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Author Topic:   1983 Outrage 18 Advice
a3matrix posted 08-07-2014 03:45 PM ET (US)   Profile for a3matrix   Send Email to a3matrix  
I am going to look at a 1983 Outrage 18 that was owned by an attorney and maintained by a dealer, a fresh water camp boat. It has 1984 Evinrude 140 on it, also dealer maintained, that has consistent compression across cylinders. The boat is in stock configuration and never had a bunch of after market accessories screwed or bolted on or into it. It has a Bimini that appears to be in nice shape.

I intend to crawl around underneath and give much attention to the hull, which has not seen bottom paint. From the photos it looks solid. Are there any particular problem areas on the hull that I should scrutinize more closely? Any areas topside?

The boat comes on a trailer that is not [bad].

Regardless of how well the engine runs there will be a re-power probably next year, unless I happen on an off season deal.

Lastly, is $7,500 too much to pay for this? I know this is an opinion-based question with a lot of variables factoring in. But where better to ask than here, which is why I ask. Thank you in advance for your opinions and Boston Whaler knowledge. If this deal reaches fruition the boat will continue its freshwater existence on Lake George.--Drew

jimh posted 08-07-2014 04:05 PM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
I wouldn't be too worried about the boat having been owned by an attorney. I know a couple of attorneys and they are good boaters.

Look closely at the through hull drains on the hull bottom for any sign that they have been unsealed or otherwise have let water get into the surrounding Unibond hull.

With no bottom paint, I hope the boat was mostly kept on a trailer or a boat hoist. A Boston Whaler should not sit in the water without some sort of hull protection, even in fresh water, for more than a week or two. See

http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/manual18-25/maintenance. html#bottom

Also check the transom strength. With the boat on a trailer and the engine tilted up, grab the engine gear case. Try to rock the engine on the transom. It should be very solid, with no movement or flexing of the transom. Freshwater boats are more prone to wood rot in the transom than saltwater boats. I think saltwater doesn't produce as much rot as freshwater will.

An OUTRAGE 18 is a desirable boat, and is sought after. It is great to find one with the hull in excellent condition, no bottom paint, all the original equipment intact, not too many owner-added accessories, and on a usable trailer. The 1984 Evinrude outboard in good running condition is a plus. Those engines will probably run forever if supplied with good fuel and good oil, and given a bit of maintenance. If the engine has a VRO, you should very carefully evaluate it, and particularly so if the VRO pump is an original 1984 design. See

http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/VRO.html

Figure an overhaul of the VRO system to the newer OMS pump will cost about $500 in parts.

Canvas is also a plus, particularly if it is more than just a Flying Top or Bimini.

You are buying the boat at a seasonal high price point, mid summer. Factor that into the deal. If you like the boat, don't wait too long. Good used Boston Whaler boats at fair prices usually sell to the first real buyer that sees them.

a3matrix posted 08-08-2014 12:02 AM ET (US)     Profile for a3matrix  Send Email to a3matrix     
My reference to attorney's was not a negative comment, rather highlighting that it was owned for by an individual with the financial means to look after it.
The boat was not in the water for long periods I am told. On a trailer when not used and I think stored inside. Never a fishing boat, used for summer family fun until the moved onto Jetski's when the kids got older.
I was sent a bunch of photos and it is a clean boat. The trailer looks solid, single axle galvanized. I have the seller at $7000 now. That doesn't seem to be a high price from what I see when searching for the same model on other sites. Lower than some, but those tend to have new(er) engines.
I am considering have the boat surveyed prior to final sale. I feel it would be worth the money to spend a few hundred before I spend $7k.
I will check all the areas you mentioned. Thanks for your input, it is appreciated.
Drew
AZdave posted 08-08-2014 01:29 AM ET (US)     Profile for AZdave  Send Email to AZdave     
I owned a similar Whaler. I would agree with all of jimh's comments except that I think you are past the high point for summer value. Condition is everything. If you have looked at a few classic Whalers, go with your overall impression. Don't be in a hurry to replace the Evinrude. It may last a few weeks or a decade. The only reason to replace it is lack of confidence in a potentially dangerous situation. Be vigilant for soft spots on the deck, and look for condensation when you pull up the inspection plates on the deck. If it has been kept indoors and there are no leaks, you should see no condensation on the plates or on the fuel tank. When you replace the motor you are looking at as much as twice the number you list as the boat price. You can buy many years of fuel for that price if you are a typical owner. Have fun. Many of us wish we were going along for the boat inspection.
elvis posted 08-08-2014 06:27 AM ET (US)     Profile for elvis  Send Email to elvis     
I've owned several 13s, 17s, a 1985 Outrage 18, and now a Guardian 18 and a smaller 15. I'm currently restoring the Guardian.

I am impressed with the 18 - it rides and performs great...a lot of punch in a small package.

On the boat you're considering, it sounds like it has potential. One small but important thing to check is the fuel tank system. On both 18s I'm acquainted with, this was an area that required some work and expense.

Consider removing the 2 inspection covers on the port side. This will expose the fill hoses and grounding wire. The fill hoses on mine required replacement as each was badly rotted on the bottom part. My son's Guardian 20 had the same problem.

Not a real expensive fix, but a little bit of a challenge to get hoses off and on particularly where connecting to tank...small hands needed under floor area. There is also a 3/4" or so vent hose that should be checked. Gas and gas fumes can be dangerous, so be sure these components are in good condition. I used USCG stamped hoses and double SS clamps.

In addition, check the grounding wire and each end....On mine, the ends were badly corroded and I'm not sure they were really making a good connection. On mine, there is also a ground wire that is at the stern of the tank that connects to a brass looking disc on the external part of the transom (beneath the waterline). My connections here, as elsewhere, were corroded. I replaced with new stuff. Finally on this Guardian, the fuel tank was so badly corroded and had holes everywhere that it required replacement....nearly $1,000 and the floor has to come out.... a HUGE job. My aluminum tank was bad probably because of heavy saltwater use, and someone on this forum also suggested that the severe corrosion could have been caused by electrolysis and bad grounding wires. I had stripped the hull down anyway, floor out, etc., so replacing the tank was in line with the restoration....yours being in freshwater vs salt is a plus, I believe, but I'd still give it a careful look.

I realize this is mostly small stuff compared to the bigger overall package, but about the only thing that ever worried me was a fuel leak and fire, so I practice a great deal of care and due diligence on inspecting this part of my boat. Hope this info is helpful.

jimh posted 08-08-2014 07:57 AM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
Re the fuel system: all the rubber hoses on a c.1983 boat will very likely NOT be rated for alcohol-gasoline blended fuel. Unless you have a reliable source of pure gasoline fuel, those rubber hoses will need attention. The epoch for rubber hoses with tolerance for alcohol-gasoline blended fuels is c.1987.
bdb posted 08-08-2014 09:18 AM ET (US)     Profile for bdb  Send Email to bdb     
$7,000 for what you have described? You won't find anything like it anywhere near that price. EVEN IF you have to attend to some of the points mentioned above you are staring at a great value. Move!
a3matrix posted 08-08-2014 09:23 AM ET (US)     Profile for a3matrix  Send Email to a3matrix     
I have a boat surveyor that is going to look over the boat's hull integrity and fuel system. He has some experience with Whalers and is aware of the moisture that can develop. He explained to me the percussion test with the hammer and also has a moisture meter that he will employ. I will be sure to mention the inspection plates. What about checking the tank internally? Is that a [concern]?
Thank you again for the knowledge.
Drew
ericflys posted 08-08-2014 01:52 PM ET (US)     Profile for ericflys  Send Email to ericflys     
Where is this boat located? I would like to buy it for $7,000. In fact, maybe even more than that. You should be done talking about it and it should be in your driveway. I don't know what area of the country you are in, but any decent Outrage 18 is worth at least $10,000 in my opinion.
EJO posted 08-08-2014 02:06 PM ET (US)     Profile for EJO  Send Email to EJO     
Buy it now immediately for that price and sell it to Eric.
a3matrix posted 08-08-2014 05:12 PM ET (US)     Profile for a3matrix  Send Email to a3matrix     
The deal has been made. $7k cash and an AR I bought and have never bothered to fire once in two years. The sad part is I have to leave for 3 months on 23 Aug so I won't even get to use it.
Seeing as I am moving forward with this it seems likely I will be lurking here quite a bit.
In anticipation allow me to thank everyone in advance for the knowledge transfer.
I grew up on the north shore of Long Island and always wanted a Montauk. This whole endeavor started with searching for those and discovering Newports, Stripers, all the classics and finally the Outrage. I still kind of think this is more boat than I need but go big or go home right? I can always trade it or sell it if it is too much.
Thanks again to everyone who weighed in. I will post some photos when I take delivery.
Drew
kwik_wurk posted 08-08-2014 07:08 PM ET (US)     Profile for kwik_wurk  Send Email to kwik_wurk     
Congrats, you likely got a good deal. From the descriptions, you likely won't have too much to deal with.

Definitely do the fuel system hoses. If your boat is lightly used and stored indoors, your tank is likely fine.

kwik_wurk posted 08-08-2014 07:10 PM ET (US)     Profile for kwik_wurk  Send Email to kwik_wurk     
Congrats, you likely got a good deal at least for $7,000. You can't get a decent Montauk for that price where I live. From the descriptions, you likely won't have too much to deal with.

Definitely re-do the fuel system hoses. If your boat is lightly used and stored indoors, your tank is likely fine.

a3matrix posted 08-14-2014 08:23 PM ET (US)     Profile for a3matrix  Send Email to a3matrix     
Quick question regarding the inspection plates: Tool(s) for removing? Phillips head screw driver? Or something else? I want to be sure to show up with what I need and haven't found anything specific to the hardware used.
I should be going up early next week to inspect and hopefully buy the boat. Have to admit, I am pretty excited. Kind of bummed that I will then have to immediately send the boat into winter storage as I leave soon after for 3 months abroad for work.
Drew
Marko888 posted 08-14-2014 09:06 PM ET (US)     Profile for Marko888    
Inspection plates are designed to be removed with a large blade screwdriver, or similar. Be careful as the plastic is soft.
jimh posted 08-15-2014 09:14 AM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
The deck access plates are pry-out style.
a3matrix posted 08-18-2014 01:59 PM ET (US)     Profile for a3matrix  Send Email to a3matrix     
Going up Wednesday. I will take pictures. Thanks for all the input.
a3matrix posted 08-19-2014 03:44 PM ET (US)     Profile for a3matrix  Send Email to a3matrix     
Link to the ad. Going up tomorrow morning to do the inspection which includes some time on Lake Champlain and hopefully seal the deal. If all goes well the boat will be on the west side of Lake George tomorrow. Of course it is going directly into winter storage due to my departure on Saturday. I will take a bunch of photos and post a link to them whether I go forward or not. In the event that someone else is interested.

http://burlington.craigslist.org/boa/4522273262.html

a3matrix posted 08-20-2014 02:04 PM ET (US)     Profile for a3matrix  Send Email to a3matrix     
I had to pass. The overall condition of the boat was just not where I expected it to be after my conversations with the seller. There was quite a bit of gelcoat cracking on the topside and the hull had an amateur fiberglass repair up forward on the keel. The boat is sitting on an all roller trailer that has one keel roller. There is noticeable scuffing from the roller on the hull. The engine did appear to be presentable but I never even got around to running it. It did have brand new plugs and the oil in the lower unit was very clean which could support the claim of dealer maintained. There was evidence that the floor panel has been up, white sealant used when it was put back down looks pretty clean. All the inspection plates were opened by the seller so I could have access. There appeared to be some cutouts in the foam around tank connections. Maybe the hoses were changed? Hard to tell as they didn't look new. From what I could see of the tank it didn't look new either. If it was new I am pretty sure that would have been brought up.
From the top side I would say the boat has seen outside storage without a cover other than the console cover. Ahh, the bimini top turned out to be the flying top.
Overall, the boat isn't horrible but it is a bit more project than I expected and possibly over priced in it's current condition. I did take a bunch of photos but not sure how they will look as the sun + white gelcoat combo was making it hard to get detailed shots.
All that said it has been a good education for me. This site and it's members have been an invaluable source of information and I thank you for your knowledge and experience. I will continue my quest. For me and my situation I feel it is better to spend more money if I have to to get a boat more turn key. Maintaining a boat that starts out in better condition rather than rehabbing one that needs TLC is more suited to my life at this point.
Let me know if you want to see the photos and I will upload them and post the link.
Thanks again.
Drew

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