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Author Topic:   Prop for 1996 21' Outrage

hagerg posted 05-14-2009 08:53 PM ET (US)
I have a 1996 21' Outrage with a 1997 Yamaha 200 SSII. Boat has original 19" prop. With 3 people prox 30 gallons of fuel and T-top boat will only achieve 46 to 4700 rpm's. The motor runs and idles well and has good compression on all cylinders. Top speed is around 41. There seems to be little speed change in the last range of the throttle. Would a different prop improve performance or would there be an issue with the motor? I'm sure there's someone out there that can tell me which prop is right for this set-up. I would think the right prop would have been put on the boat when new??
Thanks for all replies
Tom W Clark posted 05-14-2009 09:05 PM ET (US)
41 MPH is way too slow for that boat and motor combination. A Yamaha 200 HP outboard should be able to push the Outrage 21 to the high 40s.
Exactly what 19" pitch pro do you have now? Brand? Model? Part number?
There is no such thing as a "factory prop" in this case. The dealer that sold the motor would have made the decision as to what is appropriate.
I do think a 19" pitch prop would be about right, but you motor should be hitting 5500 RPM and 47-48 MPH or more.
What condition is the boat in? T-top? Bottom paint? Extra gear that adds weight? When was the motor last serviced?
phatwhaler posted 05-14-2009 09:30 PM ET (US)
I think a 19P is too much for a 200 on a 21ft outrage. I have a 200 Merc on my 1996 19/20 Outrage with a T-top and it turns 5300 Rpms spinning a 19P Mercury Vengeance. Motor is mounted on the 2nd set of holes and that is with the motor trimmed up pretty high.
I used to have a 150 Merc EFI with a 17P powertech and it would turn about 5400 rpms on average. I could get another 100 rpms on a cool day with just me onboard.
The 150 Topped out at 43mph and the 200 will hit 49.
tmann45 posted 05-14-2009 09:32 PM ET (US)
My 1996 21 Outrage with 1998 carb Mercury 200 runs 50 mph with either 17" Vengance or 18" Enertia turning 5800 rpm with light load, no bottom paint, no T-top.
phatwhaler posted 05-14-2009 09:35 PM ET (US)
Also, a friend of mine has a late 90's 200 Yamaha on his 21 Hydrasports and he can't go much faster than about 45mph. I think about 44/45 is all you can expect out of a boat that weighs 3500lbs.
I think you should try a 17P
hagerg posted 05-14-2009 09:43 PM ET (US)
The boat is in excellent condition no bottom paint (glossy). There is a T-top and when running w/GPS it shows 41mph. I'm going to "shock" it with ring free this weekend and see if it helps. The motor has been serviced and has new plugs. All cylinders have compression of 120 or 121. I know the T-top with life jacket bags creates drag. The prop is a stainless 3 blade that has 19-M on the hub. I'll have to pull it off to get more info.
phatwhaler posted 05-14-2009 10:21 PM ET (US)
According to jimh's prop calculator hitting 50mph with a 17P prop at 5800 rpms would indicate negative prop slip. With a 18P about 5% slip.
I'm thinking that a 21 Outrage with 200 is only good for about 45mph.
I put the 17P Powertech on my 200 Merc and it turned 6000 rpms.
I would like to raise my motor another set of holes and try a 19P Enertia. Just to try and break 50 mph.
TransAm posted 05-14-2009 10:50 PM ET (US)
I agree this set-up should run in the mid-upper 40's, say 47MPH. The "M" series props from Yamaha are popular props and should perform well on your Outrage. I have a pair of Yamaha 23 pitch "M" series props on my 1999 Yamaha SWSII 250's and they have been the fastest props I have tested so far. They run about 200 RPM higher than 23P Mercury Mirage plus and 2 MPH faster. They "M" series seems geometrically similar to the Mercury Tempest Plus props which I have just put on my Temptation. I am anxious to see how they compare.
I would think the 200 HP Yamaha SWSII would be able to achieve at least 5,300-5,400 RPM on that boat. Has the boat always topped out at 4,700 RPM? Have you had the Oxygen sensor serviced lately? That sensor is notorious for robbing performance if it gets polluted with carbon build-up. I think the service interval is 100 hours.
Tom W Clark posted 05-14-2009 10:55 PM ET (US)

quote:
According to jimh's prop calculator hitting 50mph with a 17P prop at 5800 rpms would indicate negative prop slip.

quote:
I put the 17P Powertech on my 200 Merc and it turned 6000 rpms.
Yes, this is why a 19" pitch propeller may be necessary.
Whaler factory test data I have indicates this hull will go 47-48 MPH with 200 HP and 51 MPH with 225 HP.
Certainly the T-top will take a significant toll, but there must more to it than just that.
What set of holes is the Yamaha mounted on?
What condition is the propeller in?
19-M indicates the prop is a Yamaha large gearcase (M series) propeller, but it could be the painted stainless steel model (straight semi-cleaver tailing edge) or the Saltwater Series (polished, larger diameter, rounded blade tips)
Tom W Clark posted 05-14-2009 11:01 PM ET (US)
Greg -- Just to be clear, when you have tested the boat for top speed, you are trimming the motor out as far as the propeller will grip, aren't you?
Does your boat have trim tabs and are they fully retracted when testing top speed?
hagerg posted 05-14-2009 11:21 PM ET (US)
The prop is the painted stainless steel. The motor is trimmed up when running. Not sure when the O2 sensor was last serviced. Not sure what is involved in servicing the O2 sensor but I will read up on this. I try to do whatever maintenance is within my abilities..... and I know my limitations. I do need to check the motor mount height. Thanks, I know the collective knowledge here is great.
hagerg posted 05-14-2009 11:46 PM ET (US)
Gotta say, I wasn't aware my motor had an O2 sensor. For those that might attempt to service the sensor here is a helpful link. http://www.theburningreel.com/forums/boating-forum/1221-yamaha-oxygen-sensor-cleaning.html
hagerg posted 08-21-2009 07:34 PM ET (US)
Thanks to those who replied to this thread. As a follow-up, I had the carbs rebuilt and last outing w/3 on board, tackle, ice fish etc motor turned 5200 rpm wot. This was clearly the problem. Caught some nice snapper, sea bass, triggerfish and kingfish. Motor purrs now.

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Author	Topic: Prop for 1996 21' Outrage
hagerg	posted 05-14-2009 08:53 PM ET (US) I have a 1996 21' Outrage with a 1997 Yamaha 200 SSII. Boat has original 19" prop. With 3 people prox 30 gallons of fuel and T-top boat will only achieve 46 to 4700 rpm's. The motor runs and idles well and has good compression on all cylinders. Top speed is around 41. There seems to be little speed change in the last range of the throttle. Would a different prop improve performance or would there be an issue with the motor? I'm sure there's someone out there that can tell me which prop is right for this set-up. I would think the right prop would have been put on the boat when new?? Thanks for all replies
Tom W Clark	posted 05-14-2009 09:05 PM ET (US) 41 MPH is way too slow for that boat and motor combination. A Yamaha 200 HP outboard should be able to push the Outrage 21 to the high 40s. Exactly what 19" pitch pro do you have now? Brand? Model? Part number? There is no such thing as a "factory prop" in this case. The dealer that sold the motor would have made the decision as to what is appropriate. I do think a 19" pitch prop would be about right, but you motor should be hitting 5500 RPM and 47-48 MPH or more. What condition is the boat in? T-top? Bottom paint? Extra gear that adds weight? When was the motor last serviced?
phatwhaler	posted 05-14-2009 09:30 PM ET (US) I think a 19P is too much for a 200 on a 21ft outrage. I have a 200 Merc on my 1996 19/20 Outrage with a T-top and it turns 5300 Rpms spinning a 19P Mercury Vengeance. Motor is mounted on the 2nd set of holes and that is with the motor trimmed up pretty high. I used to have a 150 Merc EFI with a 17P powertech and it would turn about 5400 rpms on average. I could get another 100 rpms on a cool day with just me onboard. The 150 Topped out at 43mph and the 200 will hit 49.
tmann45	posted 05-14-2009 09:32 PM ET (US) My 1996 21 Outrage with 1998 carb Mercury 200 runs 50 mph with either 17" Vengance or 18" Enertia turning 5800 rpm with light load, no bottom paint, no T-top.
phatwhaler	posted 05-14-2009 09:35 PM ET (US) Also, a friend of mine has a late 90's 200 Yamaha on his 21 Hydrasports and he can't go much faster than about 45mph. I think about 44/45 is all you can expect out of a boat that weighs 3500lbs. I think you should try a 17P
hagerg	posted 05-14-2009 09:43 PM ET (US) The boat is in excellent condition no bottom paint (glossy). There is a T-top and when running w/GPS it shows 41mph. I'm going to "shock" it with ring free this weekend and see if it helps. The motor has been serviced and has new plugs. All cylinders have compression of 120 or 121. I know the T-top with life jacket bags creates drag. The prop is a stainless 3 blade that has 19-M on the hub. I'll have to pull it off to get more info.
phatwhaler	posted 05-14-2009 10:21 PM ET (US) According to jimh's prop calculator hitting 50mph with a 17P prop at 5800 rpms would indicate negative prop slip. With a 18P about 5% slip. I'm thinking that a 21 Outrage with 200 is only good for about 45mph. I put the 17P Powertech on my 200 Merc and it turned 6000 rpms. I would like to raise my motor another set of holes and try a 19P Enertia. Just to try and break 50 mph.
TransAm	posted 05-14-2009 10:50 PM ET (US) I agree this set-up should run in the mid-upper 40's, say 47MPH. The "M" series props from Yamaha are popular props and should perform well on your Outrage. I have a pair of Yamaha 23 pitch "M" series props on my 1999 Yamaha SWSII 250's and they have been the fastest props I have tested so far. They run about 200 RPM higher than 23P Mercury Mirage plus and 2 MPH faster. They "M" series seems geometrically similar to the Mercury Tempest Plus props which I have just put on my Temptation. I am anxious to see how they compare. I would think the 200 HP Yamaha SWSII would be able to achieve at least 5,300-5,400 RPM on that boat. Has the boat always topped out at 4,700 RPM? Have you had the Oxygen sensor serviced lately? That sensor is notorious for robbing performance if it gets polluted with carbon build-up. I think the service interval is 100 hours.
Tom W Clark	posted 05-14-2009 10:55 PM ET (US) quote: According to jimh's prop calculator hitting 50mph with a 17P prop at 5800 rpms would indicate negative prop slip. quote: I put the 17P Powertech on my 200 Merc and it turned 6000 rpms. Yes, this is why a 19" pitch propeller may be necessary. Whaler factory test data I have indicates this hull will go 47-48 MPH with 200 HP and 51 MPH with 225 HP. Certainly the T-top will take a significant toll, but there must more to it than just that. What set of holes is the Yamaha mounted on? What condition is the propeller in? 19-M indicates the prop is a Yamaha large gearcase (M series) propeller, but it could be the painted stainless steel model (straight semi-cleaver tailing edge) or the Saltwater Series (polished, larger diameter, rounded blade tips)
Tom W Clark	posted 05-14-2009 11:01 PM ET (US) Greg -- Just to be clear, when you have tested the boat for top speed, you are trimming the motor out as far as the propeller will grip, aren't you? Does your boat have trim tabs and are they fully retracted when testing top speed?
hagerg	posted 05-14-2009 11:21 PM ET (US) The prop is the painted stainless steel. The motor is trimmed up when running. Not sure when the O2 sensor was last serviced. Not sure what is involved in servicing the O2 sensor but I will read up on this. I try to do whatever maintenance is within my abilities..... and I know my limitations. I do need to check the motor mount height. Thanks, I know the collective knowledge here is great.
hagerg	posted 05-14-2009 11:46 PM ET (US) Gotta say, I wasn't aware my motor had an O2 sensor. For those that might attempt to service the sensor here is a helpful link. http://www.theburningreel.com/forums/boating-forum/1221-yamaha-oxygen-sensor-cleaning.html
hagerg	posted 08-21-2009 07:34 PM ET (US) Thanks to those who replied to this thread. As a follow-up, I had the carbs rebuilt and last outing w/3 on board, tackle, ice fish etc motor turned 5200 rpm wot. This was clearly the problem. Caught some nice snapper, sea bass, triggerfish and kingfish. Motor purrs now.