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Reference Article: Pony Bracket for 15-foot Hull
|Author||Topic: Reference Article: Pony Bracket for 15-foot Hull|
posted 09-29-2003 07:42 PM ET (US)
Please use this thread for comments or questions regarding the auxiliary engine bracket designed and build by John Anderson for the 15-foot hull, described in the Reference Article "Auxiliary Engine Bracket for 15-foot Boston Whaler Boats."
Again, this thread is for comments and questions regarding that specific article. If you have other questions, please post them in the appropriate forum.
Hyperlink to article:
posted 09-29-2003 08:05 PM ET (US)
Nice job John! Why don't you stop by and weld up our oyster tubs!!
posted 09-29-2003 10:22 PM ET (US)
Another great reference article, nice job John and Jim.
posted 09-29-2003 11:27 PM ET (US)
I purchased the original pony bracket for my then 15' Whaler
in Miami, Fla way back in 1987. It set me back $225.00. Johns bracket looks just as good. The only difference was that the original bracket consisted of two seperate pcs instead of one solid pc as shown in the photos.
posted 09-30-2003 07:38 AM ET (US)
Couple of points -
Very clean fabrication and installation.
What did you paint the bracket with? Did you have it powder coated or did you paint it yourself?
Why did you mount it on the port side? I thought to alleviate prop torque heavy stuff like the kicker should be mounted on the starboard. Did the original Boston Whaler bracket call for mounting on the port?
This one is for Jim. When I was reading the captions, it took me a minute to realize you where talking about the main engine in the second paragraph of the picture entitled Installed Bracket Stern View. I'm sometimes (ok many times)a little slow.
posted 09-30-2003 07:55 AM ET (US)
The original factory bracket was mounted on the port side.
posted 09-30-2003 08:02 AM ET (US)
I think I know why the engine was on the port side. Most of the driver seatings on the 15' were on the starboard side and this would compensate for the wt of the kicker with the exception of the center console model which I think was the least produced of all 15' models.
|Tom W Clark||
posted 09-30-2003 10:58 AM ET (US)
Very nicely done. There's just something about quality fabrications that show as beauty.
I am also wondering what you painted the aluminum with.
I am sure others are wondering this so let me ask, what do you think it would cost to replicate this design now that you know how to do it?
Ferdinando is correct about the positioning of the kicker to port. It helps compensate for the weight of the driver which in a boat of this size is far more significant than the propeller torque.
posted 09-30-2003 11:36 AM ET (US)
I just wanted to say how great the Quality on the bracket looked. Very nice build and instalation. Thanks for shareing with the rest of us.
posted 09-30-2003 03:12 PM ET (US)
Does the kicker affect the performance of with main motor in use?
posted 09-30-2003 06:14 PM ET (US)
posted 09-30-2003 10:14 PM ET (US)
posted 10-01-2003 10:36 AM ET (US)
I haven't made a kicker bracket like that, but I did make some "L" shaped downrigger brackets out of aluminum plate that I had welded up.
I doubt that there is more that $30 of raw materials in the bracket, and my local prop shop charges $35 per hour for miscelaneous welding. The bracket would easily come in under their 1-hour minimum.
The nice thing about aluminum plate is that it can be cut using a carbide toothed woodworking blade on a radial arm or power miter saw. I have a blade that I keep solely for cutting aluminum, PVC etc. Wearing good face/eye protection is a must because of the aluminum chips, but the saw cuts the aluminum just fine.
So if you can cut the parts yourself, I would guess that you are looking at under $100, including mounting hardware and paint and the wood.
posted 10-01-2003 04:52 PM ET (US)
I agree with all the comments about the quality look of the welded aluminum, this is certainly a superior peice of work. But looking at the Whaler drawing, it seem as if the two pieces of aluminum in Whaler's bracket could be easily cut from some correctly dimensioned (4") aluminum channel, cut at an angle.
posted 10-01-2003 05:01 PM ET (US)
Oops, I see now in the article where you were not able to find any aluminum channel in that size. I'd look at Puget Sound Salvage, but on the web I found 4 X 1.58 X .180 6061-T6 Aluminum Structural Channel at http://www.metalsdepot.com/products/alum2.phtml?page=channel . $18.86 for a two foot piece, plus the usual sky high shipping costs.
posted 10-03-2003 01:40 AM ET (US)
Thanks to all for the ego-boosting feedback!
I have been on the road for a week and just got back to my computer - sorry for the delay in responding to your questions.
Mike, I can't help with your oyster tubs but I'll be in your neighborhood in a few weeks. Let's talk clams.
As Plotman pointed out, I was easily able cut the aluminum parts on my tablesaw with a carbide woodworking blade. I don't even remember where I salvaged the aluminum plate - it's been tucked away in my garage for years. I provided my neighbor, who is in the business of architectural metal castings, with a plywood mock-up so there wouldn't be any question about how the oddly shaped pieces should be welded together. He delivered the bracket the followng day and refused my attempts to pay him for his work. The bracket was painted with spraycans of Tempo outboard paint. First the yellow primer and then several color coats. The paint is holding up ok except where the screw clamps make contact. I really should have had it powder coated and may do so in the future. Total cost for the project was about $20 for the paint and SST fasteners. But I think Plotman's estimate of $100 is about right if you had to pay for the welding and aluminum.
My primary reason for mounting the bracket on the port side was to keep the tiller arm on the kicker from hitting the main motor. In most cases the boat can be steered using the main motor as a rudder, but for tight maneuvering the kicker needs to be steered independently. I have collected some parts to link the steering to the main motor but haven't worked out the details yet. At rest, the boat does list to port when the 12 gal fuel tank (also on the port side) is full. However with a driver behind the wheel it levels out nicely. Those of you with 15's know that lateral trim is easily fine-tuned by sliding one's posterior a few inches to the left or to the right.
The short shaft motor tilts just clear of the water at planing speeds and is effectively immersed at trolling speeds. Can't imagine why a long shaft would work any better.
I have trailered the boat with the 67 pound kicker mounted on the bracket for about 5,000 miles so far with no problem. But after reading recent comments on this topic I'll probably remove the motor for future travel.
Thanks again for the compliments
posted 10-06-2003 10:16 PM ET (US)
If anyone decides to make a few of these, I'd be interested in buying one.
Nice work John.
posted 12-23-2003 02:06 PM ET (US)
Thank you for all the useful information and comments. I want to install an auxillary motor on my 15 foot CC 1987 BW. I would like to use it as a trolling motor and a backup in case I have problems with the main motor. Ideally I would like to mount a 15 HP short shaft as the 2nd motor. I am looking for comments regarding the practicallity of that arrangement (i.e. weight/balance, cavatation of 2nd motor, problems with steering/control, etc.) I just purhased my first BW and I really appreciate the comradery and helpful spirit of this group. Best regards, Kaye
posted 12-23-2003 08:47 PM ET (US)
BTW the main engine is a 1989 70 HP Johnson with power trim. Its dry weight is 260 lbs.
posted 12-28-2003 09:16 PM ET (US)
kaye - a few thoughts . . .
Your 70hp by itself is already about the max weight you would want on the transom of a 15 footer. I'm guessing your 15hp is about 80 lbs, so the total of the two motors is 340# and when you move aft to pull-start or otherwise fuss with the kicker, there will be precious little freeboard left.
The short shaft motor will not cavitate at sub-planing speeds and 15hp will not put it on a plane. In fact I would be surprised if 15hp will produce any more boat speed than an 8hp.
I was running a 65 lb (6 hp)kicker with a 190 lb (50 hp)main motor - 255 lbs total. It worked ok but I though it was important to minimize transom weight and have now switched to a 35 lb (4hp) kicker. For me this seems to be the best weight/power compromise for this hull.
posted 01-02-2004 01:11 PM ET (US)
John: Thank you for the info. How does the smaller motor perform? Do you feel you could get back to port OK under " normal" conditions (i.e. how fast does the boat go?). Can you steer the boat using the main motor with the auxillary motor fixed straight ahead?
posted 04-16-2004 04:24 PM ET (US)
Jimh,great design, I have a other design but when I saw your alum. bracket send my drawings to the trash. If you make one for me write me, without compromise: email@example.com thanks for help this forum.
posted 04-16-2004 07:08 PM ET (US)
Taking a second look at this design, I think it may also be useful for someone wanting to install trim tabs on a 18-20-22 hull but also run a pony (kicker) motor on the transom. Great workmanship, it looks rock solid!
posted 03-09-2005 04:59 PM ET (US)
Thank you for putting up such detailed plans and instructions for the auxiliary engine bracket. I was able to print out the page and take it to a local welder, who fashioned one for me in about an hour. It was like going to Lenscrafters, without the muzak.
After another hour of grinding it for friendly edges, I painted it and have one of my very own, for about 50 bucks. Now to find a block of teak that won't break the bank.
posted 04-21-2005 12:24 PM ET (US)
I have photos of a this bracket concept adapted to the 130 Sport if anyone is interested. Jimh, I'd be happy to write up the story and include appropriate pictures and drawings if you'd like. Thanks for the excellent reference, it was obviously invaluable to me in this project.
posted 08-11-2006 05:40 AM ET (US)
I've recently built & installed a kicker bracket per John's engineering. Two problems I encountered were:
1. The bracket installs on the transom directly over the HID plate. Had to drill out the rivets, fill the holes with Marine Tex and relocate the HID plate to the starboard side of the transom.
2. With the bracket built to John's specs, my kicker motor didn't have clearance to tilt it up. Perhaps it's a problem unique to the profile of my motor (15 hp Gamefisher). I solved the problem by making the motor mounting plate and wood spacer 9" tall vice 8". The extra inch of elevation gives me the necessary height above the transom and still plenty of motor in the water.
Overall it's a fine piece of engineering and I'm thrilled to finally have a kicker motor after 6 years without.
posted 10-16-2006 12:12 PM ET (US)
Here's the version I built from this design:
I extended the mounting plate up by two inches to get the motor up a bit higher. Love it! -- Bud
posted 10-28-2006 09:38 AM ET (US)
Just received from the shop the pony support for my 15.
Very good design, thanks to John Anderson.
posted 11-01-2006 04:08 AM ET (US)
Thanks to John for a great design and thanks to Bud for his response on another post about this bracket. I had to have mine made out of 3/8" plate due to increased weight of a four stroke 18hp tohatsu and increased height of motor mounting. It cost a bit more to have made here in Hawaii but was well worth it. I am very pleased with the end result and it looks great.
Mine was mounted on a 22' guardian on the port side. The weight of two optima batteries on the stbd side and the kicker on that side made for too much of a stbd list, this configuration is much better and the boat seems to handle very nice with the equal weight ditribution.
posted 11-01-2006 10:31 AM ET (US)
Tom, or anyone. Would this bracket work on my 16' hull? I would reverse the design and mount it on the starboard side for my short shaft Suzuki 6.
posted 01-04-2012 11:16 AM ET (US)
This pony bracket is a work of art.
Does anyone know of one for sale?
posted 05-01-2012 11:11 PM ET (US)
I just had this bracket made at a local welding shop.
Thanks for the design plan !
I'm now looking for some advice on how to go about drilling throught my 15'3 transom.
posted 05-10-2012 08:56 PM ET (US)
I bought some 1/4" plate boat aluminum, 5200 I think, and the cost was $50.00. I saw that I had a data plate on the left side of the transom, and modified the forward mounting plate (shortened the overall length by removing about 1.5" from the top). That required other modifications but everything worked out well. I made one out of cardboard, cut out the plate on the band saw and smoothed the edges on the disc sander and a file then gave it to the welder to fabricate. It took the welder about an hour. I measured twice and cut/drilled once and total time in the job was probably high at 3 hrs. of my time not counting a trip to Fasteners Inc. for stainless bolts and screws. If you could have one fabricated for you and you paid $250.00 I think it would be a bargain!
posted 11-22-2012 02:09 PM ET (US)
[Revived this dicussion to post notice of for-sale; please use MARKETPLACE for posting notices of for-sale items. Thanks.--jimh]
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