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Author Topic:   MONTAUK 17 Re-power: 60-HP Four-stroke

PCBrev posted 06-06-2006 10:48 PM ET (US)
Hi everybody, I need your help. Will a 60-HP Johnson four-stroke do alright on a MONTAUK 17? I think it will. I realize it won't do what a 90-HP would do. Give me your thoughts.
It's a 17' Montauk and it would be mostly fishing in Portsmouth, Hew Hampshire, area one week a year at the lake,. I might do a few weekends on lakes. When on the lake we do tube and ski. I have daughters that are all 125 lbs or less. We've been using a 1989 40-HP on a 15-footer and had a blast. I can get a sweet deal on a 2002 60-HP Johnson four-stroke and have plenty of power but would lose some low end grunt and 5-MPH [compared to some other motor].
17 bodega posted 06-07-2006 01:11 AM ET (US)
Most people here will tell you no, but I bought my classic 16/17 (from 1971, a lighter hull than yours) with a yamaha 50 four stroke, which is considered by most to be minimum power. I fish in the ocean where the water gets pretty rough and on most days you can't do over 30 mph safely, so my top speed is 30. Not a great combo if you waterski, or want a top speed of 40 or so. I like the gas mileage and the lighter weight on the back.
It's all about your preferences. I woudn't change anything about my boat, but I'm in a select minority. I get to the fishing hole 5 or 10 minutes later than everyone else, and I think I have a boat that is safer with more freeboard at the transom. No biggie.
The thing I have found is there are advantages and disadvantages of both schools of thought. No free lunch on either side of the fence. Some might suggest an E-TEC 90 will solve all your needs..
Anyway, good luck and talk to lots of expereinced boaters about your needs and desires for your boating.

PCBrev posted 06-07-2006 07:23 AM ET (US)
Thank you for the info, I have wanted a whaler for a long time you dont find many older boats with newer motors. I cant take a chance on an older 2 stroke because I dont have enought $$$ behind me to repalce if it went bad shortly after I buy it.
The deal I found has a 2002 60 hp 4s Johnson so I could have piece of mind about an engine that should have years of trouble free operation.
Any other thoughts?
TC Goldman posted 06-07-2006 09:34 AM ET (US)
Here's what I would do. If it really is a "great" deal on the 60; I would try it and see how it works for Your needs. If it is a little underpowered, then You could always sell it or trade it in (if You got it for a great deal, then You shouldn't lose anything in a trade/sell).
Good Luck.
Todd
evogroup posted 06-07-2006 10:34 AM ET (US)
I'm thinking of doing the same thing with my Montauk to replace an '86 90hp Johnson, but most likely a new Yamaha or Merc 4S.
Pretty much because I want an engine under 300# and F.I.
All the 75's are just 90's w/ 75 hp.
A 90 hp e-tec comes close, but also comes close to $10K installed around here.
The 60 e-tec is only a 2 cyl. which seems like it would lack the torque.
I am looking for super quite and dependable, get up on plane reasonably quick and top out in mid-high 30's with light load.
What do people think about the hi-thrust/big foot option? The guy I spoke to at Whaler recommended it.
Tom W Clark posted 06-07-2006 11:16 AM ET (US)
Paige,
I do not have any personal experience with the Johnson (Suzuki) 60 HP outboard but I have driven Montauks powered by 60 HP four stokes I am sure it will be fine for your intended purposes.
I am less confident of your assessment that buying a four year old four stroke instead of an "older two stroke" is necessarily a safer financial decision. Many older two strokes are simpler more reliable and less costly to maintain than modern four strokes.
As with any purchase of a used piece of equipment, past usage history and current condition will have much to do with future reliability.
Dick posted 06-07-2006 11:23 AM ET (US)
I had a 99 17 Montauk with a Merc 50 4 stk and with a light load it would turn 33 mph, it fit my needs well.
I now have an 06 150 Montauk with the Merc 60 Big Foot 4 stk, this is one awsome motor and I think it would be great on a classic Montauk.
PCBrev posted 06-07-2006 12:15 PM ET (US)
Thank you everyone for your comments, very helpful.
Regarding older 2 strokes..... I am a big 2 stroke fan = power to weight and like syn oil as well.
I'm more talking about a 23 year old motor vs a 4 yr old motor(2 season on boat), and on average I should have better luck with all things being equal, which we all know they never are.
I am so happy to find this forum, the information is more than I could have dreamed and it's all in one place.
Let the restoration begin!
The Judge posted 06-07-2006 12:38 PM ET (US)
My friend has a 79 montauk with a 2000 suzuki 60hp and she cruises the same as my 70hp suzuki but is about 3+ mph slower so about 35+. Except for WOT you do not notice the difference between the 2 engines.
PCBrev posted 06-07-2006 07:04 PM ET (US)
Sounds like my expectations are realistic.
Like with anything used with no warranty I'm taking a chance and in the end if the motor runs well but I want more power I can always upgrade to a 90hp.
I'll follow up this summer after skiing and tubing and give my opinions.
Next is prop selection........
The Judge posted 06-07-2006 09:23 PM ET (US)
13.25 x 17 if tubing. 13x18 if not.
Tom W Clark posted 06-07-2006 09:24 PM ET (US)
Nick,
Don't the Suzuki motors use larger diameter props (like 14") becuase of their lower gearing?
PCBrev posted 06-09-2006 08:06 AM ET (US)
Judge and Tom, mine is the Suzuki - Johnson motor.
Would be for tubing thanks, PCB
The Judge posted 06-09-2006 01:17 PM ET (US)
Tom in my experience(8 different props) in the 60-70 range they do not need the bigger diameter. Mine came with a 14x17 and the holeshot was weak and top end suffered compared to the 13.25x17. Maybe on a heavier boat. My best prop was the Zuki 13x18 SST.
With the 90-140 engines, yes they need the 14" to give a decent cruise in my opinion.
PCBrev posted 06-09-2006 09:08 PM ET (US)
OK, I have some idea of size, now to stainless or aluminum.
Pros and cons with my 60hp? I've always thought ss would do more damage to motor if it hits something vs alum. would break and be the weak link. The ss would also give 2-3 mph.
Tom has an interesting point but ill let him explain.
jwkennedy posted 06-10-2006 05:41 PM ET (US)
Timely thread for me. I have a'75 Montauk that needs repowering and I'm debating the same issue. I can get a pretty good deal on a 4-stroke Yam 60...$6200 on the boat, out the door with new controls. It makes no sense to go to a 75, since it's the 90 with less power and all the weight. The 90 4-stroke is $8200.
I skied behind a 15-foot Super Sport with a 40hp as a kid with 3 guys in the boat...certainly wasn't like my rich friend's ski-nautique, but it was still fun.
Joe Kriz posted 06-10-2006 06:31 PM ET (US)
Just to put some prices in perspective.
Ed's has the 90 hp E-Tec for $6,999
http://www.edsmarinesuperstore.com/evinrude.htm
If a person already has the Evinrude gauges and engine controls, then the upgrade wouldn't necessarily have to include all the extras except for a System Check gauge.
Just a thought....
pasino posted 06-12-2006 01:25 AM ET (US)
Hi, I had a 1980 montauk with a four stroke yamaha 60 hp. On my opinion it was too underpowered. With four persons I could hardly reach 25 mph with 5 GPH fuel consumption. Now I put a 4 stroke yamaha 115hp, result: 46 mph and less fuel consumption at criuse speed (28 mph), I didn't yet test it, but I think it's about 3 GPH.
The Judge posted 06-12-2006 12:50 PM ET (US)
My 115 4 stroke burns 4-5gph @ 4k, almost double of the 70hp.
PCBrev posted 06-12-2006 09:16 PM ET (US)
Well I'll have a chance to put the boat in on Friday (1st time....wont sleep Thurs. night) and I'll have my GPS with me for some testing. Sunday, Fathers day, I'll be out witht the family for another test. We'll be Stripper fishing so the tube test, (?) will have to wait.
I'll post some MPH and times to achieve them.
I'm going to test with the prop that is on it, has 2 dings.
I've been wrenching/cleaning/polishing and reading CW and need some time in her to enjoy the work Ive done so far...
Removed all decals/#'s/adhesive, rubbing compond,finesse it II, wax, tightened rails, epoxy small holes, ran new wires,
cooler install, Hall's.........
Still grinning from ear to ear.

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Author	Topic: MONTAUK 17 Re-power: 60-HP Four-stroke
PCBrev	posted 06-06-2006 10:48 PM ET (US) Hi everybody, I need your help. Will a 60-HP Johnson four-stroke do alright on a MONTAUK 17? I think it will. I realize it won't do what a 90-HP would do. Give me your thoughts. It's a 17' Montauk and it would be mostly fishing in Portsmouth, Hew Hampshire, area one week a year at the lake,. I might do a few weekends on lakes. When on the lake we do tube and ski. I have daughters that are all 125 lbs or less. We've been using a 1989 40-HP on a 15-footer and had a blast. I can get a sweet deal on a 2002 60-HP Johnson four-stroke and have plenty of power but would lose some low end grunt and 5-MPH [compared to some other motor].
17 bodega	posted 06-07-2006 01:11 AM ET (US) Most people here will tell you no, but I bought my classic 16/17 (from 1971, a lighter hull than yours) with a yamaha 50 four stroke, which is considered by most to be minimum power. I fish in the ocean where the water gets pretty rough and on most days you can't do over 30 mph safely, so my top speed is 30. Not a great combo if you waterski, or want a top speed of 40 or so. I like the gas mileage and the lighter weight on the back. It's all about your preferences. I woudn't change anything about my boat, but I'm in a select minority. I get to the fishing hole 5 or 10 minutes later than everyone else, and I think I have a boat that is safer with more freeboard at the transom. No biggie. The thing I have found is there are advantages and disadvantages of both schools of thought. No free lunch on either side of the fence. Some might suggest an E-TEC 90 will solve all your needs.. Anyway, good luck and talk to lots of expereinced boaters about your needs and desires for your boating.
PCBrev	posted 06-07-2006 07:23 AM ET (US) Thank you for the info, I have wanted a whaler for a long time you dont find many older boats with newer motors. I cant take a chance on an older 2 stroke because I dont have enought $$$ behind me to repalce if it went bad shortly after I buy it. The deal I found has a 2002 60 hp 4s Johnson so I could have piece of mind about an engine that should have years of trouble free operation. Any other thoughts?
TC Goldman	posted 06-07-2006 09:34 AM ET (US) Here's what I would do. If it really is a "great" deal on the 60; I would try it and see how it works for Your needs. If it is a little underpowered, then You could always sell it or trade it in (if You got it for a great deal, then You shouldn't lose anything in a trade/sell). Good Luck. Todd
evogroup	posted 06-07-2006 10:34 AM ET (US) I'm thinking of doing the same thing with my Montauk to replace an '86 90hp Johnson, but most likely a new Yamaha or Merc 4S. Pretty much because I want an engine under 300# and F.I. All the 75's are just 90's w/ 75 hp. A 90 hp e-tec comes close, but also comes close to $10K installed around here. The 60 e-tec is only a 2 cyl. which seems like it would lack the torque. I am looking for super quite and dependable, get up on plane reasonably quick and top out in mid-high 30's with light load. What do people think about the hi-thrust/big foot option? The guy I spoke to at Whaler recommended it.
Tom W Clark	posted 06-07-2006 11:16 AM ET (US) Paige, I do not have any personal experience with the Johnson (Suzuki) 60 HP outboard but I have driven Montauks powered by 60 HP four stokes I am sure it will be fine for your intended purposes. I am less confident of your assessment that buying a four year old four stroke instead of an "older two stroke" is necessarily a safer financial decision. Many older two strokes are simpler more reliable and less costly to maintain than modern four strokes. As with any purchase of a used piece of equipment, past usage history and current condition will have much to do with future reliability.
Dick	posted 06-07-2006 11:23 AM ET (US) I had a 99 17 Montauk with a Merc 50 4 stk and with a light load it would turn 33 mph, it fit my needs well. I now have an 06 150 Montauk with the Merc 60 Big Foot 4 stk, this is one awsome motor and I think it would be great on a classic Montauk.
PCBrev	posted 06-07-2006 12:15 PM ET (US) Thank you everyone for your comments, very helpful. Regarding older 2 strokes..... I am a big 2 stroke fan = power to weight and like syn oil as well. I'm more talking about a 23 year old motor vs a 4 yr old motor(2 season on boat), and on average I should have better luck with all things being equal, which we all know they never are. I am so happy to find this forum, the information is more than I could have dreamed and it's all in one place. Let the restoration begin!
The Judge	posted 06-07-2006 12:38 PM ET (US) My friend has a 79 montauk with a 2000 suzuki 60hp and she cruises the same as my 70hp suzuki but is about 3+ mph slower so about 35+. Except for WOT you do not notice the difference between the 2 engines.
PCBrev	posted 06-07-2006 07:04 PM ET (US) Sounds like my expectations are realistic. Like with anything used with no warranty I'm taking a chance and in the end if the motor runs well but I want more power I can always upgrade to a 90hp. I'll follow up this summer after skiing and tubing and give my opinions. Next is prop selection........
The Judge	posted 06-07-2006 09:23 PM ET (US) 13.25 x 17 if tubing. 13x18 if not.
Tom W Clark	posted 06-07-2006 09:24 PM ET (US) Nick, Don't the Suzuki motors use larger diameter props (like 14") becuase of their lower gearing?
PCBrev	posted 06-09-2006 08:06 AM ET (US) Judge and Tom, mine is the Suzuki - Johnson motor. Would be for tubing thanks, PCB
The Judge	posted 06-09-2006 01:17 PM ET (US) Tom in my experience(8 different props) in the 60-70 range they do not need the bigger diameter. Mine came with a 14x17 and the holeshot was weak and top end suffered compared to the 13.25x17. Maybe on a heavier boat. My best prop was the Zuki 13x18 SST. With the 90-140 engines, yes they need the 14" to give a decent cruise in my opinion.
PCBrev	posted 06-09-2006 09:08 PM ET (US) OK, I have some idea of size, now to stainless or aluminum. Pros and cons with my 60hp? I've always thought ss would do more damage to motor if it hits something vs alum. would break and be the weak link. The ss would also give 2-3 mph. Tom has an interesting point but ill let him explain.
jwkennedy	posted 06-10-2006 05:41 PM ET (US) Timely thread for me. I have a'75 Montauk that needs repowering and I'm debating the same issue. I can get a pretty good deal on a 4-stroke Yam 60...$6200 on the boat, out the door with new controls. It makes no sense to go to a 75, since it's the 90 with less power and all the weight. The 90 4-stroke is $8200. I skied behind a 15-foot Super Sport with a 40hp as a kid with 3 guys in the boat...certainly wasn't like my rich friend's ski-nautique, but it was still fun.
Joe Kriz	posted 06-10-2006 06:31 PM ET (US) Just to put some prices in perspective. Ed's has the 90 hp E-Tec for $6,999 http://www.edsmarinesuperstore.com/evinrude.htm If a person already has the Evinrude gauges and engine controls, then the upgrade wouldn't necessarily have to include all the extras except for a System Check gauge. Just a thought....
pasino	posted 06-12-2006 01:25 AM ET (US) Hi, I had a 1980 montauk with a four stroke yamaha 60 hp. On my opinion it was too underpowered. With four persons I could hardly reach 25 mph with 5 GPH fuel consumption. Now I put a 4 stroke yamaha 115hp, result: 46 mph and less fuel consumption at criuse speed (28 mph), I didn't yet test it, but I think it's about 3 GPH.
The Judge	posted 06-12-2006 12:50 PM ET (US) My 115 4 stroke burns 4-5gph @ 4k, almost double of the 70hp.
PCBrev	posted 06-12-2006 09:16 PM ET (US) Well I'll have a chance to put the boat in on Friday (1st time....wont sleep Thurs. night) and I'll have my GPS with me for some testing. Sunday, Fathers day, I'll be out witht the family for another test. We'll be Stripper fishing so the tube test, (?) will have to wait. I'll post some MPH and times to achieve them. I'm going to test with the prop that is on it, has 2 dings. I've been wrenching/cleaning/polishing and reading CW and need some time in her to enjoy the work Ive done so far... Removed all decals/#'s/adhesive, rubbing compond,finesse it II, wax, tightened rails, epoxy small holes, ran new wires, cooler install, Hall's......... Still grinning from ear to ear.