posted 09-23-2014 10:00 PM ET (US)        

So here are the pros and cons as I see them, let me know where my misconceptions are or what I am overlooking:

(Side note: not currently considering a Mauntauk as I feel the Dauntless better suits my needs for a CC)

13 or 15 SPORT

Pro
--easy to bring up and down the boat ramp
--good fuel economy
--good seating for children
--easy to drive and maneuver
--great looking mahogany interiors

Con
--uncomfortable to drive for long periods
--can only be safely driven in fair or better conditions which also limits range
--could outgrow quickly

13, 14, 15 or 16 DAUNTLESS
Pro
--can be driven in moderate or worse conditions
--can take longer trips
--could take out in the ocean
--more comfortable to drive

Con
--worse fuel economy
--more difficult to launch and load
--usually more expensive
--harder to plane, which means higher minimum cruising speeds

posted 09-23-2014 10:17 PM ET (US)            

I would try to find a classic center console 15.

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Don't kid yourself, all of the boats your are considering do not have good ride when the chop comes up.

Also, all of the boats are smaller enough for easy hauling with a small car. Launching and handling is going to be the same across the board.

posted 09-24-2014 05:52 AM ET (US)            

Where do you live and what water will you be on? You don't have a location in your profile.

I think what you may find is that you will soon have "two footitis, meaning you'll want a larger boat as your children grow up, and they'll want to bring their friends on the boat.

posted 09-24-2014 09:46 AM ET (US)            

The 16 was very easy to launch and retrieve single handed. It was frugal with fuel with a 115 HP Evinrude FICHT two stroke engine. It had a 45 gallon in hull fuel tank which was good for almost the whole summer. If towing tubes or skiers it will burn more fuel as will any boat. It achieved plane in about three seconds and would hold plane at low speeds. With the optional seats five could be comfortably accommodated.

Ride quality with the modified V hull was as expected, superior to the skiff type hull and not as good as a deep V hull. The boat is a fine bay boat and did just as well offshore in routine weather conditions. I never took the boat offshore on snotty days but I expect it would have been very uncomfortable but safe. I believe it is silly to go out on any boat if the forecast is unfavorable.

The keys to joy with a 16 Dauntless are the right power, propeller, and engine mounting height.

Prices vary depending upon the boat, the season and the location. I believe that almost any popular used Boston Whaler carefully purchased will return the price paid even several years later.

Given the size of your family I believe a 16 is about the minimum size boat for you. A Montauk 17 might be a better choice but my knowledge of the Montauk line is limited to my Montauk 190.

posted 09-24-2014 10:47 AM ET (US)            

Maybe I'm overestimating the capabilities of the smaller boats (very possible) but I think I can get away with a 15' or even a 13' for my needs. I'm not planning on full days on the boat but hours. Not going to pack a bunch of food or drinks on board as 90% of the time we will be right in front of our house and they can just hop off the boat and go home if they get hungry.

Would it be bad form to post adds to boats I'm considering?

posted 09-24-2014 02:14 PM ET (US)            

No.

"I'd much rather have a boat that is perfect for the next three years than one that will be good for the next ten but will be more boat than I need in the short run."

Have you seen Sal's boat?

http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum2/HTML/022252.html

posted 09-24-2014 05:00 PM ET (US)            

Its very unlikely I can make this happen by the weekend but maybe some one else can.

posted 09-24-2014 08:40 PM ET (US)            

So with the 14 Dauntless out, here are the boats I'm looking at

1988 Mini Montauk with a 70hp Yamaha
http://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/4643481326.html

1986 Super Sport Limited 15 with a 70hp Yamaha
http://newhaven.craigslist.org/boa/4611989577.html

posted 09-24-2014 08:59 PM ET (US)            

quote:

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1988 Mini Montauk with a 70hp Yamaha
http://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/4643481326.html

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That is not a Mini Montauk, there was no such model. That is a 15' Center Console Sport and at that price is a down right steal if it all checks out. Most list around $7000 - $7500 in that condition.

posted 09-24-2014 09:46 PM ET (US)            

That picture you linked above got me to dig a little deeper to look for that model.

posted 09-24-2014 10:49 PM ET (US)            

quote:

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I just prefer the classic sports for cost and ascetic reasons.

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Really?

as·cet·ic adjective: characterized by or suggesting the practice of severe self-discipline and abstention from all forms of indulgence, typically for religious reasons.

posted 09-25-2014 09:50 AM ET (US)            

I need to check the detentions of the garage to see if one will fit. Depth is not an issue as the garage is at least 50' deep but height and width may be an issue.

posted 09-25-2014 10:10 AM ET (US)            

If railings are a serious consideration the center console 16 Dauntless has them galore. That boat is built like a tiny battleship. I also suspect the Dauntless will provide superior seating for your family.

Storing either the Montauk or Dauntless should not be a problem. Both boats are easily pushed around by hand on their trailers. By judicious adjustment of the trailer tongue jack the top of the windshield railing can be lowered enough to clear most garage doors. A method used is to raise the tongue to get he top of the engine under the door and lower the tongue to get the windshield and bow rail under the door.

posted 09-25-2014 11:13 AM ET (US)            

http://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/boa/4674557865.html

posted 09-25-2014 03:38 PM ET (US)            

From my search unpainted hulls are hard to come by though.

posted 09-26-2014 10:06 AM ET (US)            

I could store the boat outside but would prefer not to.
This tips the scales a little back towards the Sport.

What about 17' Sports? Are they more usable or is it all about being able to drive standing up?

posted 09-26-2014 10:41 AM ET (US)            

As an owner of a 1983 13' super sport with a 40hp Merc, I can highly recommend this as an introduction to Boston Whaler boating. I've owned my boat for just over 2 years now, and while a bigger whaler is sometimes enticing, in actuality the 13' has been perfect for me.

In the last 2 years I've enjoyed fishing, taking family members on rides (the most at 1 time were 4 adults and 2 children), trailing to multiple lakes, and the overall ease of operation. With multiple people on board it can be cramped, but like you mentioned, I don't bring a lot on board and stay out for a couple hours max at a time. While I haven't used the boat yet for tubing, skiing, or wakeboarding yet, I know that there would be enough room for skis/wakeboard; however, a tube might be pushing it (but would be the same on any small whaler).

Some things to note about the 13' that haven't been mentioned:
-More stable hull than the 15' when waves are coming from the side (especially good for fishing)
-When your kids get older, I would be more comfortable letting them go exploring on a 13' with a 40hp than a 15' with a 70hp (standard hp setup)
-Once your kids start taking the 13' by themselves, you can always upgrade to something larger for the whole family and still keep the 13'
-Typically a 13' is more economical than a 15' or 17'

You'll likely hear that a 13' is just too small of a boat, but under the right circumstances it can be great. Either way you choose, if you're choosing a whaler you've already made a smart choice!

posted 09-26-2014 11:02 AM ET (US)            

The original seating on all 15-footers is not very comfortable. Almost every 15-foot Boston Whaler you see has some owner-added seating modification. The original side console boats cannot really be easily steered from a standing position, if at all. The center console versions are less commonly seen.

posted 09-26-2014 02:38 PM ET (US)            

http://longisland.craigslist.org/boa/4570312560.html

http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/boa/4683100044.html

http://annapolis.craigslist.org/boa/4597761659.html

http://delaware.craigslist.org/boa/4636453285.html

posted 09-28-2014 11:02 AM ET (US)            

I like that boat. Don't bring that woman home.

posted 10-01-2014 10:12 PM ET (US)            

No, you can not drive from a standing position on a 15' Center Console Sport in the factory set-up.

If you raise the console an actual seat instead of the thwart seat then Yes, you can stand and pilot a 15. The late Tony Wilde (elaelap) created a true Mini-Montauk with his...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v665/warrent/Tony%20Wilde/ DSC_3666_zps3f1afcdd.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v665/warrent/Tony%20Wilde/ DSC_9954_zpsacc427bd.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v665/warrent/Tony%20Wilde/ DSC_4251_zps10f923f2.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v665/warrent/Tony%20Wilde/ DSC_3775_zps82942021.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v665/warrent/Tony%20Wilde/ DSC_3597_zpsa1ca5871.jpg

That said, if you really are thinking you are going to having 3-4 aboard I would really recommend to go the route of a 17. It will provide you with a better and dryer ride. It will also provide you with a lot more freeboard. The 13 and 15's gunwale is just barely above the waterline when loaded.

Since a Montauk will not fit in your garage I would recommend you focus your search on the 17 Newport. I used to own a Newport and really loved the boat. More so than my Montauk for my Family uses. Here is a post I wrote detailing my thoughts on the Montauk vs. Newport

quote:

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I have had both models and currently own the 1976 Newport shown on page 66 of the cetacea section of this site.
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/cetacea/cetaceaPage66.html

I bought the Newport from Jeff Holmes back in Dec of 2007 after selling my 22 Outrage. I was really looking for another Montauk however, I had seen this boat advertised and the price was thousands less than most Montauks I had been looking at. The other major plus was it was a 100% Freshwater use boat. I figured it nothing else, I would by it and flip it come spring if I decided I did not like the set up.

I was never a big fan of the Newports. However, after getting the boat home and messing with it in the garage I really took a liking to it. So, I ended up spending the winter restoring most of the boat. I spent the summer using the boat and I have to say, it really is the better of the two models for my uses right now. With just starting a family the Newport is more protected for smaller kids than a Monatuk. Also, the lower seating in the front is great for kids and is very easy to ride up there. Riding in front of a Montauk on that tall cooler never worked for me, let alone small kids. With just a little chop you are getting bounced right off.

The gunwales of the Newport provide a lot of storage for all kinds of things and more than what the Montauk console provided. The Newport's large console is actually nice to pilot from and working on wiring and other things under the console is FAR better and easier to work on and access than the Montauk console. Also at 5' 10" I am easily able to stand and pilot the Newport, something that I did not think I would be able to do when before purchasing the boat. However, I mainly sit on top of the RPS much like a leaning post to pilot.

You can see in this album even my 6'2" father can easliy pilot the Newport.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-hx04-O2zUzc/SN7b0mKugjI/AAAAAAAAAjI/ We9uWsFP2Y8/s800/DSC_5547.JPG
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-nTkgyT4DpMA/SN7dJMjW3tI/AAAAAAAAA48/ uTlVU2CSEPA/s800/DSC_5729.JPG

Also, because of the lower console railing I able to hold on and brace myself better than on a Montauk. One other great thing about the lower console is that it will allow my son to be able to begin learning seamanship skills much earlier than if I had a Montauk's tall console. The ride of the Montauk vs. the Newport is the same. Both very capable boats and I use mine on inlakes as well as the Large open waters of Lake Huron and Lake Michigan.

The Newport however, is not as die hard of a fishing boat as the Montauk. The Montauk does offer 360 degree fishing however, with both boats I found that with two or more people they are both crowed. Even when I had the Montauk around I found that I only was fishing on it 10% of the time at most.

So, really which one you look for is really based on where and how you plan to use the boat. Honestly if you have a family and plan to have them out a lot look for a Newport. You can usually find them on average for less than a Montauk in the sam condition. The really goods will bring comparable prices. If you just plan to use the boat for fishing look for a Montauk.

By the way.....I think the Newport is a much classier looking vessel than a Montauk too...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v427/jeff_rohlfing/ 1976%20Newport%206-2011/IMG_7211B.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v427/jeff_rohlfing/ 1976%20Newport%206-2011/IMG_7217.jpg

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Here is my Newport when I sold it. I put a lot of work into that boat to make it as perfect as I could. There are a lot of images here to get you familiar with the layout. I sold this boat back in 9-2012....but the person who bought it is going to list it for sale again. She never even put it in the water since she bought it. It is now down in Houston however.....

posted 10-02-2014 12:07 AM ET (US)            

http://rochester.craigslist.org/boa/4647737936.html

As an example of what the Market Value can be for a really good Newport. When I sold mine I sold it for $10,500 for the Boat, Motor, Trailer and all of the extra parts I had acquired for the boat. OEM Fuel Tanks, Two Extra Red Rubrails and Receiver tracks etc...etc.... You can also see in the ad all of the work I put into the boat.

posted 10-02-2014 09:28 AM ET (US)            

#1 Ride Comfort. The Center Console Sport allows you to pilot in more of an upright position vs. hunched over like you do with a Sport or Super Sport. That position of being hunched over a helm is fatiguing and can cause greater back pain in a rough sea.

#2 Space, the Center Console Sport layout allows for some nice storage in the console and also just in general is a slightly more open layout.

posted 10-03-2014 10:39 AM ET (US)            

Younger does not necessarily mean better. For myself, I will take an older motor with higher hours if it was well cared for and maintained over a younger motor that has not been treated well.

The Yamaha 70 is basically the exact same motor as the OMC 60. Yamaha basically directly knocked off the OMC (Johnson and Evinrude) 3 Cylinder Motor when they created their 3 cylinder 70hp and 90hp motor. Both the 1984 Johnson and the 2003 Yamaha use the exact same 2-Cycle carbureted technology.

posted 10-03-2014 10:58 AM ET (US)            

I would Compression test both of them, to see how tired the motors are. I would also check the lower units for milkly oil or high amounts of metal particulates.

If compression is good and the lowers seem good, I would sea trial the boat prior to making payment in full. When you sea trial you want to run the boat for 30-45 minutes at varying speeds. Run it at idle at no-wake speeds, at moderate planing speeds, cruising, fast cruising, and WOT. Hit all of these speeds ranges and go in and out of them a couple times. Running at these varying speeds will give the motor time to warm up and likely show any problems it might have with ignition timing, fuel delivery and other common problems.

Also run the tilt and trim through a couple cycles while under way. While at no-wake idling, run the motor all the way up as if you were coming into a beach landing and let the motor run at that severe angle and make sure it still runs at that angle and does not die out. Also while at cruise and WOT, run the trim up and make sure the trim is fully functioning. If the trim motor is weak or failing, it will not trim under heavy cruising loads.

Just some things to think about when inspecting the motors.

Also, here is a link to download the Whaler Inspection document I created use as a guide when looking at Whalers for myself, or for other people. It's just a good check list for things to ask and inspect to make sure you know what you are purchasing.

posted 10-12-2014 10:17 PM ET (US)            

The 15 center console has the same low slung seating that the sport, super sport, supersport limited layouts. I don't feel slouched over with my super sport steering. The low slung seating is the bigger issue. I can definitely see the big advantage a 17' Montauk has over the classic 15'.

The SS and SSL both have more storage in the seats.

I would argue that the center console has a more closed layout because of the size of the console restricts easy passage from the front to rear of the boat.

posted 10-15-2014 09:33 AM ET (US)            

Love the set up of this boat with the RPS and the rear bench seat. Swim platform is a nice bonus.

Is it lame that it gets knocked down a bit in my book for its lack of teak gunwales? Am I putting too much emphasis on form over function?

http://newyork.craigslist.org/wch/boa/4712692304.html

posted 10-17-2014 10:32 AM ET (US)            

I think this may be a good alternative to a 15 Montauk.