posted 12-09-2014 09:15 AM ET (US)        

--the DISPLAY will be a touch-screen multi-touch widescreen aspect ratio with LED backlighting;

--conventional physical buttons and controls will also be provided;

--wireless connectivity (presumably with WiFi) will be built-into the Gen-3; no need for external wireless add-on device; with tablets and smartphones the Gen-3 can be remotely viewed and operated;

--GPS receiver has 10-Hz position solution rate (but still GPS-only, it appears);

--two different digital charts can be view simultaneously;

--SONAR includes pulse compression technology;

--two slots for removable memory cards in MicroSD format.

The SONAR can operate in three modes:

--Broadband, Lowrance's name for their enhanced conventional 83-kHz to 200-kHz range SONAR that uses very short pulse duration to improve target resolution;

--a limited bandwidth pulse-compression mode, popularly called "chirp", to improve target resolution (and keep up with the marketing blitz for this technology); this technology is adapted for use with the existing inexpensive skimmer transducer rather than requiring larger, lower-Q, much more expensive transducers.

--DownScan, Lowrance's name for very high-frequency conventional SONAR that gives more target detail; this may require additional transducers to implement.

The DownScan SONAR can be overlaid on the two other presentation modes.

posted 12-09-2014 10:18 AM ET (US)            

ZOUT ---> a minus sign

ZIN ---> a plus sign

EXIT ---> character "X"

ENTER ---> downward and left arrow

MENU ---> representation of drop-down menu from screen presentation

PAGES ---> representation of two pages shown side by side

WPT/FIND --> waving flag

LIGHT/PWR --> universal power one/zero icon

As a native speaker of English, I prefer the short English word legends. For the screen zoom function, the plus sign and minus sign are reasonably easy to understand.

For the EXIT function, I think the ESC (escape) legend would be better. I think this is practically universally understood by even non-English speakers. The single charcter "X" is generally understood to mean multiplication. I am familiar with an "X" contained inside a square as a graphic cue for "close window" on some interfaces. The "X" can also be seen as a stop button in some browsers.

The ENTER symbol is widely understood, but I again would prefer the English word legend. That same icon appears on some keyboard RETURN keys.

The new icons replacing MENU and PAGES are totally new inventions from Lowrance for iconic representation. I don't find them particularly familiar or intuitive.

The waving flag for WPT (Waypoint)--another invention--has very little intuitive meaning for me. WPT seems like a practically universally understood term in navigation. The flag icon holds no meaning for me as a navigation function.

The zero-one power icon is completely understood these days by practically the entire planet, so I have no objection to that. I presume the lighting function has been removed from the button in the new device.

posted 12-09-2014 10:22 AM ET (US)            

"Push the MENU button to access the menu selection page."

Now one would have to say something awkward like this:

"Push the button that has an icon representing the appearance of the drop down menus to access the menu selection page."

--or--

"Push the third down button on the left side of the eight button array..."

posted 12-14-2014 11:55 AM ET (US)            

--INSIGHT (in several sub-brands), which seems to be Lowrance's brand of digital charts

--NAVIONICS, a global chart publisher with several tiers of charts and features, and

--C-MAP, also a global chart publisher

To review a bit, we look at INSIGHT and the many options from Lowrance:

--INSIGHT GENESIS: an electronic chart made from the user's own data, collected by the user with the chart plotter and sounder, uploaded to Lowrance, and returned as a custom digital chart;

--LAKE INSIGHT: a collection of charts for inland lakes, available in PRO and HD versions

--NAUTIC INSIGHT, a collection of charts of USA coastal coverage, available in PRO and HD versions;

--TOPO INSIGHT HD, a collection of USA land based digital charts, sold by regions in Midwest, North Central, Northeast, South Central, Southeast, and Southwest; and

posted 12-17-2014 05:13 PM ET (US)            

December 17, 2014

Lowrance Announces The All-New HDS® Gen3
High Definition System Combines Today's Best Fishfinder and Navigation Technologies Into One Easy-to-Use, Multi-Touch Display

Lowrance, a world-leading brand in fishing electronics since 1957, announced today the launch of the High Definition System (HDS) Gen3 fishfinder/chartplotter series. The next revolutionary step forward for the world's top-selling and award-winning multi-function display, HDS Gen3 is available in 7-, 9- and 12-inch models and combines a faster processor with enhanced, built-in fishfinder technologies, as well as a modified menu system that's even easier to use.

With an improved Lowrance user interface plus multi-touch and full keypad operation, the HDS Gen3 series provides quicker, fingertip access to all features—along with an enhanced, lightning-fast processor for more responsive performance. Instinctive, icon-driven commands are easy to learn, and convenient features such as scrolling menus, cursor assist, snap-to setting markers and preview panes with quick-touch slider bars, provide a user-friendly feel, similar to operating a smartphone or tablet.

Each HDS Gen3 model comes standard with today's most advanced fishfinding technologies—from StructureScan® HD and DownScan Imaging™, which provide picture-like images of fish-holding cover—to CHIRP Sonar for improved target separation and superior noise rejection for clearer, easy-to-see bait fish and game fish targets. When combined with Lowrance's TrackBack™ feature, these sonar technologies combine to make HDS the fishfinder of choice for anglers worldwide.

Additionally, the HDS Gen3 features built-in wireless connectivity for convenient mapping and software downloads directly to your fishfinder/chartplotter, as well as connection with mobile devices using the Lowrance GoFree App. All HDS Gen3 models are also plug-and-play compatible with performance-enhancing options such as SpotlightScan Sonar™, Broadband Radar™, SonicHub® Marine Audio, SiriusXM® Marine Weather and audio, Class B AIS and DSC VHF, as well as the recently released SmartSteer™ control for MotorGuide® Xi5 electric-steer trolling motors and the Lowrance Outboard Pilot.

"Since 2008, anglers worldwide have relied on Lowrance HDS systems to make the most of their time on the water," said Leif Ottosson, CEO, Navico. "Not only does HDS offer today's most advanced fishfinder technologies, the collection of optional mapping solutions and performance modules cannot be surpassed by any fishfinder/chartplotter in the industry."

Providing anglers with the most expansive list of mapping-upgrade options, HDS Gen3 is compatible with the complete collection of Navionics® charts, as well as C-MAP MAX-N+ and third-party mapping partners, such as NV Digital Charts. HDS Gen3 can also utilize the Insight Genesis™ map-creation tool, which allows users to create and share high-definition contour maps from personalized sonar recordings. All charting options can also be used with Insight Planner™ PC navigation-planning software. In addition, Easy Routing and AutoRouting features are available globally, outside of the Americas, with C-MAP MAX-N+ and Navionics charts, respectively.

posted 12-17-2014 05:47 PM ET (US)            

HDS-12 Gen3
USD MSRP: $3,149.00

HDS-9 Gen3
USD MSRP: $2,049.00

posted 12-18-2014 09:41 AM ET (US)            

More features for less cost is a trend I like.

It will be interesting to see how the competitors respond to the Gen-3 challenge.

posted 12-20-2014 09:36 AM ET (US)            

--with INSIGHT USA charts and no transducers; this is the base price usually mentioned.

--with INSIGHT USA charts and 83-kHz/200-kHz Skimmer transducer; add $50 to base price.

--with INSIGHT USA charts and 50-kHz/200-kHz transducer; add $100 to base price.

--with INSIGHT USA charts, 83-kHz/200-kHz Skimmer transducer, and LSS-2 transducer for side scan (STRUCTURE SCAN); add $250 to base price.

There are other transducers available for the downward directed SONAR. These are listed at a Transducer Guide web page.

http://www.lowrance.com/transducerguide/

posted 12-20-2014 01:59 PM ET (US)            

In the QUICK START guide, Lowrance explains the function of these buttons. First, it gives an illustration with callout numbers that point to the various buttons. This gets around the problem of how to describe a button with only an icon label. The user won't know a button is the "menu" button until you explain the icon to him. So Lowrance uses a technical illustration with callout numbers and arrows.

Callout-6 points to the button I thought was the old MENU button on earlier models. Lowrance tells the user that button Callout-6 is called the "Menu key." Well, I was right about that, but the button has very different function than the old menu button. The function for this new Callout-6 button or the button called "Menu key" or the button with an icon that seems to be intended to represent drop down menus on a computer graphical user interface, is described as follows:

--activates the panel menu (which I presume is defined somewhere else, otherwise, what is a panel menu?);

--press twice to access the Settings menu;

--press and hold to hide the panel menu.

Callout-9 points to the button I thought was the old PAGES button on earlier models. Lowrance tells the user that button Callout-9 is called the "Panel key". It turns out this button is only somewhat related to the old PAGES button. (The old PAGES button brought up a navigation page that allowed the user to select the display's contents.) Callout-9 button has a two new functions:

--switches the active panel on a multiple-panel display, and

--press and hold to expand the active panel to a full-page panel.

posted 12-24-2014 09:07 AM ET (US)            

Lowrance HDS Gen-3 User-interface for System Controls. This on-screen touch menu appears when the user has pushed the button with the universal 0-1 icon or what in the narrative Lowrances calls "the power key."

posted 04-30-2015 01:05 PM ET (US)            

--I miss the days of my Northstar 95x series of GPS units;

--you don't need an external GPS antenna (but you can add one). I even got a fix inside my garage with the door closed;

--it took me about 30 minutes to figure out how to get out of the demo mode;

--chart plotters have come a long way

--I most likely will never use all the features

--you most likely will need the manual, maybe even download the PDF version to a tablet to have on the boat

--installation will be simple, figuring out all the options will add to the complexity;

--figuring I will most likely want to spend the off-time in the comfort of my house means deciding between flush or gimbal mount; but if I decide on flush, the mounting screws are under the front bezel, so four screws and out for the season, and

posted 04-30-2015 01:25 PM ET (US)            

Given the number of features, the number of optional accessory, and the several methods to interface the HDS series to other boat electronics, I would anticipate that a considerable amount of time will have to be spent becoming familiar with the hardware, with the user-interface, and in the operation of the device.

I do not subscribe to the notion that any user must be able to operate any modern electronic device to its ultimate capabilities without investing any time in study of the device or in reading support literature. This quotation matches my feelings on this topic:

quote:

---

I find it interesting that we complain when a new technology requires an hour or two of study. Some people complain if only fifteen minutes of study are required. Yet we do not complain about the huge learning periods required to master the things we have grown up with, such as learning to swim, skate, or ride a bike. Reading, writing, and arithmetic, the fundamentals of education, take years to master. Should we complain about these? No, they are appropriate to the task. When new items are appropriately complex, it is reasonable that they require time and effort to master. Our complaints should be directed toward technologies and services that are unnecessarily complicated, confusing, and without apparent structure.

---

posted 05-01-2015 02:44 PM ET (US)            

One of the the things I found over the years for myself, is that the device you initially learn on tends to be you preference for the future.

My preference for LORANs was the King (and eventually the Furuno MKII's) for the way they operated, and once into the GPS world I did and still do everything in the north up mode, because that was the way I started.

posted 05-01-2015 04:16 PM ET (US)            

I did not really find anything you said about the Northstar devices in comparison the Lawrence HDS Gen-3 to give me any insight into either device. I believe you said, repeated twice, that you missed the Northstar devices.

I think you got off to a bad start with the Lowrance HDS because you said it took you half an hour to shut down the demonstration mode. Now that you're over that hurdle and you've shut off demo mode, I bet the HDS will come up running in a flash. I bet its GNSS receiver is better than the old chart plotter you liked. I bet its SONAR is lightyears ahead. I bet the display is better. I bet the digital charts are better. I bet the price is much better.

posted 05-01-2015 06:57 PM ET (US)            

As an aside, for those of us who are gluttons for punishment, here's Lowrance's current deal:

MORE TIME FOR THE ULTIMATE UPGRADE
The ultimate Upgrade savings offer has new life.
Previously scheduled to end May 3, the offer has been extended to July 5, 2015.
To get your Ultimate Upgrade, purchase a HDS Gen2 Touch and another qualified product by July 5 and receive up to a $300 rebate.

posted 05-07-2015 09:51 PM ET (US)            

It appears AIS data is going to be a no-go. The GX2200 outputs AIS data on the 0183 port. [The GX2200 only has a NMEA-0183 interface, so that is the only place it can interface to other devices--jimh]. The HDS only receives AIS data on its NEMA-2000 port. And, here, I thought the geek at West Marine really knew what he was talking about.

The HDS I have has software version 1.0. On April 1, 2015, version 1.5 came out. April fools on me.

No matter how I try, the HDS does not boot from the card [with the updater file]. Tried formatting the card under Windows and Mac OS, tried unzipping to the card, tried unzipping from the card, nothing. The website is sparse on info with regard to actually doing the update.

To add to my misery, I purchased a Navionics+ card. I'm still not sure I like the program Navionics is running. They are the mother ship for multiple higher end units, yet their tech support will tell you the Navionics charts are way superior to the Lowrance charts, a Navionics subsidiary. Navionics tech told me the Navionics+ cards are superior as they include the entire U.S.A and SonarCharts [i.e., a branding called "SonarChart"], and that the cards are 16-GByte compared to the Gold cards 2-GByte. My new card is only 2-GByte, and, when I tried to download the charts, their system would only let be grab a portion of the US. Then [the Navionics download server] gave me an error for insufficient data space.

I still haven't figured out why my HDS boots up to a non-existent Navionics chart instead of the factory supplied Lowrance charts.

I went online, read a bunch if tricks. I used a new [unclear, perhaps means a removable storage card] from Costco, one of the high speed, 32-GByte chips. No formatting. [long narrative of moving the memory storage card among variuos operating systems and using various methods] and [the HDS Gen3] went through the update procedure successfully. When finished I verified it was indeed 1.5. This time I was also able to see the card under the "files" window. Perhaps the previous cards, having been formatted multiple times under either Windows or Mac [were the cause of the problem].

posted 05-10-2015 07:40 AM ET (US)            

It is unfortunate that it took you so many attempts to perform the software update, but I suspect that the causes of the earlier failures were not any element of randomness in the HDS operating system. In my experience with performing updates to the HDS operating system--I have done it several times--it works reliably and without any random problems. I would attribute failure of the update process to be successful to be due to errors in the files on your removable storage card, and not to anything odd about the Lowrance update process.

The space available on a removable storage volume has been a problem in some early versions of the NAViCO operating system used with the Lowrance HDS. A removable storage volume must be properly sized: large enough to hold the update file, but not larger than the operating system of the HDS can handle. On the earlier versions of the operating system, the size of a removable storage volume was limited, and a frequent problem occurred when users tried to employ removable storage cards that were too large. However, these early version HDS problem are well known. I don't think they reflect anything odd or unusual about the Lowrance HDS Gen3. It apparently can use removable storage cards of 32-Gbytes, according to your narrative. I don't find that to be a particularly odd limitation.

posted 05-10-2015 08:02 AM ET (US)            

Re the Lowrance HDS Gen3 and AIS via NMEA-0183: in the Lowrance HDS Gen3 Installation Manual, specific instructions are provided for setting the baud rate of the NMEA-0183 port for use with AIS devices. This is a reasonable basis to assume the Lowrance HDS Gen3 has the capability to receive AIS data via that port.

The manual also lists the supported sentences for its NMEA-0183. The list includes the usual sentence for AIS: DSC, DSE, and "VDM" [actually AIVDM--jimh]

These statements in the literature from Lowrance contradict the assertion made above (by user porthole2) that the Lowrance HDS Gen3 can only handle AIS data via NMEA-2000.

The Lowrance HDS Gen3 appears to have only one NMEA-0183 bi-directional port, as documented in the Installation Guide on page 26 in the PDF document found on their website. The port connections are provided on the Power/Data cable and are a typical NMEA-0183 balanced port or RS-422 type port.

posted 05-10-2015 08:48 AM ET (US)            

The update process requires that an executable file be available on a removable storage volume inserted into a card slot on the HDS. On power initialization the HDS checks the cart slots for such a file, and, if found, executes the instructions in the file. This method of moving files among computer systems is known as SneakerNet.

The process of creating a removable storage volume on a card is typically left to the user. The user downloads the updater from a remote host. The form of the updater files may be in an archive. Lowrance provides instructions on the steps to be taken to write onto a memory card the necessary files. This process can be performed by many operating systems, but the operating system is not involved in any way with the update process.

Lowrance has, in the past, tried to make the creation of an updater file an automated process by using various methods. In some cases a JAVA script was used. In some cases some sort of Window-specific self-executing application was tried. Problems with this process being performed by users is nothing new or unique to the HDS Gen3.

posted 05-11-2015 02:40 PM ET (US)            

"The source of most reported problems are errors by the user performing the update."

[Line breaks inserted for clarity--I hope that is not going to change any meaning--jimh]

That may very well be, but there is zero information on the Lowrance update-download website on how to actually perform the update. Although, the PDF file for the update exclaims that the how to info is contained, it is not physically in the file.

From the website: "**Prior to performing this update, review the release notes for more information as the update process has been modified**'

Powerpoint file http://www.lowrance.com/Global/Lowrance/Documents/Software/ G2T_RTM_40_G3%20RTM_15_Release_Notes.pptx

"I do not have much faith in your report that AIS data must only be sent to the HDS via NMEA-2000 because I have my own experience with earlier version of the HDS that contradicts that"
Maybe so, but I did specifically list the Standard Horizon GX-2200 that does not output the 3 sentences you listed (also from the Lowrance manual) DSC, DSE, and VDM.
So I have to assume that since the HDS is supposed to be able to receive AIS data on the 0183 port, it does require the RX to be DSC, DSE and VDM. The GX-2200 lists only the following sentences, GGA, GLL, GSA, GSV, RMC. One of the features of the AIS integrations is supposed to be the ability to make a DSC call from the HDS screen.

I'm sure I am doing something wrong, but I sure would like to know the correct color combo to make it work.
"The update process requires that an executable file be available on a removable storage volume inserted into a card slot on the HDS. On power initialization the HDS checks the cart slots for such a file, and, if found, executes the instructions in the file.["]

[Now PORTHOLE2 is talking, not quoting me--jimh]The file that HDS Gen 3 is looking for has the extension .upd

All versions of the update file I have on my system are appended .upd
HDS_Gen3-1.5-51.1.80-31341-r1-Standard-1.upd
HDS_Gen3-1.5-51.1.80-31341-r1-Standard-1.auto.upd (self run at boot)

As it turns out, "if" the update file is downloaded and unzipped correctly, there should be a file appended .auto.upd that is placed in the root directory of a micro SD card.
The unit's OS looks for the update file to contain the "auto" in the file name. If found, the system performs the update and when the process is complete, the file name is re-written without the ".auto". This allows the card to stay in the unit without the OS attempting to update the software at every startup.

posted 05-12-2015 07:50 PM ET (US)            

quote:

---

The source of most reported problems are errors by the user performing the update.

---

posted 05-12-2015 09:08 PM ET (US)            

PORTHOLE TOPIC A: NO UPDATE INSTRUCTIONS

quote:

---

...there is zero information on the Lowrance update-download website on how to actually perform the update. Although, the PDF file for the update exclaims that the how to info is contained, it is not physically in the file.

---

This contradicts my experience with Lowrance. I have performed many firmware upgrades to Lowrance HDS products, and everyone has worked. There were instructions on how to perform the update. I can't accept the notion that after being in the business of making the HDS and providing updates that Lowrance suddenly forgot to tell the users how to perform the update.

PORTHOLE TOPIC B: WHERE ARE THE INSTRUCTIONS

quote:

---

Maybe you can find where they give instructions for this procedure?

---

Maybe I can, but I don't have the time right now to undertake that project. My experience tells me the instructions must be somewhere, otherwise how could anyone figure it out?

PORTHOLE TOPIC C; was HDS GEN-2 ONLY WORKS WITH NMEA-2000 FOR AIS; now changed to STANDARD-HORIZON DOES NOT OUPUT DSC, DSE, and AIVDM

quote:

---

...I did specifically list the Standard Horizon GX-2200 that does not output the [three] sentences you listed (also from the Lowrance manual) DSC, DSE, and VDM.

So I have to assume that since the HDS is supposed to be able to receive AIS data on the 0183 port, it does require the RX to be DSC, DSE and VDM. The GX-2200 lists only the following sentences, GGA, GLL, GSA, GSV, RMC.

---

From the literature for the GX2200 from Standard Horizon, called the Owner's Manual, page 22 of the PDF:

quote:

---

The NMEA 0183 output sentences are DSC and DSE.

---

quote:

---

The [certain color] wires output AIS VDM sentence...

---

I hope this clears up the discussion regarding AIS with:

--the HDS: it does AIS

--the GX200: it does AIS

PORTHOLE TOPIC D: how can the HDS Gen-3 and GX2200 be interfaced for AIS:

quote:

---

I'm sure I am doing something wrong, but I sure would like to know the correct color combo to make it work.

---

I guess we have gone from these devices both not having AIS to them having AIS but how is it interfaced. I would be glad to help you interface these devices. Start a new thread, with a topic "NMEA-0183 Interface for GX2000 and HDS Gen-3" and I will give you some guidance. I have never met two NMEA-0183 devices that I couldn't interface. See you in the new thread.

Please note that I never just give color-to-color instructions. I just give the general solution, which is TALKER A to LISTENER A, and TALKER B to LISTENER B.

posted 05-12-2015 09:10 PM ET (US)            

PORTHOLE2 TOPIC E: MAKING DSC CALL TO AIS TARGET BY RADIO CONTROL FROM CHARTPLOTTER

quote:

---

One of the features of the AIS integrations is supposed to be the ability to make a DSC call from the HDS screen.

---

posted 05-12-2015 11:25 PM ET (US)            

[Actually, "the following" was not strictly related to the HDS Gen3. PORTHOLE2 changed the topic of discussion away from the Lowrance HDS Gen3 and began to discuss the participants in the discussion. This sidebar discussion of the participants has been deleted--jimh]

From the literature for the HDS Gen3 (no space) from Lowrance, called the Operator Manual, page 120 of the paperback supplied with the unit: [Quoted material apparently follows]

Calling an AIS vessel.

If the system includes a VHF radio supporting DSC (Digital selective calling) calls over NMEA 2000, you can initiate a DSC call to other vessels from the HDS Gen3.

posted 05-13-2015 12:00 AM ET (US)            

I found about six pages of detailed instructions on how to perform an update to the HDS Gen-3 in the INSTALLATION MANUAL. See:

http://www.lowrance.com/Root/Lowrance-Documents/HDSGen3/US/ HDS_GEN3_IM_EN_988-10733-001_w.pdf

See the section under the sub-heading

SOFTWARE UPDATES AND DATA BACKUP

posted 05-13-2015 12:11 AM ET (US)            

quote:

---

If the system includes a VHF radio supporting DSC (Digital selective calling) calls over NMEA 2000, you can initiate a DSC call to other vessels from the HDS Gen3.

---

I found a similar quote in

http://www.lowrance.com/Root/Lowrance-Documents/HDSGen3/US/ HDS-GEN3-OM_EN_988-10740-001_w.pdf

which appears on page 120 and says:

quote:

---

Calling an AIS vessel

If the system includes a VHF radio supporting DSC (Digital Select Calling) calls over NMEA 2000, you can initiate a DSC call to other vessels from the HDS Gen3.

---

That sounds reasonable to me. I don't have any basis to argue with it. Of course, you have two big problems:

--"the system" you have assembled does not have a VHF radio with NMEA-2000;

--since you don't have a VHF radio with NMEA-2000, your radio cannot possibly support the NMEA-2000 PGN being used to initiate the call.

A further problem is Lowrance does not identify the PGN they are using to initiate a digital selective call on the radio from the chart plotter. A NMEA-2000 device should list the PGN's it supports. The only way to know if two devices will interoperate with this function is for each device to list the PGN's it can send or receive. Since Lowrance does not seem to list the PGN for this call generator function, it is going to be hard to tell what radios will work with it.

posted 07-20-2015 03:11 PM ET (US)            

quote:

---

ASIDE to PORTHOLE2: I hope you know that your Standard-Horizon GX2200 radio can already initiate or set-up a DSC page to an AIS target. The radio handles that function all by itself.

---