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Author Topic:   Optimax 135 "normal" temp range at idle

bkloss posted 07-11-2005 01:15 PM ET (US)
I have a 2004 Dauntless 180 w/optimax 135. I have 160 hrs on the motor, I run Optimax DFI oil, quickclean in every tank, flush after every trip (used 90% in saltwater) and the motor run flawlessly "except" that at idle, 500 -1000 rpms, my water temps fluctuate between 140 - 163 degrees and earlier this year the alarm activated at 180 degrees (500 rpms). I brought it into an authorized Merc dealer who replaced the impeller and "flushed" the system. I still have the same temp readings. The water pressure reads 1.2 until it hits about 143 degrees and then it drops to about .6 - 1.0 (presumably when the thermostats open) Anything above 1000 rpms and my temps drop to 120 degrees and then about 97 degrees at cruising speed (4500 rpms and water pressure 3.5 - 5.0) which seems normal to me. Please note that sea temp is 62 -68 degrees and air temp is 72 degrees.
I now have the service manual and I have pulled the strainer plug from the black and cleaned a small amount of kelp from the intake side as well as flushed the system, but did not drop the lower unit. I also noticed that the intake hose going to the port thermostat was crimped at the top and was greatly restricted at the bend attaching to the thermostat housing. The dealer "ordered" the hose (the original was not a formed hose which seemed odd?) but in the meantime I removed the hose and flip flopped it so that I could see if this was contributing to the temp readings. It didn't make any difference. I guess that my next step would be to remove the thermostats, check and/or replace and re-check the impeller. I called Mercury and they said that it could be thermostats, a stuck poppet valve or a restriction (since the impeller replacement made no difference. Mercury said that the normal temp should be 120-140 degrees in 62 degree water at 500 rpm. I don't think that it is a faulty sensor as I see water vapor in the exhaust as well. By the way, sticking the lower unit in a 60 gallon tub and running the motor in water that was about 90-95 degrees made little difference to the temps - almost a constant 154 degrees.
I assumed by taking it to the dealer that the problem would be resolved (for the money charged, the motor should have been polished as well!) but that's another story. I just want to find the problem, fix it myself and quit looking at the smartcraft gauge every minute or so as I am trolling or running at 5 mph. Only having one motor and not wanting any major mechanical problems will do it for me. Does anybody have any ideas? What are your normal Optimax temps at low speed? Is the impeller not spinning fast enough?
If my car was overheating and it was within the warranty period - it would be covered. Why is this not? (so says the dealer)or maybe it is if the problem gets worse and the engine siezes up...
Slightly frustrated...Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Brian
njwhaler posted 07-11-2005 08:33 PM ET (US)
I have the same boat and motor set up, but the year is 2002. At idle, I am at 115 - 135 degrees.
lurkynot posted 07-12-2005 10:45 PM ET (US)
bkloss, could'nt agree with you more about the boat being waxed for what my local so-called authorized Mercury "stealership" charged me for the same go around earlier this spring during the 1st outing this year I had an identical problem with my 01'135 Opti. I'll try to condense what I learned. Supposedly the engines run hotter especially inherent at idle because of there California approved status. Thus improving emmissions. Below I have pasted the reply I recieved from Mercury Customer Service during this go around that cost me a bundle to ultimately find out there was nothing and I mean nothing wrong with the motor. Hope this sheds some light.
As per our phone conversation the invoice that I received of your repairs
are part of normal maintenance and unfortunately we cannot reimburse for
these charges. As per your owner's manual, spark plugs, impellers, filters
are all part of normal maintenance and are recommended to be replaced after
100 hours or once a year whichever occurs first (more often if overheating
occurs or reduced water pressure is noted).
The heat codes referenced to on the invoice are in the normal range for
both the starboard and port engines. As long as the heat codes are below
165 degrees depending on the block pressure and rpm range the engine is
perfoming at. These heat code numbers can be at different ranges depending
on the block pressure and rpm range.
You can monitor both engines, however you can only read coolant head temp
off of starboard engine. The dealer can read these heat codes off of his
CDS or DDT tools.
I hope this information is helpful to you, should you need further
assistance please contact our office at 920-929-5040 or fax at 920-929-5893
between the hours of 7:30 a.m. and 5:30 p.m., Monday through Friday,
central time.
Sincerely,
Mercury Outboad Customer Service
Ref: 2005-93054
This e-mail message may contain confidential or privileged information. If
you are not the intended recipient, please delete the message and any
attachments and notify the sender by return e-mail. You should not retain,
distribute, disclose, or use any of the information in this message.
bkloss posted 07-13-2005 10:19 AM ET (US)
Thanks for the replies so far. Makes sense about the emissions so I guess I should feel environmentally good that I am now located in CA and doing my part. My spark plugs stay nice and clean with that extra warmth as well-original set of plugs. Unfortunately my motor did throw an error on the port side in the Spring. Last night I removed the thermostats and they look brand new. I need to find a thermometer so I can test them; would an automotive parts store have that? Otherwise I will replace them and put new gaskets on. Then I'm going to check the poppet valve. The poppet valve should stay closed at low rpm - right? So how could it cause any type of overheating at LOW rpms? I understand the heat buildup if it didn't open at high rpm. I've flushed and flushed the head and hoses so there are no restrictions. After that I will drop the lower unit and check the impeller. Other than the impeller; is there anything else in the lower unit that I should check that assists in drawing that water up to the head at low rpms?
Brian
bkloss posted 07-13-2005 11:04 PM ET (US)
I tested the thermostats and they open at 143 degrees as designed. Re-installed them and ran the motor with muffs - 500 rpm, 154 degrees, .6 psi. If I kick the idle up to 800 rpms then I get 1.0 psi and 147 degrees. The service manual shows the specs at idle to be "1.0-3.0 PSI" No mention of temps though.
I noticed that the poppet valve doesn't appear to be a "Mercury maintenance item".......Warranty, maybe? How hard is it to inspect or replace?
Maybe I should just re-check/re-do the water pump job that I had done 40 days ago.
It's fun working on this after work when its 93+ degrees in the driveway. Can't wait to get it back out on the water AFTER I figure this out, one way or another! Yellowtail are starting to bite....
bkloss posted 07-16-2005 07:16 PM ET (US)
Checked impeller - replaced it and gaskets (only because I was there..)
I spoke with Mercury and they say that it is probably the poppet and that the issue would be covered under warranty now that the maintenance items were done. I have scheduled an appointment and hopefully this will remedy the low water pressure and the "elevated temps" at idle.
I sure have learned a lot more about this motor in the last 2 weeks, which is definitely worth the time.
lakeman posted 07-17-2005 08:57 PM ET (US)
I have a 2000opti 135 and had similar problems. The fix, or apparents fix was a completely new and replumbed popit valve system. I/dealer (friend) wents through 6 reps to solve the problem, but it still runs too hot at times, just may be the nature of the beast or over sensitive sensors. Any way as others have said, check the popit valve system.
bsmotril posted 07-17-2005 11:41 PM ET (US)
Don't overlook the sensor on the head of the air compressor. It will also generate a temp fault if the compressor is running hot. In 100 degrees plus ambient air temps, it is not uncommond to get intermittant compressor temp faults. BillS

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Author	Topic: Optimax 135 "normal" temp range at idle
bkloss	posted 07-11-2005 01:15 PM ET (US) I have a 2004 Dauntless 180 w/optimax 135. I have 160 hrs on the motor, I run Optimax DFI oil, quickclean in every tank, flush after every trip (used 90% in saltwater) and the motor run flawlessly "except" that at idle, 500 -1000 rpms, my water temps fluctuate between 140 - 163 degrees and earlier this year the alarm activated at 180 degrees (500 rpms). I brought it into an authorized Merc dealer who replaced the impeller and "flushed" the system. I still have the same temp readings. The water pressure reads 1.2 until it hits about 143 degrees and then it drops to about .6 - 1.0 (presumably when the thermostats open) Anything above 1000 rpms and my temps drop to 120 degrees and then about 97 degrees at cruising speed (4500 rpms and water pressure 3.5 - 5.0) which seems normal to me. Please note that sea temp is 62 -68 degrees and air temp is 72 degrees. I now have the service manual and I have pulled the strainer plug from the black and cleaned a small amount of kelp from the intake side as well as flushed the system, but did not drop the lower unit. I also noticed that the intake hose going to the port thermostat was crimped at the top and was greatly restricted at the bend attaching to the thermostat housing. The dealer "ordered" the hose (the original was not a formed hose which seemed odd?) but in the meantime I removed the hose and flip flopped it so that I could see if this was contributing to the temp readings. It didn't make any difference. I guess that my next step would be to remove the thermostats, check and/or replace and re-check the impeller. I called Mercury and they said that it could be thermostats, a stuck poppet valve or a restriction (since the impeller replacement made no difference. Mercury said that the normal temp should be 120-140 degrees in 62 degree water at 500 rpm. I don't think that it is a faulty sensor as I see water vapor in the exhaust as well. By the way, sticking the lower unit in a 60 gallon tub and running the motor in water that was about 90-95 degrees made little difference to the temps - almost a constant 154 degrees. I assumed by taking it to the dealer that the problem would be resolved (for the money charged, the motor should have been polished as well!) but that's another story. I just want to find the problem, fix it myself and quit looking at the smartcraft gauge every minute or so as I am trolling or running at 5 mph. Only having one motor and not wanting any major mechanical problems will do it for me. Does anybody have any ideas? What are your normal Optimax temps at low speed? Is the impeller not spinning fast enough? If my car was overheating and it was within the warranty period - it would be covered. Why is this not? (so says the dealer)or maybe it is if the problem gets worse and the engine siezes up... Slightly frustrated...Any help would be greatly appreciated. Brian
njwhaler	posted 07-11-2005 08:33 PM ET (US) I have the same boat and motor set up, but the year is 2002. At idle, I am at 115 - 135 degrees.
lurkynot	posted 07-12-2005 10:45 PM ET (US) bkloss, could'nt agree with you more about the boat being waxed for what my local so-called authorized Mercury "stealership" charged me for the same go around earlier this spring during the 1st outing this year I had an identical problem with my 01'135 Opti. I'll try to condense what I learned. Supposedly the engines run hotter especially inherent at idle because of there California approved status. Thus improving emmissions. Below I have pasted the reply I recieved from Mercury Customer Service during this go around that cost me a bundle to ultimately find out there was nothing and I mean nothing wrong with the motor. Hope this sheds some light. As per our phone conversation the invoice that I received of your repairs are part of normal maintenance and unfortunately we cannot reimburse for these charges. As per your owner's manual, spark plugs, impellers, filters are all part of normal maintenance and are recommended to be replaced after 100 hours or once a year whichever occurs first (more often if overheating occurs or reduced water pressure is noted). The heat codes referenced to on the invoice are in the normal range for both the starboard and port engines. As long as the heat codes are below 165 degrees depending on the block pressure and rpm range the engine is perfoming at. These heat code numbers can be at different ranges depending on the block pressure and rpm range. You can monitor both engines, however you can only read coolant head temp off of starboard engine. The dealer can read these heat codes off of his CDS or DDT tools. I hope this information is helpful to you, should you need further assistance please contact our office at 920-929-5040 or fax at 920-929-5893 between the hours of 7:30 a.m. and 5:30 p.m., Monday through Friday, central time. Sincerely, Mercury Outboad Customer Service Ref: 2005-93054 This e-mail message may contain confidential or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete the message and any attachments and notify the sender by return e-mail. You should not retain, distribute, disclose, or use any of the information in this message.
bkloss	posted 07-13-2005 10:19 AM ET (US) Thanks for the replies so far. Makes sense about the emissions so I guess I should feel environmentally good that I am now located in CA and doing my part. My spark plugs stay nice and clean with that extra warmth as well-original set of plugs. Unfortunately my motor did throw an error on the port side in the Spring. Last night I removed the thermostats and they look brand new. I need to find a thermometer so I can test them; would an automotive parts store have that? Otherwise I will replace them and put new gaskets on. Then I'm going to check the poppet valve. The poppet valve should stay closed at low rpm - right? So how could it cause any type of overheating at LOW rpms? I understand the heat buildup if it didn't open at high rpm. I've flushed and flushed the head and hoses so there are no restrictions. After that I will drop the lower unit and check the impeller. Other than the impeller; is there anything else in the lower unit that I should check that assists in drawing that water up to the head at low rpms? Brian
bkloss	posted 07-13-2005 11:04 PM ET (US) I tested the thermostats and they open at 143 degrees as designed. Re-installed them and ran the motor with muffs - 500 rpm, 154 degrees, .6 psi. If I kick the idle up to 800 rpms then I get 1.0 psi and 147 degrees. The service manual shows the specs at idle to be "1.0-3.0 PSI" No mention of temps though. I noticed that the poppet valve doesn't appear to be a "Mercury maintenance item".......Warranty, maybe? How hard is it to inspect or replace? Maybe I should just re-check/re-do the water pump job that I had done 40 days ago. It's fun working on this after work when its 93+ degrees in the driveway. Can't wait to get it back out on the water AFTER I figure this out, one way or another! Yellowtail are starting to bite....
bkloss	posted 07-16-2005 07:16 PM ET (US) Checked impeller - replaced it and gaskets (only because I was there..) I spoke with Mercury and they say that it is probably the poppet and that the issue would be covered under warranty now that the maintenance items were done. I have scheduled an appointment and hopefully this will remedy the low water pressure and the "elevated temps" at idle. I sure have learned a lot more about this motor in the last 2 weeks, which is definitely worth the time.
lakeman	posted 07-17-2005 08:57 PM ET (US) I have a 2000opti 135 and had similar problems. The fix, or apparents fix was a completely new and replumbed popit valve system. I/dealer (friend) wents through 6 reps to solve the problem, but it still runs too hot at times, just may be the nature of the beast or over sensitive sensors. Any way as others have said, check the popit valve system.
bsmotril	posted 07-17-2005 11:41 PM ET (US) Don't overlook the sensor on the head of the air compressor. It will also generate a temp fault if the compressor is running hot. In 100 degrees plus ambient air temps, it is not uncommond to get intermittant compressor temp faults. BillS