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Author Topic:   Repowering an older 17 Montauk

J84531 posted 07-18-2010 07:01 PM ET (US)
I have been reading threads from this site from the last 7 years on this topic, and there seems to be many conflicting opinions. I have a 1971 classic montauk in great condition that currently has an 1985 Mercury 75hp meatgrinder 2 stroke w/tilt trim (NADA specs say it weighs 275 lbs). I am getting sick of the engine as it had run good in the past, but is now having carb problems. I have rebuilt the fuel pump twice, done all of the required maintainence myself during the last few years along with rebuilding the carbs and now am rebuilding the carbs again. The motor had sufficient power for 2-3 people on board & fuel/gear, but would not plane easily with 4 or more. I actually put my fuel tank (26 gallon) in front of the console, which helped a bit, but I think the 75 is underpowered for this boat. I have been looking at the 4 stroke 70's, 90's, and even the 115's. I don't have the money for a brand new e-tec (would love one), but a used 4stroke with under 400 hours on it is in the budget. I would love to go with a four stroke due to no oil / smoke and the quiteness / fuel economy.
It seems to me that a lot of people on here are pushing the Suzuki DF70 for weight / power ratio reasons, or the yamaha F70. I would hate to go down in horsepower, so someone please explain to me why this is a good choice for putting 4 plus people in the boat plus gear in semi-rough sea conditions??? I could step up to a 90 fourstroke, which I see on a lot montauks these days. According to NADA, the yamaha F90 weighs in at a whopping 369 lbs with tilt / trim. Geese, if I am going to do this than why don't I just go with the F115, which weighs in at 402 lbs with more out of the hole shot and horsepower??? I know people are going to try to sell me on the yami 90 2 stroke at a light 261 lbs, but I am anti--oil /smoke /noise (for fishing purposes). Can anyone help me out here?? How do I go about this dilemma--getting a motor that will not overweigh the transom, but still handle a load of 4+ people / fuel/ and gear, without getting another 2 stroke?? Has anyone out there put a newer 90 or 115 fourstroke on their Montauk and if so, how is the performance (problems with porpoising??), clearance at the transom at idle, any other notible issues?? Any help, information, or experiences here would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
Nauti Tauk posted 07-18-2010 07:54 PM ET (US)
I can't address what engine to put on your classic Montauk but I can tell you this. We have 2003 170 Montauk with the carbed four stroke mercury 90hp engine and even loaded with four people it'll run just fine. Does it take longer to get up on plane? Yes. Can I tell the boat has alot of weight in it? Yes. All in all though the 90 performs admirably even when pushing a ton of weight. (figuratively Jim) Hope this helps
Ric232 posted 07-18-2010 09:52 PM ET (US)
How about a used 75 - 125 hp Mercury Optimax. They all weigh 375 lbs. It's a 2-stroke, but should be nearly as clean and quiet as an E-Tec.
jharrell posted 07-18-2010 10:41 PM ET (US)
IMO the to best new motors for the classic 17 Montauk right now are the Suzuki DF90 at 340 lbs and the ETEC 90 at 320 lbs.
The Suzuki seems to have better mileage and is the lightest 90 4 stroke on the market, the ETEC is the lightest modern 3 star emission 90hp on the market.
So Suzuki for gas ETEC for wieght.
I am debating these two myself for my classic Montauk 17.
The next up would be the Honda 90 at 360 lbs, with b.l.a.s.t. it should have a very good hole shot, but is pricey.
Yamaha's 369 lbs and I am sure is a fine outboard with mileage a little worse than the Suzuki or Honda because of no lean burn during cruise.
The Mercury's are too heavy for my taste.
contender posted 07-18-2010 11:31 PM ET (US)
The new motors do not smoke like the old ones, Get 90 2 stroke, Evinrude, Yamaha, or Suzuki...
renoduckman posted 07-19-2010 05:37 PM ET (US)
Yes interesting post. I have been doing the same as you, kind of dreaming of repowering and milking the last life out of the old 80hp Merc on my Montauk. I have considered many choices. The new f70 Yamaha seems to me like the best combo of power and weight. We have the problems out here of 2 stroke engine bans in place like Tahoe.
One thing to me, it seems like my old worn out 80hp Merc is still plenty fast. Even at 5k altitude. To me it seems like the boat is over powered. I think it can do with less. just my thought. Joe
jimh posted 07-19-2010 05:51 PM ET (US)
In heavy sea conditions with four or more people and their heavy gear, the particular brand of motor you have on your MONTAUK will not be an important influence on your boating experience.
Visit the outboard motor dealers in your area. Find the dealer you think you will have the best long-term relationship with, that has the best service department, and seems the most customer oriented. Buy the motor that dealer recommends.
There are many opinions expressed on the topic of outboard motors and much advice given. One method to validate the opinion or the advice is to see if the advice being offered matches the actual choices made by the person giving the advice.
In my case, I followed the advice I just gave you in the selection of my new motor purchase.
Tohsgib posted 07-20-2010 10:17 AM ET (US)
If you search you will see where I have advocated the Suzuki 70hp as probably one of the best mnatches in 17' Whaler history. Problem is the ball is in a new court. 9 years ago until last year it was either a 350lb 70hp or a 400lb 75 or 90hp. The 70 I had was an honest 39mph rig that sipped fuel, my 90hp Yamaha only did 41.5 so who needs more. Well now there are some new players and the F70 along with the new Hondas and 70-90 340lb Suzukis all look like awesome repowers...how much money do you want to spend is now more of a question? If you could find a leftover older style 70 Suzuki for say $5500 or less, I would DEFINATELY go that route. If no deals are to be had...take your pick.
The E-Tec 90 is a nice engine and my friend Len has one on his Montauk. Honestly though she is nowhere near as quiet as my 4 strokes and does not perform any better than my 70 Suzuki except for the wicked holeshot and worse fuel mileage. I see most 90 E-Tecs get 41-43mph which is not great but Ok for a 90, more like 80hp in my opinion. Len is not breaking 40. Again is the extra $$ worth it for 2-3mph that you will spend 2% of the next 1500 hours running at?
eli1exw posted 10-06-2013 07:28 AM ET (US)
[Revived this older thread, but the topic introduced is already the topic of a new and separate discussion. Use that new discsussion for that topic.--jimh]
alvispollard posted 10-11-2013 06:49 AM ET (US)
60 hp 4stroke
30 mph WOT
8mpg @ 22 mph w/ 1000#
22 mph is cruising speed & maximum desired speed in 2-3' waves
Safety - no water in splash well when slow trolling or idle speed
Practicality - 5 minutes slower to fishing grounds 10 miles away than 40 mph motor.
Mercury 60 hp 4stroke (new last year's model)- $4400 @ Basspro.
Purchase during boat show season & get 5 yr. warranty from Mercury
Resale for $1000-$1500 after 5 yrs. Purchase new one. New motor always under warranty for $600/yr expense. No worries & improved motor. Have done this twice & about time for third go around!
Works for me.

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Author	Topic: Repowering an older 17 Montauk
J84531	posted 07-18-2010 07:01 PM ET (US) I have been reading threads from this site from the last 7 years on this topic, and there seems to be many conflicting opinions. I have a 1971 classic montauk in great condition that currently has an 1985 Mercury 75hp meatgrinder 2 stroke w/tilt trim (NADA specs say it weighs 275 lbs). I am getting sick of the engine as it had run good in the past, but is now having carb problems. I have rebuilt the fuel pump twice, done all of the required maintainence myself during the last few years along with rebuilding the carbs and now am rebuilding the carbs again. The motor had sufficient power for 2-3 people on board & fuel/gear, but would not plane easily with 4 or more. I actually put my fuel tank (26 gallon) in front of the console, which helped a bit, but I think the 75 is underpowered for this boat. I have been looking at the 4 stroke 70's, 90's, and even the 115's. I don't have the money for a brand new e-tec (would love one), but a used 4stroke with under 400 hours on it is in the budget. I would love to go with a four stroke due to no oil / smoke and the quiteness / fuel economy. It seems to me that a lot of people on here are pushing the Suzuki DF70 for weight / power ratio reasons, or the yamaha F70. I would hate to go down in horsepower, so someone please explain to me why this is a good choice for putting 4 plus people in the boat plus gear in semi-rough sea conditions??? I could step up to a 90 fourstroke, which I see on a lot montauks these days. According to NADA, the yamaha F90 weighs in at a whopping 369 lbs with tilt / trim. Geese, if I am going to do this than why don't I just go with the F115, which weighs in at 402 lbs with more out of the hole shot and horsepower??? I know people are going to try to sell me on the yami 90 2 stroke at a light 261 lbs, but I am anti--oil /smoke /noise (for fishing purposes). Can anyone help me out here?? How do I go about this dilemma--getting a motor that will not overweigh the transom, but still handle a load of 4+ people / fuel/ and gear, without getting another 2 stroke?? Has anyone out there put a newer 90 or 115 fourstroke on their Montauk and if so, how is the performance (problems with porpoising??), clearance at the transom at idle, any other notible issues?? Any help, information, or experiences here would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
Nauti Tauk	posted 07-18-2010 07:54 PM ET (US) I can't address what engine to put on your classic Montauk but I can tell you this. We have 2003 170 Montauk with the carbed four stroke mercury 90hp engine and even loaded with four people it'll run just fine. Does it take longer to get up on plane? Yes. Can I tell the boat has alot of weight in it? Yes. All in all though the 90 performs admirably even when pushing a ton of weight. (figuratively Jim) Hope this helps
Ric232	posted 07-18-2010 09:52 PM ET (US) How about a used 75 - 125 hp Mercury Optimax. They all weigh 375 lbs. It's a 2-stroke, but should be nearly as clean and quiet as an E-Tec.
jharrell	posted 07-18-2010 10:41 PM ET (US) IMO the to best new motors for the classic 17 Montauk right now are the Suzuki DF90 at 340 lbs and the ETEC 90 at 320 lbs. The Suzuki seems to have better mileage and is the lightest 90 4 stroke on the market, the ETEC is the lightest modern 3 star emission 90hp on the market. So Suzuki for gas ETEC for wieght. I am debating these two myself for my classic Montauk 17. The next up would be the Honda 90 at 360 lbs, with b.l.a.s.t. it should have a very good hole shot, but is pricey. Yamaha's 369 lbs and I am sure is a fine outboard with mileage a little worse than the Suzuki or Honda because of no lean burn during cruise. The Mercury's are too heavy for my taste.
contender	posted 07-18-2010 11:31 PM ET (US) The new motors do not smoke like the old ones, Get 90 2 stroke, Evinrude, Yamaha, or Suzuki...
renoduckman	posted 07-19-2010 05:37 PM ET (US) Yes interesting post. I have been doing the same as you, kind of dreaming of repowering and milking the last life out of the old 80hp Merc on my Montauk. I have considered many choices. The new f70 Yamaha seems to me like the best combo of power and weight. We have the problems out here of 2 stroke engine bans in place like Tahoe. One thing to me, it seems like my old worn out 80hp Merc is still plenty fast. Even at 5k altitude. To me it seems like the boat is over powered. I think it can do with less. just my thought. Joe
jimh	posted 07-19-2010 05:51 PM ET (US) In heavy sea conditions with four or more people and their heavy gear, the particular brand of motor you have on your MONTAUK will not be an important influence on your boating experience. Visit the outboard motor dealers in your area. Find the dealer you think you will have the best long-term relationship with, that has the best service department, and seems the most customer oriented. Buy the motor that dealer recommends. There are many opinions expressed on the topic of outboard motors and much advice given. One method to validate the opinion or the advice is to see if the advice being offered matches the actual choices made by the person giving the advice. In my case, I followed the advice I just gave you in the selection of my new motor purchase.
Tohsgib	posted 07-20-2010 10:17 AM ET (US) If you search you will see where I have advocated the Suzuki 70hp as probably one of the best mnatches in 17' Whaler history. Problem is the ball is in a new court. 9 years ago until last year it was either a 350lb 70hp or a 400lb 75 or 90hp. The 70 I had was an honest 39mph rig that sipped fuel, my 90hp Yamaha only did 41.5 so who needs more. Well now there are some new players and the F70 along with the new Hondas and 70-90 340lb Suzukis all look like awesome repowers...how much money do you want to spend is now more of a question? If you could find a leftover older style 70 Suzuki for say $5500 or less, I would DEFINATELY go that route. If no deals are to be had...take your pick. The E-Tec 90 is a nice engine and my friend Len has one on his Montauk. Honestly though she is nowhere near as quiet as my 4 strokes and does not perform any better than my 70 Suzuki except for the wicked holeshot and worse fuel mileage. I see most 90 E-Tecs get 41-43mph which is not great but Ok for a 90, more like 80hp in my opinion. Len is not breaking 40. Again is the extra $$ worth it for 2-3mph that you will spend 2% of the next 1500 hours running at?
eli1exw	posted 10-06-2013 07:28 AM ET (US) [Revived this older thread, but the topic introduced is already the topic of a new and separate discussion. Use that new discsussion for that topic.--jimh]
alvispollard	posted 10-11-2013 06:49 AM ET (US) 60 hp 4stroke 30 mph WOT 8mpg @ 22 mph w/ 1000# 22 mph is cruising speed & maximum desired speed in 2-3' waves Safety - no water in splash well when slow trolling or idle speed Practicality - 5 minutes slower to fishing grounds 10 miles away than 40 mph motor. Mercury 60 hp 4stroke (new last year's model)- $4400 @ Basspro. Purchase during boat show season & get 5 yr. warranty from Mercury Resale for $1000-$1500 after 5 yrs. Purchase new one. New motor always under warranty for $600/yr expense. No worries & improved motor. Have done this twice & about time for third go around! Works for me.