisable to use a propeller that has more stern lift. You won't need a bow-lift propeller, because the weight of the engine will create bow lift in the form of the static trim being bow-high. As for porpoising--the repeated oscillation of the bow up and down which occurs in certain trim and wave conditions--this can happen in any boat and usually can be corrected with careful engine trim. It seems to be more problematic is some hulls. I would not characterize the classic OUTRAGE 18 hull as being prone to porpoising. Information about how to use the thru-hull drains in a Boston Whaler boat is contained in the owner's manual. There is a complete reproduction of the Boston Whaler owner's manual available here on the website. A thorough reading of this document will answer many questions. Owner's Manual http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/manual18-25/
pwitort	posted 07-15-2005 12:03 AM ET (US) the water does not come over when people are standing there although the splash well would get a lot of water in it ( with 110# of lead and me by the splashwell - 330# total weight there was about 16 gallons of water in the splashwell ( I measured it)).add two more guys and Ill bet the amount of water doubles or more and gets alarmingly deep. Ill have to try that next time at the dock. That water is the equivalent of another light person or two in the back of the boat. This is part of what is convincing me to keep the splash well emptied out. Why do they call it a splashwell if its got to be kept dry? :) Junerspooner- do you go in the ocean or mainly rivers/lakes? do you use a sump and plugs in the splashwell? Is the 10" jack used to give you use of the splashwell for storage? You have a lot of extra weight back there, ... what engine/weight do you have? The remaining area of concern is the listing. I was able to trim up to eliminate most of the listing, but still had some left (had to stop because of porpising). The 'sweet spot' of no porpise still leaves a little list... next action is to adjust the trim tab (anode) on whatever new motor I get.... got my fingers crossed there, shure would like to avoid putting another 100 pounds back there for trim tabs :(
junerscuner	posted 07-16-2005 05:00 PM ET (US) Hey Paul got Honda 150 The trim tab do not weight 100 lbs, I have two trolling motors, one on each tab. I plug the sump the splashwell are unplugged. The jack plate was on the boat when I got it but it is great for storage ,two 54 qt ice chest fit in splashwell. Right now been fishing the marshs of southeast Louisiana,plan to go Gulf of Mexico soon. When I First got the 18 OR I did alot of boat riding in Lake Pontchartrain,it in the city of New Orleans.On Easter sunday had 3to 5 foot seas 3 adults 2 Kids .No problem with water coming out splashwell.It can be as bad as the gulf. Two points,water does not come over the transon when you stop fast, maybe you have water trapped in gas tank area or the form is water logged. Going fishing tomorrow,I will try to remember to take some pistures. Q
pwitort	posted 07-20-2005 10:40 AM ET (US) Relatives visiting so just saw the great picts now ... those trolling motors look like afterburners for a boat...with the right gauge wire I'll bet they could add 15mph to your top end :) Those are hefty trim tabs, look like they would do the job.
jimh	posted 07-20-2005 11:18 AM ET (US) Removed a lot of gobbledygook trying to link to http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/leesam9999/my_photos