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Author Topic:   Black Boxes in Mercury Outboards?

wspellenbe posted 04-24-2003 08:53 PM ET (US)
I came upon this. Did anyone know they were doing this?
http://www.cgaux.org/cgauxweb/boating/NASBLA-WSBAA-Rpt.pdf
Go to page 3 it states they are working with Mercury on the development of a Black Box to record info for crash investigations. Engines after 2002 have it WOW. I am no civil liberties person but when will it end.
wayne baker posted 04-24-2003 10:22 PM ET (US)
merc is not the only one all new motors with on board computers can be downloaded. This according to my mechinic. So how many rpm's did you say you were turning when you blew up this brand new motor.
jimh posted 04-25-2003 01:29 PM ET (US)
The PCM555 engine control system was developed by Mercury to improve engine performance, and you are probably going to see more electronic control modules like this in use on outboard motors.
The PCM555 controller apparently retains some data about the state of the engine, which can be extracted (probably via a serial data link). I am sure this feature was intended for diagnostics, not for invasion of privacy.
When you operate a boat on the inland or coastal waters of the United States, you have already been compelled to give up many of your civil rights that your would otherwise have if you were sitting in your home or car.
Unlike your home or car, a Coast Guard (or other marine law inforcement) officer can stop your vessel and come aboard to inspect it without any probable cause. I doubt that there will be any protection against search and seizure of the information on the engine control module. From the short paragraph in the reference article on this topic one gets the sense that this has already been decided in favor of the law enforcement agencies.
jaccoserv posted 04-25-2003 06:51 PM ET (US)
And for those of you lying about the hours on your late model Merc, all the buyer has to do is take it to his local shop and have them plug it in...
jimh posted 04-25-2003 11:03 PM ET (US)
Further to the discussion of civil rights and privacy, if you are in a boating accident the marine law enforcement surely will administer a blood test or breath test for alcohol in your blood stream. This seems like more of an invasion of privacy that getting some data from the engine's control module.
My 1993 Ford 4.6L V-8 automobile engine has a control module that retains historical information about the engine and what it has been doing. This is really ten year old (or older) technology in automobile engines.
And there is a simple way to extract the information and display it on the instrument panel of the car, although it is a bit tedious to do this (as it involves counting and recording sequences of flashing lights, then looking up their interpretation).

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Author	Topic: Black Boxes in Mercury Outboards?
wspellenbe	posted 04-24-2003 08:53 PM ET (US) I came upon this. Did anyone know they were doing this? http://www.cgaux.org/cgauxweb/boating/NASBLA-WSBAA-Rpt.pdf Go to page 3 it states they are working with Mercury on the development of a Black Box to record info for crash investigations. Engines after 2002 have it WOW. I am no civil liberties person but when will it end.
wayne baker	posted 04-24-2003 10:22 PM ET (US) merc is not the only one all new motors with on board computers can be downloaded. This according to my mechinic. So how many rpm's did you say you were turning when you blew up this brand new motor.
jimh	posted 04-25-2003 01:29 PM ET (US) The PCM555 engine control system was developed by Mercury to improve engine performance, and you are probably going to see more electronic control modules like this in use on outboard motors. The PCM555 controller apparently retains some data about the state of the engine, which can be extracted (probably via a serial data link). I am sure this feature was intended for diagnostics, not for invasion of privacy. When you operate a boat on the inland or coastal waters of the United States, you have already been compelled to give up many of your civil rights that your would otherwise have if you were sitting in your home or car. Unlike your home or car, a Coast Guard (or other marine law inforcement) officer can stop your vessel and come aboard to inspect it without any probable cause. I doubt that there will be any protection against search and seizure of the information on the engine control module. From the short paragraph in the reference article on this topic one gets the sense that this has already been decided in favor of the law enforcement agencies.
jaccoserv	posted 04-25-2003 06:51 PM ET (US) And for those of you lying about the hours on your late model Merc, all the buyer has to do is take it to his local shop and have them plug it in...
jimh	posted 04-25-2003 11:03 PM ET (US) Further to the discussion of civil rights and privacy, if you are in a boating accident the marine law enforcement surely will administer a blood test or breath test for alcohol in your blood stream. This seems like more of an invasion of privacy that getting some data from the engine's control module. My 1993 Ford 4.6L V-8 automobile engine has a control module that retains historical information about the engine and what it has been doing. This is really ten year old (or older) technology in automobile engines. And there is a simple way to extract the information and display it on the instrument panel of the car, although it is a bit tedious to do this (as it involves counting and recording sequences of flashing lights, then looking up their interpretation).