NMEA-0183 Interface: Paired Two-pole Male, Female Connectors

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Author Topic:   NMEA-0183 Interface: Paired Two-pole Male, Female Connectors

jimh posted 12-21-2011 08:48 PM ET (US)
[This topic was originally a sidebar to a discussion suggesting a four-pole genderless connector. This different method suggesting the use of two two-pole connectors of opposite gender has been separated into its own topic.]
Chuck Tribolet posted 11-25-2011 03:42 PM ET (US)
Another solution [to the problem of interfacing NMEA-0183 serial devices with a generic or universal wiring solution] would be to put a keyed connector with two [female sockets] on the two NMEA out lines and a keyed connector with two [male pins] on the two NMEA in lines, with a convention about where + and - go. These Molex connectors look like they would be suitable.
Chuck
Chuck Tribolet posted 11-25-2011 03:45 PM ET (US)
[Reversed the gender of the connectors; this change has been made to the article above-jimh]
jimh posted 11-26-2011 12:05 AM ET (US)
The cost of the MOLEX connector mentioned by Chuck--the MOLEX Mizu-P25 wire-to-wire miniature waterproof connector--is not too high. I have researched these devices and show a source for them with the cost below. A two-pole plug is only $1.31.
http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail. aspx?R=52213-0211virtualkey53810000virtualkey538-52213-0211
I could not locate the price for the terminals, but they can't be much more than $0.20-each. We can figure less than $2 per connector.
The mating connector is a little more expensive, about $2.73:
http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail. aspx?qs=AplfTeSvkkCNwOPM3Ynl%2fQ%3d%3d
With terminals figure about $3.15. This gives us a cost of about $5.15 per device per port. I was becoming interested in this connector until I read the data sheet. It notes that for assembly of the connector a special "cap fitting tool" is required.
http://rhu004.sma-promail.com/SQLImages/kelmscott/Molex/PDF_Images/ 987650-5961.PDF
That special tooling has cooled my enthusiasm for this particular connector.
Chuck Tribolet posted 11-26-2011 10:19 AM ET (US)
I wonder if that tool is really necessary, or just makes
things go faster in a production environment. I couldn't
find anybody with an online quote for the tool. I googled
up the manual for the tool, I'd guess it would be about $50.
BTW, here's a list of splashproof connectors:
http://search.digikey.com/us/en/cat/connectors-interconnects/ rectangular-housings/1442556?k=splashproof%20molex&stock=1&site=us& lang=en
jimh posted 11-27-2011 07:54 AM ET (US)
Perhaps to assemble just a few connectors by hand a cap fitting tool could be improvised.
Chuck--You should order a couple of those Mizu-P25 MOLEX connectors and see how they work. Let us know how the crimp connectors work with a non-specific crimp tool, how difficult it is to assemble the contacts into the connector bodies, and how difficult it is to install the cap fitting. If it's possible to assemble those connectors without special crimp tools and the cap fitting tool, they look like they'd be a reasonably good connector for the purpose of connecting NMEA-0183 signals between devices.
Chuck Tribolet posted 11-30-2011 07:14 PM ET (US)
I ordered five of each housing and 15 of each terminal.
Mouser had the terminals: 50148 (female, $0.21) and 50147 (male, $0.18). One of the terminals is back-ordered.

Chuck
Chuck Tribolet posted 12-03-2011 09:16 PM ET (US)
They arrived today, USPS Priority Mail (which was the cheapest
too, BTW).
I turns out that I have a crimper that will work. It's a
Waldom crimper that I bought back in the '70s for installing
driving lights and rallye navigation equipment. But it's not
your usual crimper as it's made for completely uninsulated
crimps. It's Waldom HT-1919 and Google turns it up for about
$18.48 from Digikey. It looks like Molex owns Waldom now.
The tool for fitting the cap is not necessary. You can push
down on the cap with a small screwdriver or a fingernail.
The cap slides into housing and compresses the gasket that
seals around the wire.

Chuck
Chuck Tribolet posted 12-07-2011 10:55 PM ET (US)
I got an e-mail from Mouser today. The terminals that are
backordered won't be in until February. No problem for me.

Chuck
jimh posted 12-07-2011 11:05 PM ET (US)
Chuck and I appear to use the same philosophy about ordering terminals for crimp-on and insert connectors: order about 50-percent more than needed to allow for some mistakes during assembly.
Chuck Tribolet posted 12-20-2011 07:24 PM ET (US)
I got an e-mail from Mouser today. The other pins shipped.
I won't see them till next week (out of town), so watch this
space.
BTW, for small, light, shipments, always check out USPS.
USPS is usually cheaper and faster than UPS ground or FedEx
Ground. It's often next day.

Chuck
jimh posted 12-21-2011 08:58 PM ET (US)
While we are waiting for Chuck to get all the components for the connector he chose for this application, there is one other element of the method that needs to be worked out. We need to hear from Chuck on his "convention about where + and - go" for the wiring.
As I mentioned in my original article on NMEA-0183 interfacing, there are four possible configurations of the ports and ten possible combinations of interconnecting those four port configurations. We need Chuck to detail how to wire his two-pole connectors so that all of the possible interconnects will produce the desired results.
Chuck Tribolet posted 12-31-2011 09:43 PM ET (US)
The female pins arrived, no surprises.
I don't actually have an immediate project for these parts,
so I don't expect to actually do anything soon. By and by,
I'll replace my ten+ year old Garmin GPS 162 chartplotter, and
then I'll use them.
At this point, I don't see any reason it wouldn't work. I'll
work up a proposed standard wiring. There are two decisions:
1. Are the male pins or the female pins the output side? (Ans: which ever is best shielded from shorts)
2. Which pin is + and which is -? Ans: It really doesn't
matter. I do have an idea for a mnemonic for remembering,
but need to think it through more.

Chuck
jimh posted 02-13-2013 08:50 AM ET (US)
I would like to have an update on this connector installation, perhaps with some photographs. Has any progress been made?
Chuck Tribolet posted 02-16-2013 05:21 AM ET (US)
I've not done anything further on this project at all. My
Garmin 162 keeps working so I haven't been motivated to spend
for newer, fancier, chart plotter. I will see if I can come
up with some pictures of the connectors and crimper.

Chuck
Chuck Tribolet posted 02-17-2013 03:13 PM ET (US)
Here's some pictures.
The crimper:
http://chucktribolet.smugmug.com/Other/Molex-Mizu-P-25-Connectors/ i-jtXTWsq/0/M/CT_2013-02-17-123958-M.jpg
Detail of crimper:
http://chucktribolet.smugmug.com/Other/Molex-Mizu-P-25-Connectors/ i-5S4M3XV/0/M/CT_2013-02-17-123818-M.jpg
Note the shape of the jaws. They will bend the terminal into
a B-shape, with the B lying on its back. These little
terminals get crimped in the smaller B jaw.
Terminals and housings:
http://chucktribolet.smugmug.com/Other/Molex-Mizu-P-25-Connectors/ i-qKzTQCx/0/M/CT_2013-02-17-124534-M.jpg
The mail terminal goes in the female housing and vice versa.
Detail of terminals:
http://chucktribolet.smugmug.com/Other/Molex-Mizu-P-25-Connectors/ i-2pKXFKL/0/M/CT_2013-02-17-124328-M.jpg
Note that there are two parts that get crimped. The middle
part gets wrapped around the conductor in a B shape, the end part
gets wrapped around the insulation in a circle to act as a
strain relief.
I'd use the female housing as the OUT side as it seems like
the terminals are more protected from accidental shorts.
I'd make the OUT wires 1.5" longer than the IN wires so that
the two housing aren't side by side, forming an inelegant
lump that needs a bigger hole.

Chuck
jimh posted 02-17-2013 11:47 PM ET (US)
Many thanks to Chuck for the pictures of the crimper, the terminals, and the connector housings. From the images, I believe I have a crimper that will work with those terminal. My crimper is a Molex branded crimper, but the details of the A and B crimp jaws looks extremely similar to the crimper shown.

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Author	Topic: NMEA-0183 Interface: Paired Two-pole Male, Female Connectors
jimh	posted 12-21-2011 08:48 PM ET (US) [This topic was originally a sidebar to a discussion suggesting a four-pole genderless connector. This different method suggesting the use of two two-pole connectors of opposite gender has been separated into its own topic.]
Chuck Tribolet	posted 11-25-2011 03:42 PM ET (US) Another solution [to the problem of interfacing NMEA-0183 serial devices with a generic or universal wiring solution] would be to put a keyed connector with two [female sockets] on the two NMEA out lines and a keyed connector with two [male pins] on the two NMEA in lines, with a convention about where + and - go. These Molex connectors look like they would be suitable. Chuck
Chuck Tribolet	posted 11-25-2011 03:45 PM ET (US) [Reversed the gender of the connectors; this change has been made to the article above-jimh]
jimh	posted 11-26-2011 12:05 AM ET (US) The cost of the MOLEX connector mentioned by Chuck--the MOLEX Mizu-P25 wire-to-wire miniature waterproof connector--is not too high. I have researched these devices and show a source for them with the cost below. A two-pole plug is only $1.31. http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail. aspx?R=52213-0211virtualkey53810000virtualkey538-52213-0211 I could not locate the price for the terminals, but they can't be much more than $0.20-each. We can figure less than $2 per connector. The mating connector is a little more expensive, about $2.73: http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail. aspx?qs=AplfTeSvkkCNwOPM3Ynl%2fQ%3d%3d With terminals figure about $3.15. This gives us a cost of about $5.15 per device per port. I was becoming interested in this connector until I read the data sheet. It notes that for assembly of the connector a special "cap fitting tool" is required. http://rhu004.sma-promail.com/SQLImages/kelmscott/Molex/PDF_Images/ 987650-5961.PDF That special tooling has cooled my enthusiasm for this particular connector.
Chuck Tribolet	posted 11-26-2011 10:19 AM ET (US) I wonder if that tool is really necessary, or just makes things go faster in a production environment. I couldn't find anybody with an online quote for the tool. I googled up the manual for the tool, I'd guess it would be about $50. BTW, here's a list of splashproof connectors: http://search.digikey.com/us/en/cat/connectors-interconnects/ rectangular-housings/1442556?k=splashproof%20molex&stock=1&site=us& lang=en
jimh	posted 11-27-2011 07:54 AM ET (US) Perhaps to assemble just a few connectors by hand a cap fitting tool could be improvised. Chuck--You should order a couple of those Mizu-P25 MOLEX connectors and see how they work. Let us know how the crimp connectors work with a non-specific crimp tool, how difficult it is to assemble the contacts into the connector bodies, and how difficult it is to install the cap fitting. If it's possible to assemble those connectors without special crimp tools and the cap fitting tool, they look like they'd be a reasonably good connector for the purpose of connecting NMEA-0183 signals between devices.
Chuck Tribolet	posted 11-30-2011 07:14 PM ET (US) I ordered five of each housing and 15 of each terminal. Mouser had the terminals: 50148 (female, $0.21) and 50147 (male, $0.18). One of the terminals is back-ordered. Chuck
Chuck Tribolet	posted 12-03-2011 09:16 PM ET (US) They arrived today, USPS Priority Mail (which was the cheapest too, BTW). I turns out that I have a crimper that will work. It's a Waldom crimper that I bought back in the '70s for installing driving lights and rallye navigation equipment. But it's not your usual crimper as it's made for completely uninsulated crimps. It's Waldom HT-1919 and Google turns it up for about $18.48 from Digikey. It looks like Molex owns Waldom now. The tool for fitting the cap is not necessary. You can push down on the cap with a small screwdriver or a fingernail. The cap slides into housing and compresses the gasket that seals around the wire. Chuck
Chuck Tribolet	posted 12-07-2011 10:55 PM ET (US) I got an e-mail from Mouser today. The terminals that are backordered won't be in until February. No problem for me. Chuck
jimh	posted 12-07-2011 11:05 PM ET (US) Chuck and I appear to use the same philosophy about ordering terminals for crimp-on and insert connectors: order about 50-percent more than needed to allow for some mistakes during assembly.
Chuck Tribolet	posted 12-20-2011 07:24 PM ET (US) I got an e-mail from Mouser today. The other pins shipped. I won't see them till next week (out of town), so watch this space. BTW, for small, light, shipments, always check out USPS. USPS is usually cheaper and faster than UPS ground or FedEx Ground. It's often next day. Chuck
jimh	posted 12-21-2011 08:58 PM ET (US) While we are waiting for Chuck to get all the components for the connector he chose for this application, there is one other element of the method that needs to be worked out. We need to hear from Chuck on his "convention about where + and - go" for the wiring. As I mentioned in my original article on NMEA-0183 interfacing, there are four possible configurations of the ports and ten possible combinations of interconnecting those four port configurations. We need Chuck to detail how to wire his two-pole connectors so that all of the possible interconnects will produce the desired results.
Chuck Tribolet	posted 12-31-2011 09:43 PM ET (US) The female pins arrived, no surprises. I don't actually have an immediate project for these parts, so I don't expect to actually do anything soon. By and by, I'll replace my ten+ year old Garmin GPS 162 chartplotter, and then I'll use them. At this point, I don't see any reason it wouldn't work. I'll work up a proposed standard wiring. There are two decisions: 1. Are the male pins or the female pins the output side? (Ans: which ever is best shielded from shorts) 2. Which pin is + and which is -? Ans: It really doesn't matter. I do have an idea for a mnemonic for remembering, but need to think it through more. Chuck
jimh	posted 02-13-2013 08:50 AM ET (US) I would like to have an update on this connector installation, perhaps with some photographs. Has any progress been made?
Chuck Tribolet	posted 02-16-2013 05:21 AM ET (US) I've not done anything further on this project at all. My Garmin 162 keeps working so I haven't been motivated to spend for newer, fancier, chart plotter. I will see if I can come up with some pictures of the connectors and crimper. Chuck
Chuck Tribolet	posted 02-17-2013 03:13 PM ET (US) Here's some pictures. The crimper: http://chucktribolet.smugmug.com/Other/Molex-Mizu-P-25-Connectors/ i-jtXTWsq/0/M/CT_2013-02-17-123958-M.jpg Detail of crimper: http://chucktribolet.smugmug.com/Other/Molex-Mizu-P-25-Connectors/ i-5S4M3XV/0/M/CT_2013-02-17-123818-M.jpg Note the shape of the jaws. They will bend the terminal into a B-shape, with the B lying on its back. These little terminals get crimped in the smaller B jaw. Terminals and housings: http://chucktribolet.smugmug.com/Other/Molex-Mizu-P-25-Connectors/ i-qKzTQCx/0/M/CT_2013-02-17-124534-M.jpg The mail terminal goes in the female housing and vice versa. Detail of terminals: http://chucktribolet.smugmug.com/Other/Molex-Mizu-P-25-Connectors/ i-2pKXFKL/0/M/CT_2013-02-17-124328-M.jpg Note that there are two parts that get crimped. The middle part gets wrapped around the conductor in a B shape, the end part gets wrapped around the insulation in a circle to act as a strain relief. I'd use the female housing as the OUT side as it seems like the terminals are more protected from accidental shorts. I'd make the OUT wires 1.5" longer than the IN wires so that the two housing aren't side by side, forming an inelegant lump that needs a bigger hole. Chuck
jimh	posted 02-17-2013 11:47 PM ET (US) Many thanks to Chuck for the pictures of the crimper, the terminals, and the connector housings. From the images, I believe I have a crimper that will work with those terminal. My crimper is a Molex branded crimper, but the details of the A and B crimp jaws looks extremely similar to the crimper shown.