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Author Topic:   Prop for Dauntless 15'

dlburns posted 02-20-2009 10:55 PM ET (US)
Hello,
I am new to the forums and a new owner of a 1995 Dauntless 15' with a 70 HP Suzuki EFI four stroke. The boat came with a 13 X 19 composition prop which I would like to trade out for a stainless steel prop. Is the 13 X 19 the correct prop for my application and if so, where would be the best place to purchase one?
TIA
Dave

Tom W Clark posted 02-25-2009 12:54 PM ET (US)
Dave,
Those plastic propellers are crap. A good stainless steel propeller will improve your boat's performance.
To help determine what size you might need, we need to know a few things about your boat and motor:
What gear ratio does your motor use?
What is the WOT RPM range of your motor?
What is your current top speed a measured by GPS at WOT?
What RPM do you see at WOT with the current prop?

dlburns posted 02-28-2009 08:44 PM ET (US)
Tom...thanks for getting back to me, I sent you an email as to when I will be able to get the info on mph and rpm. I have to get some electrical work done first and will then get it out and record the data you need. Andy told me the same thing about the composite props so I want to get a prop that will give me the best performance I can get.
I'll have that info to you in a couple of weeks.
Thanks
Dave
thediscusthrower posted 03-01-2009 03:14 PM ET (US)
I have a 1995 15' Dauntless with a 2 stroke 70 hp Evinrude. It came with a 14 x 17P aluminum prop but I picked up a SS prop from one of the continuouswave guys. It measures 13 3/8 X 17P.
Bob
dlburns posted 03-02-2009 09:18 PM ET (US)
Bob,
I believe that is one of the props that Tom recommended to me. I need to get him some mph info in order to get it down to the correct size. I hope to get it out in the next couple of weeks and run some tests in order to capture that data.
Thanks for the info.
Dave
dlburns posted 03-03-2009 02:06 PM ET (US)
Tom,
A friend at work gave me a Michigan Wheel 13¼" X 17" Rapture SS propeller. It has a model number of 033085 stamped on the hub. I cannot find any information as to if it will fit my 2003 Suzuki DF 70 four stroke outboard. The prop is in mint condition and it's a freebie if it will fit my boat.
Can you point in the direction I should look?
Thanks
Dave
Tohsgib posted 03-03-2009 02:32 PM ET (US)
Being a former Suzuki 70 owner I will pipe in. Yes it will fit your engine. You "may" need to add or remove a washer to get enough threads on the nut and get the cotterpin in. The prop might sit a tad high or low but it is nothing, just make sure it is shimmed OK. I had the Evinrude model but ironically used a suzuki SS prop. My Suzuki I have now ironically uses an OMC prop. Interchangeable for the most part, again just a shim or washer, etc. Your redline is 5200-5800 and trust me you want to be above 5500 with light load and fuel or performance will not be as great. Gear ratio is 2.42:1. As with all Suzuki 4 strokes, they like to be mounted higher on the transom than most. So i would seriously recommend moving it to the next to the last hole up.
dlburns posted 03-03-2009 09:00 PM ET (US)
Tohsgib
Thaks for the info, as a newbie to all of this, I really don't want to make it work if it is not an exact fit. I would rather get the correct prop and not have to shim it or adjust it if that is possible. I am not sure I understand what is involved in shimming the prop, why would it ride higher or lower? Wouldn't the shaft dictate where the prop sits in relation to the housing?
My owners manual says that my DF70 has a gear ratio of 2.59:1? What would moving the motor to the next to last hole up on the transom do for me?
Sorry for all the rookie questions, I am just trying to learn all of this.
Thanks
Dave
Tom W Clark posted 03-04-2009 10:45 AM ET (US)
If you have the prop, try it out.
Michigan # 033085 is a Rapture hubbed for Mercury and Hondas. The Suzuki version of the 17" Rapture is # 063043.
However, that does not mean it will not fit. As Nick points out, you may have to add or remove a spacer washer to get the nut to line up but the splines are the same and so long as the thrust washer nests correctly into the front of the prop, you will be able to use it.
Go ahead and try it; it will be a good data point. I suspect the 17" pitch will not be enough for your boat/motor. The 19" will be what you would need. When using the Stiletto, the 17" Advantage will perform like a 19" pitch prop from Michigan.
Tohsgib posted 03-04-2009 11:05 AM ET (US)
Won't fit if for a Merc, you need a 13 spline prop. What I mean about it being higher is that each prop has a different offset. The offset is the distance from the back of the prop to where the hub is. When using an OMC prop on my Suzuki the prop just barely fits into the hub of the lower unit so I call it riding high as it protrudes out from the lower more than the Suzuki prop that sits in about 1/2 inch more. Because of this I have had to use a thinner washer at the front so that the nut would tighten down enough to get a cotterpin in it.
Like I said above, Suzukis like to be mounted high on the transom. If you don't it causes drag and therefore impeeds performance. Try sticking your hand under water at 35mph. If it is slap dab on the transom you need to go up probably 3 holes, again I think the second to last hole up should be fine. I am ALL the way up on my 13' and wish I could go higher. The higher up you go the more rpms you get the faster you go or bigger prop you can swing...to an extent. Hence why they make jack pates.
Lastly according to my Brochure the 60 & 70 have 2.42, the 90-140 have 2.59
That Dauntless is pretty heavy, I think a 19 might be too steep in a SS prop. Most run 17 or 18's on Montauks which weigh 900lbs.
Tom W Clark posted 03-04-2009 11:17 AM ET (US)
Nick -- What "brochure" are you talking about? Dave's motor is a 2003. If his Owner's Manual says it has a 2.59:1 gear ratio, I would believe that specification before some brochure.
The current Suzuki DF70 uses a 2.59:1 gear ratio.
Gear ratio plays a big part in what pitch propeller one uses. It is not useful to cite the pitch of propellers used on other outboards with different gear ratios for this reason.
Tohsgib posted 03-04-2009 12:24 PM ET (US)
The 2008 Suzuki brochure sitting in front of me.
My citation of pitch in my above post pertains to members here, myself and neighbor who are currently or have run DF70's on Montauks. We ALL use either a 17 or 18" pitch prop. I ran a 19 Alum when I first got it and could only fetch like 5400. The 18"SS allowed me almost 5700. The 5 or 6 17's I tried were all 5800-6k but I ran light loads 95% of the time. I tried a 17" 4 blade comprop but that was like running a 16" but made a great spare because it weighed like an ounce.
Tohsgib posted 03-04-2009 12:40 PM ET (US)
The new redesigned 2009 DF70-90's have a 2.59. The 1998-2008 DF60-70 have 2.42.
Tom W Clark posted 03-04-2009 12:40 PM ET (US)
Dave's Owner's Manual for his 2003 Suzuki DF70 says it has a 2.59:1 gear ratio.
Suzuki's web site specifies the gear ratio of their 2009 DF70 as 2.59:1
http://www.suzukimarine.com/sr_09/df90-80-70/features/
Yet Suzuki's 2008 sales brochure lists the gear ratio of the DF70 as 2.42:1?
That's curious.
Tom W Clark posted 03-04-2009 12:45 PM ET (US)
OK, crunching the numbers:
5800 RPM through a 2.42:1 gear ratio turning a 17" pitch prop with ten percent or less slip would yield a predicted speed of 35-36 MPH.
Is that all we think he DF70 can push the Daunltess 15 to? That seems a tad low to me.
Tohsgib posted 03-04-2009 12:50 PM ET (US)
Read my above post. 2006 brochure says 2.42 as well. Do a search on Google. Look at Pirhana props website. Don't shoot the messenger! PS I did own one.
Tohsgib posted 03-04-2009 01:02 PM ET (US)
Ok this is weird. Why does the 2000 14 dauntless weigh 1000lbs but the 1995 15' Dauntless only weigh 730? With 730 being the target weight(I was thinking 1000+lbs initially) A 19 should be Ok or at least an 18. My 950lb Newtauk on a jackplate would fetch 39 on a good day swinging a 13x18 Suzuki 18" polished prop.
Tom W Clark posted 03-04-2009 01:06 PM ET (US)
Nick -- No shooting, just asking.
Remember your Suzuki prop was made by Precision (makers of the Stiletto Brand).
A lighter boat with a Michigan prop will need more pitch.
Cliveous Ogg posted 04-26-2009 10:57 AM ET (US)
To Tom Clark,
I am kinda new to this website-I have an '81 Newport that is darn close to being repowered with an E-TEC 90 HP. This is by way of a brief introduction - My question to you is How can I get a copy of the Boston Whaler CDs that you have made available in the past? I see that quie a number of owners have profited greatly in the restoration, wtc. of their whalers.
Thanks for your time and reply,
Cliveous Ogg
Tom W Clark posted 04-26-2009 11:13 AM ET (US)
http://www.tomwclark.com/
dlburns posted 04-26-2009 12:01 PM ET (US)
Ok, here are my numbers using the composite prop for test runs.
Ay 5900 RPM I was able to get top speed of between 28.7 and 29 MPH as measured on my Garmin GPS!
Tom seems to think this is quite low and asked if I was seeing KPH rather than MPH on my screen. I am positive that the GPS was reading in MPH.
The Michigan Wheel SS prop I have will not fit the Suzuki, the splines do not match up on it darn it.
Ideas?
mphillips posted 04-26-2009 05:15 PM ET (US)
Is the goal in selecting props to hit max RPM (5500 - 6000 is redline for my motor) for motor at WOT? My Evinrude ETEC Owner's Manual says to select a prop that runs at one-half max RPMs (2750-3000) at WOT? The manual goes on to say that I can run redline for 6% of the time the engine is running. Currently my prop runs the boat at 5000RPM at WOT. What do I need to do?
Mike
thediscusthrower posted 04-29-2009 05:51 PM ET (US)
The 1995 15 foot Dauntless weights 875 lbs.
Bob

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Author	Topic: Prop for Dauntless 15'
dlburns	posted 02-20-2009 10:55 PM ET (US) Hello, I am new to the forums and a new owner of a 1995 Dauntless 15' with a 70 HP Suzuki EFI four stroke. The boat came with a 13 X 19 composition prop which I would like to trade out for a stainless steel prop. Is the 13 X 19 the correct prop for my application and if so, where would be the best place to purchase one? TIA Dave
Tom W Clark	posted 02-25-2009 12:54 PM ET (US) Dave, Those plastic propellers are crap. A good stainless steel propeller will improve your boat's performance. To help determine what size you might need, we need to know a few things about your boat and motor: What gear ratio does your motor use? What is the WOT RPM range of your motor? What is your current top speed a measured by GPS at WOT? What RPM do you see at WOT with the current prop?
dlburns	posted 02-28-2009 08:44 PM ET (US) Tom...thanks for getting back to me, I sent you an email as to when I will be able to get the info on mph and rpm. I have to get some electrical work done first and will then get it out and record the data you need. Andy told me the same thing about the composite props so I want to get a prop that will give me the best performance I can get. I'll have that info to you in a couple of weeks. Thanks Dave
thediscusthrower	posted 03-01-2009 03:14 PM ET (US) I have a 1995 15' Dauntless with a 2 stroke 70 hp Evinrude. It came with a 14 x 17P aluminum prop but I picked up a SS prop from one of the continuouswave guys. It measures 13 3/8 X 17P. Bob
dlburns	posted 03-02-2009 09:18 PM ET (US) Bob, I believe that is one of the props that Tom recommended to me. I need to get him some mph info in order to get it down to the correct size. I hope to get it out in the next couple of weeks and run some tests in order to capture that data. Thanks for the info. Dave
dlburns	posted 03-03-2009 02:06 PM ET (US) Tom, A friend at work gave me a Michigan Wheel 13¼" X 17" Rapture SS propeller. It has a model number of 033085 stamped on the hub. I cannot find any information as to if it will fit my 2003 Suzuki DF 70 four stroke outboard. The prop is in mint condition and it's a freebie if it will fit my boat. Can you point in the direction I should look? Thanks Dave
Tohsgib	posted 03-03-2009 02:32 PM ET (US) Being a former Suzuki 70 owner I will pipe in. Yes it will fit your engine. You "may" need to add or remove a washer to get enough threads on the nut and get the cotterpin in. The prop might sit a tad high or low but it is nothing, just make sure it is shimmed OK. I had the Evinrude model but ironically used a suzuki SS prop. My Suzuki I have now ironically uses an OMC prop. Interchangeable for the most part, again just a shim or washer, etc. Your redline is 5200-5800 and trust me you want to be above 5500 with light load and fuel or performance will not be as great. Gear ratio is 2.42:1. As with all Suzuki 4 strokes, they like to be mounted higher on the transom than most. So i would seriously recommend moving it to the next to the last hole up.
dlburns	posted 03-03-2009 09:00 PM ET (US) Tohsgib Thaks for the info, as a newbie to all of this, I really don't want to make it work if it is not an exact fit. I would rather get the correct prop and not have to shim it or adjust it if that is possible. I am not sure I understand what is involved in shimming the prop, why would it ride higher or lower? Wouldn't the shaft dictate where the prop sits in relation to the housing? My owners manual says that my DF70 has a gear ratio of 2.59:1? What would moving the motor to the next to last hole up on the transom do for me? Sorry for all the rookie questions, I am just trying to learn all of this. Thanks Dave
Tom W Clark	posted 03-04-2009 10:45 AM ET (US) If you have the prop, try it out. Michigan # 033085 is a Rapture hubbed for Mercury and Hondas. The Suzuki version of the 17" Rapture is # 063043. However, that does not mean it will not fit. As Nick points out, you may have to add or remove a spacer washer to get the nut to line up but the splines are the same and so long as the thrust washer nests correctly into the front of the prop, you will be able to use it. Go ahead and try it; it will be a good data point. I suspect the 17" pitch will not be enough for your boat/motor. The 19" will be what you would need. When using the Stiletto, the 17" Advantage will perform like a 19" pitch prop from Michigan.
Tohsgib	posted 03-04-2009 11:05 AM ET (US) Won't fit if for a Merc, you need a 13 spline prop. What I mean about it being higher is that each prop has a different offset. The offset is the distance from the back of the prop to where the hub is. When using an OMC prop on my Suzuki the prop just barely fits into the hub of the lower unit so I call it riding high as it protrudes out from the lower more than the Suzuki prop that sits in about 1/2 inch more. Because of this I have had to use a thinner washer at the front so that the nut would tighten down enough to get a cotterpin in it. Like I said above, Suzukis like to be mounted high on the transom. If you don't it causes drag and therefore impeeds performance. Try sticking your hand under water at 35mph. If it is slap dab on the transom you need to go up probably 3 holes, again I think the second to last hole up should be fine. I am ALL the way up on my 13' and wish I could go higher. The higher up you go the more rpms you get the faster you go or bigger prop you can swing...to an extent. Hence why they make jack pates. Lastly according to my Brochure the 60 & 70 have 2.42, the 90-140 have 2.59 That Dauntless is pretty heavy, I think a 19 might be too steep in a SS prop. Most run 17 or 18's on Montauks which weigh 900lbs.
Tom W Clark	posted 03-04-2009 11:17 AM ET (US) Nick -- What "brochure" are you talking about? Dave's motor is a 2003. If his Owner's Manual says it has a 2.59:1 gear ratio, I would believe that specification before some brochure. The current Suzuki DF70 uses a 2.59:1 gear ratio. Gear ratio plays a big part in what pitch propeller one uses. It is not useful to cite the pitch of propellers used on other outboards with different gear ratios for this reason.
Tohsgib	posted 03-04-2009 12:24 PM ET (US) The 2008 Suzuki brochure sitting in front of me. My citation of pitch in my above post pertains to members here, myself and neighbor who are currently or have run DF70's on Montauks. We ALL use either a 17 or 18" pitch prop. I ran a 19 Alum when I first got it and could only fetch like 5400. The 18"SS allowed me almost 5700. The 5 or 6 17's I tried were all 5800-6k but I ran light loads 95% of the time. I tried a 17" 4 blade comprop but that was like running a 16" but made a great spare because it weighed like an ounce.
Tohsgib	posted 03-04-2009 12:40 PM ET (US) The new redesigned 2009 DF70-90's have a 2.59. The 1998-2008 DF60-70 have 2.42.
Tom W Clark	posted 03-04-2009 12:40 PM ET (US) Dave's Owner's Manual for his 2003 Suzuki DF70 says it has a 2.59:1 gear ratio. Suzuki's web site specifies the gear ratio of their 2009 DF70 as 2.59:1 http://www.suzukimarine.com/sr_09/df90-80-70/features/ Yet Suzuki's 2008 sales brochure lists the gear ratio of the DF70 as 2.42:1? That's curious.
Tom W Clark	posted 03-04-2009 12:45 PM ET (US) OK, crunching the numbers: 5800 RPM through a 2.42:1 gear ratio turning a 17" pitch prop with ten percent or less slip would yield a predicted speed of 35-36 MPH. Is that all we think he DF70 can push the Daunltess 15 to? That seems a tad low to me.
Tohsgib	posted 03-04-2009 12:50 PM ET (US) Read my above post. 2006 brochure says 2.42 as well. Do a search on Google. Look at Pirhana props website. Don't shoot the messenger! PS I did own one.
Tohsgib	posted 03-04-2009 01:02 PM ET (US) Ok this is weird. Why does the 2000 14 dauntless weigh 1000lbs but the 1995 15' Dauntless only weigh 730? With 730 being the target weight(I was thinking 1000+lbs initially) A 19 should be Ok or at least an 18. My 950lb Newtauk on a jackplate would fetch 39 on a good day swinging a 13x18 Suzuki 18" polished prop.
Tom W Clark	posted 03-04-2009 01:06 PM ET (US) Nick -- No shooting, just asking. Remember your Suzuki prop was made by Precision (makers of the Stiletto Brand). A lighter boat with a Michigan prop will need more pitch.
Cliveous Ogg	posted 04-26-2009 10:57 AM ET (US) To Tom Clark, I am kinda new to this website-I have an '81 Newport that is darn close to being repowered with an E-TEC 90 HP. This is by way of a brief introduction - My question to you is How can I get a copy of the Boston Whaler CDs that you have made available in the past? I see that quie a number of owners have profited greatly in the restoration, wtc. of their whalers. Thanks for your time and reply, Cliveous Ogg
Tom W Clark	posted 04-26-2009 11:13 AM ET (US) http://www.tomwclark.com/
dlburns	posted 04-26-2009 12:01 PM ET (US) Ok, here are my numbers using the composite prop for test runs. Ay 5900 RPM I was able to get top speed of between 28.7 and 29 MPH as measured on my Garmin GPS! Tom seems to think this is quite low and asked if I was seeing KPH rather than MPH on my screen. I am positive that the GPS was reading in MPH. The Michigan Wheel SS prop I have will not fit the Suzuki, the splines do not match up on it darn it. Ideas?
mphillips	posted 04-26-2009 05:15 PM ET (US) Is the goal in selecting props to hit max RPM (5500 - 6000 is redline for my motor) for motor at WOT? My Evinrude ETEC Owner's Manual says to select a prop that runs at one-half max RPMs (2750-3000) at WOT? The manual goes on to say that I can run redline for 6% of the time the engine is running. Currently my prop runs the boat at 5000RPM at WOT. What do I need to do? Mike
thediscusthrower	posted 04-29-2009 05:51 PM ET (US) The 1995 15 foot Dauntless weights 875 lbs. Bob