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floater88 posted 06-19-2013 05:49 PM ET (US)
I finaly used my chirstmas present today to try and polish up my 88 Revenge 20 WT. I used the West Systems Fiberglass polish and wax with the foam pad that came with the Porter. Since my hull is in good shape I didn't really notice any diference. I bought a can of the West Marine Paste Wax and applied that by hand and then used the Porter with a new foam pad to buff it around then removed with a clean cloth. I'm not too thrilled with the result. It doesn't look as shiny as I'd hoped. Should I be using a differint style of 'pad' on the porter other than foam? I read that the wool ones were more for 'cutting' than polishing. Thanks
Jeff posted 06-19-2013 08:50 PM ET (US)
Well, first off what are you trying to do? Are you trying to bring back the shine to the gelcoat because it is dull, or is it shiny now and you are just trying to wax the boat?
If you have a dull hull, the porter cable unit is not the tool for the job and putting wax on will to bring a shine back. Polishing (not buffing with a DA) with a compound is what bring a shine back. To polish gelcoat to a shine you need to use a high speed direct drive unit with a 7" or 9" Wool cutting pad with a good compound. 3m is the best. You first want to use 3m Super Duty then move to 3m Finesse It.
Something like this Milwaukee 5540 unit. Nothing works as fast as that.
http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/tools/Sanders-Routers/Polishers/ 7-in-polisher-5540?utm_source=google_pr&utm_medium=cpc& utm_campaign=Polishers-google_pr&infoParam.campaignId=T9F& gclid=CKSX3piVsrUCFag7MgodRFsA0A
Dewalt makes a great one too.
http://www.autogeek.net/dewalt-dwp849x-polisher.html
3m Finesse it
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=11151&productId=21762&langId=-1#. URrxymdp6h4
3m Super Duty
http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/Marine/Home/Products/ Catalog/ ?PC_7_RJH9U5230GE3E02LECIE20S4K7000000_nid=GSFKDG7HK3be9NQK7NZ8TZgl
You can get the same results with a Porter Cable DA unit but you need the right pads it is will take 3 to 4 times as many passes to get the same results as a direct drive unit.
Once you have a good shine back you can move to the Porter Cable DA. This is what I have for general maintenance of the shine. I use one pad to put the wax / polish on, and another at high speed to take it off. The pad that comes with the unit is pure garbage. You should invest in a good set of varying pads. When I bought my unit I bought it from these guys. It came with a hook and loop backing plate and multiple pads for varying types of buffing and waxing.
Porter Cable DA Kit with Pads
http://www.autogeek.net/pc7424-low-profile-pad-kit.html
Because you already have a unit I would purchase:
Hook and Loop Backing Plate:
http://www.autogeek.net/dual-action-backing-plates.html
And a variety of Pads:
http://www.autogeek.net/ccs-5-5inch-foam-buffing-pads.html

Jeff posted 06-19-2013 09:13 PM ET (US)
Also, do not waste your money on a West Marine wax. Get some good stuff.
For wax I personally like Meguiars and Mothers.
Meguiars Flag Ship Wax
http://www.meguiars.com/en/marine/products/ m6332-flagship-premium-marine-wax-32oz/
Meguiars Gold Class
http://www.meguiars.com/en/automotive/products/ g7016-gold-classtrade-carnauba-plus-liquid-wax/
Mothers Calfornia Gold (available at autopads stores)
http://www.motherscaliforniagold.com/index.html
Others like Fleet Wax
http://www.autopia-carcare.com/collinite-liquid-fleetwax. html?productid=collinite-liquid-fleetwax&channelid=FROOG& utm_source=CSEs&utm_medium=GoogleProductSearch&utm_campaign=CSE& gclid=CIzWkLq58bcCFe1AMgod_msANA
All are good choices.
Once you have two good coats of wax on finish with a polish. Wax protects, polish shines. I use Starbrite with PTFE. It is well worth the money.
http:/ / www. massmarine. com/ massmarine_en/ star-brite-prem-marine-pol ish-w-teflon-74-85732?gclid=CKCAhqS68bcCFTQOOgodziUAcQ
Every spring give the hull a light compounding with the Finesse It, wax and polish.....
floater88 posted 06-19-2013 10:38 PM ET (US)
Thanks Jeff. The gel coat is in good shape so all i'm trying to do is clean off a light scum line and bring back a shine. I will go ahead on order some more stuff and keep on rubbing away. Thanks
kwik_wurk posted 06-19-2013 10:42 PM ET (US)
Yes, Meguiars is what I recommend too, and don't use the cleaner/wax combo. -- As for the finish, I really only use 3M finesse it, then wash boat again with scrub brush, then wax. -- I like to remove all rubbing compounds before a waxing.
I have found, the pad, and speed make the biggest difference. I have several applicator pads, then a cleaning pad. -- And a dremmel with a pad for tight corners is also amazing.
L H G posted 06-19-2013 11:13 PM ET (US)
If the hull is not in bad shape, the 3M Super Duty compound is probably too much for the job. That stuff really cuts and is quite harsh. Never use more cutting of the gelcoat than you need.
I recommend, and exclusively use, 3M IMPERIAL Compound and Finishing Material, in the black and purple qt bottle. You must use a wool pad with this stuff, but it really produces excellent results. Most people think my boats have a factory new shine. You can follow up with the Finessit, but it may not be necessary. Finessit, used correctly (and most don't) really gives a super high gloss when preceeded by the Imperial.
For wax, the only Meguires product recommended by Boston Whaler is their #26 Yellow Wax. Boat stores don't carry it. But I have seen it at PepBoys.
I think Collinite's #925 Pure Boat Wax is the best on the market.
Marko888 posted 06-20-2013 01:31 AM ET (US)
What is the issue with a boat cleaner/wax product? I bought some of the 3M version, as my boat is only lightly oxidized, and it need not shine like a new Porsche. A 1985 Whaler shine would be good enough.
Should I exchange it for two separate products anyways?
Thank you
Jeff posted 06-20-2013 02:14 PM ET (US)
3M Super Duty is what you want to use if you have a really chalky hull. Using the 3M Super Duty is FAR less damaging than wet sanding gelcoat. I have come to realize that wet sanding does far more harm than good by removing too much gel coat thickness. Some times it removes so much that is begins to expose areas of tiny pin hole bubbles below the surface. When you wax over these areas after wet sanding those exposed bubbles file with dirty wax and turn black over time. Once in there, you can not clean the wax out.
http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/019057.html
If you have a pretty good shine, start with the Imperial or Finesse It. Both provide similar results.
Marko, cleaner waxes are just that....cleaners. They are meant to remove environmental contaminants from the paint / gelcoat surface. It will not polish the surface and remove oxidization to increase the shine. A compound will do that. A good carnauba wax protects the surface once the compound has polished the gelcoat. Finally a polishing wax like the Star Brite PTFE provides a coating over the protective wax that will help it keep a shine longer.
Floater, Be sure and let the machine do the work for you. Put the compound or wax on the pad and really work the surface. I do mine in 2' sections of the hull sides. I work the area over and over until the compound / wax looks like it is no longer on the surface then move to the next area. By the time you are done there should just be a light haze left. Put a clean pad on to remove the haze and finish is a micro fiber cloth wipe down.
Jeff posted 06-20-2013 02:24 PM ET (US)
Here are some images of my hulls where I follow the procedure I outlined above with the Direct Drive and Porter Cable DA units.
1975 13 Sport When I picked it up
https://plus.google.com/photos/103421531781813483446/albums/ 5271948526378808753?banner=pwa
1975 13 Sport complete compound, wax and polish
https://plus.google.com/photos/103421531781813483446/albums/ 5332502229471632577?banner=pwa
13 Sport Finsihed
https://plus.google.com/photos/103421531781813483446/albums/ 5379155688520656673?banner=pwa
My 17 Newport after a complete detailing:
http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jeff_rohlfing/library/ 1976%20Newport%2052812?sort=2&start=all/&page=1
My Grady White from after it's first compound, wax and polish
http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jeff_rohlfing/library/ 190%201988%20Grady%20White%20details%2013?sort=2&start=all/&page=1
If you lived closer Floater, I would say bring your boat over for a detail how-to day...
jimh posted 06-20-2013 03:14 PM ET (US)
Jeff--You know that you and I live pretty close...
Jeff posted 06-20-2013 03:28 PM ET (US)
Jim, yes I do know that. Let's set up a winter storage workshop : ).
floater88 posted 06-20-2013 05:46 PM ET (US)
Thanks for all the info guys. I guess i've been doing it wrong. Took it out for a fishing trip today and the water beaded up nicely along the sides but a scum line formed near the water line again and it won't rub off by hand or cloth. I guess it's a little porous around the water line even with two coats of wax on it.
Jeff posted 06-20-2013 10:05 PM ET (US)
It could be a couple things that cause the scum line to stick around...the quality of the wax, or just the contents of the "scum" itself. If it's from a sooty oily slick on the surface, that's always tougher remove. The Star Brite PTFE (Teflon) polish was great of reducing the occurrence of tough to remove scum line for me.
David Pendleton posted 06-20-2013 11:08 PM ET (US)
I have found that the best way to keep Mississippi river scum off my boat is to quit buying them beer.
Thanks Jeff for some interesting links and perspective.
jimh posted 06-20-2013 11:33 PM ET (US)
I always count on Dave for a funny riposte.
David Pendleton posted 06-21-2013 12:27 AM ET (US)
I do what I can, Jim.
Jeff posted 06-21-2013 08:52 AM ET (US)
That was pretty damn good Dave!
K Albus posted 06-21-2013 02:54 PM ET (US)
Jeff - What about Collinite Fiberglass Boat Cleaner #920 - do you know if it has a more aggressive or less aggressive compounding action than Finesse-It II?
Collinite Fiberglass Boat Cleaner: http://www.collinite.com/marine-wax/fiberglass-boat-cleaner
3M Finesse-It II: http:/ / solutions. 3m. com/ wps/ portal/ 3M/ en_US/ Marine/ Home/ Produ cts/ Catalog/ ?PC_7_RJH9U5230GE3E02LECIE20S4K7000000_nid=GS4L7VPCLPgs9NQ K7NZ8TZglT3RWDR9GD5bl
Jeff posted 06-21-2013 04:09 PM ET (US)
I honestly do not know Kevin. I have never used it. While it is called a cleaner it sounds like it has compound like properties. So I would assume it is similar to the Finesse It but I am not sure if one cuts more than the other...
floater88 posted 06-21-2013 04:13 PM ET (US)
Wow lots of info here. So to simplify it for me since my hull is generaly in good shape I will first wash the boat and rinse it then use the Finesse and after that I can put on wax then polish? or wash, rinse, finesse, polish then wax or just skip the polish and go with the finesse???
David Pendleton posted 06-21-2013 09:03 PM ET (US)
I've used the #920 for several years now. I think it is primarily designed to remove dirt and previously applied waxes. I don't think it has any real compounding properties.
It works well enough but like any other Collinite product, you have to work like a dog to apply or remove it.
jimh posted 06-22-2013 12:44 AM ET (US)
Some of the methods and products mentioned seem to me to be very old school and require a lot of elbow grease or electrically-operated gizmos to produce results. I would like to think there is some modern, chemically-based fluid you could wipe on and wipe off that would produce a nice shine without investing $400 in buffers, wool pads, really expensive compounds, polishes, and waxes. This is 2013. Some of these methods sound like something from the May 1957 Car Care Journal.
Jeff posted 06-22-2013 08:34 AM ET (US)
Jim, That fluid is called "Tire Wet". It's a liquid Silicon and makes the hull shine like it's brand new. The shine last for about 12-24 hours before it dries out and you are back to what you started with.
Everything in life seems to go back to the Good, Fast, Cheap, pryamid... You can only have two.
floater88 posted 06-23-2013 01:43 PM ET (US)
So back to one of my questons about the proper order to do things. Wash, rinse, then polish then wax? Or wax them polish?? Hull is in good shape and has a shine to it anyways. Just want to protect and keep the scum line off. Thanks
Binkster posted 06-23-2013 03:31 PM ET (US)
A good way to tell if you are finished polishing is to hold your hand about 6" from the hull. You should be able to see the reflection of your hand in the gelcoat. I think you guys are spending way to much money on tools and supplys and way too much energy and not getting the right results.
Last winter I knew I was going to have to paint (AwlGrip) the interior of my 15 footer.
The exterior of the hull was very dull, its a '86 boat without alot of previous care, but surprisingly enough the gelcoat had very few marks or chips in it. I decided to polish it, but I knew that the painted interior would have a very high shine, more so than any gelcoat. So I tried to do the best job possible. I flipped the hull, and first washed of as much of the dirt and grime off as possible. Then online I picked up some Abralon wet sanding pads. One of each. 600-1000-1500-2000-3000 grit. These sanding pads were originally made for fine furniture finishing, but have found their way into other industries. Now, if I had a compresser big enough to run an air powered DA sander it would have been really simple but I don't, so I had to hand sand. An electric DA can't/shouldn't be used for wet sanding for obvious reasons. So I started with the 600 grit and worked my way up to the 3000 grit. You can tell when your done with each grit as there will be no drag on the pad. Took about 7 hours total. Next day I applied two coats of Meguiar's Gold Class carnuba wax with a Harbor Freight 10" orbital polisher (under $20). I don't like those 90degree viarable speed polishers at all, I have one. I did a thread on this process back last winter with some pics. OK, the gel coat doesn't quite shine as well as the Awlgrip but you can still see your reflection.
rich
K Albus posted 06-23-2013 09:30 PM ET (US)
Floater, the steps are:
1. Rinse, wash, rinse.
2. If hull is is chalky or lacks shine, compound. If the hull is in bad condition, start with a more aggressive compound (like Meguiar's Oxidation Remover or Meguiar's Color Restorer), then move to a less aggressive compound (like 3M Finesse-It II). If the hull is not to bad to start with, but seems a little dull, you can skip the more aggressive compound and start with 3M Finesse-It II.
3. Once the hull is nice and shiny, you can apply either pure wax (don't use a cleaner wax) or a polymer polish. Some guys, like Jeff, put wax on followed by a polymer polish. Most guys only use one or other. I personally prefer wax over the polymer polish products. I think wax has a deeper shine, but it doesn't last as long as the polymer polish products. After waxing or applying polymer polish, buff to a high shine.
4. Wait one year, then repeat, unless you're in Florida, then wait six months and repeat.
One thing that I always found confusing was the use of the word "polish" in the polymer products. I always though "polish" meant a product with some type of grit to it, i.e., the products which are typically referred to as compounding agents. The polymer polish products don't usually have any compounding agents. They are generally intended to be used as a wax replacement.
floater88 posted 06-24-2013 08:54 AM ET (US)
Thanks K Albus that is the order I was looking for. My hull is in very good shape except for the transom so i'm gonna follow your recommendations.
PeteB88 posted 06-24-2013 02:22 PM ET (US)
But how do I use the machine w/o wrecking my boat?? Tips?
Winter Storage and Workshop - Man, I'd jump all over that for sure. too bad you guys are on opposite side of state - place I'm in is awesome for that - And then there's the the explosion last March at North Shore Marina, Grand Haven recently ruled accidental - dude was working on his boat, fired up a torch, KA-Boom. Lucky he wasn't killed.
http://www.mlive.com/news/muskegon/index.ssf/2013/05/grand_havens_north_shore_marin.html
EJO posted 06-24-2013 04:26 PM ET (US)
Floater I always had GREAT results with products from http://www.auroramarine.com/fiberglass.php these products have always out performed the well known names like 3m, mcguires, etc.
Jeff posted 06-24-2013 05:45 PM ET (US)
Well here you go Jim, the magic coating you were looking for. While I am not sure if it could increase the shine, It will undoubtedly make sure your hull NEVER falls victim to a scum line....
I give you Rust-Oleum's, NeverWet:
http://bit.ly/145xMFJ
Binkster posted 06-25-2013 02:18 PM ET (US)
Wow, Jeff, If I coat the bottom of my boat with that stuff, I'll probably pick up 5 mph, no doubt.
rich
DVollrath posted 06-25-2013 02:43 PM ET (US)
Rich,
Be very careful not to get it on your prop though, as it will repel all water from the blades & you'll cavitate something fierce :)
Dennis
PeteB88 posted 06-25-2013 02:56 PM ET (US)
I'm getting some to spray down Ellen's std poodles, now we can go to the beach and come back without cars being soaking wet.
jimh posted 06-26-2013 07:21 AM ET (US)
Jeff--The "never-gets-wet" spray might be useful for the foam surrounding a fuel tank in a classic Boston Whaler.
As for making boat hulls easier to move through the water, just use whatever the America's Cup sailors are using on their hulls.

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Author	Topic: Porter Cable 7424xp use
floater88	posted 06-19-2013 05:49 PM ET (US) I finaly used my chirstmas present today to try and polish up my 88 Revenge 20 WT. I used the West Systems Fiberglass polish and wax with the foam pad that came with the Porter. Since my hull is in good shape I didn't really notice any diference. I bought a can of the West Marine Paste Wax and applied that by hand and then used the Porter with a new foam pad to buff it around then removed with a clean cloth. I'm not too thrilled with the result. It doesn't look as shiny as I'd hoped. Should I be using a differint style of 'pad' on the porter other than foam? I read that the wool ones were more for 'cutting' than polishing. Thanks
Jeff	posted 06-19-2013 08:50 PM ET (US) Well, first off what are you trying to do? Are you trying to bring back the shine to the gelcoat because it is dull, or is it shiny now and you are just trying to wax the boat? If you have a dull hull, the porter cable unit is not the tool for the job and putting wax on will to bring a shine back. Polishing (not buffing with a DA) with a compound is what bring a shine back. To polish gelcoat to a shine you need to use a high speed direct drive unit with a 7" or 9" Wool cutting pad with a good compound. 3m is the best. You first want to use 3m Super Duty then move to 3m Finesse It. Something like this Milwaukee 5540 unit. Nothing works as fast as that. http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/tools/Sanders-Routers/Polishers/ 7-in-polisher-5540?utm_source=google_pr&utm_medium=cpc& utm_campaign=Polishers-google_pr&infoParam.campaignId=T9F& gclid=CKSX3piVsrUCFag7MgodRFsA0A Dewalt makes a great one too. http://www.autogeek.net/dewalt-dwp849x-polisher.html 3m Finesse it http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=11151&productId=21762&langId=-1#. URrxymdp6h4 3m Super Duty http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/Marine/Home/Products/ Catalog/ ?PC_7_RJH9U5230GE3E02LECIE20S4K7000000_nid=GSFKDG7HK3be9NQK7NZ8TZgl You can get the same results with a Porter Cable DA unit but you need the right pads it is will take 3 to 4 times as many passes to get the same results as a direct drive unit. Once you have a good shine back you can move to the Porter Cable DA. This is what I have for general maintenance of the shine. I use one pad to put the wax / polish on, and another at high speed to take it off. The pad that comes with the unit is pure garbage. You should invest in a good set of varying pads. When I bought my unit I bought it from these guys. It came with a hook and loop backing plate and multiple pads for varying types of buffing and waxing. Porter Cable DA Kit with Pads http://www.autogeek.net/pc7424-low-profile-pad-kit.html Because you already have a unit I would purchase: Hook and Loop Backing Plate: http://www.autogeek.net/dual-action-backing-plates.html And a variety of Pads: http://www.autogeek.net/ccs-5-5inch-foam-buffing-pads.html
Jeff	posted 06-19-2013 09:13 PM ET (US) Also, do not waste your money on a West Marine wax. Get some good stuff. For wax I personally like Meguiars and Mothers. Meguiars Flag Ship Wax http://www.meguiars.com/en/marine/products/ m6332-flagship-premium-marine-wax-32oz/ Meguiars Gold Class http://www.meguiars.com/en/automotive/products/ g7016-gold-classtrade-carnauba-plus-liquid-wax/ Mothers Calfornia Gold (available at autopads stores) http://www.motherscaliforniagold.com/index.html Others like Fleet Wax http://www.autopia-carcare.com/collinite-liquid-fleetwax. html?productid=collinite-liquid-fleetwax&channelid=FROOG& utm_source=CSEs&utm_medium=GoogleProductSearch&utm_campaign=CSE& gclid=CIzWkLq58bcCFe1AMgod_msANA All are good choices. Once you have two good coats of wax on finish with a polish. Wax protects, polish shines. I use Starbrite with PTFE. It is well worth the money. http:/ / www. massmarine. com/ massmarine_en/ star-brite-prem-marine-pol ish-w-teflon-74-85732?gclid=CKCAhqS68bcCFTQOOgodziUAcQ Every spring give the hull a light compounding with the Finesse It, wax and polish.....
floater88	posted 06-19-2013 10:38 PM ET (US) Thanks Jeff. The gel coat is in good shape so all i'm trying to do is clean off a light scum line and bring back a shine. I will go ahead on order some more stuff and keep on rubbing away. Thanks
kwik_wurk	posted 06-19-2013 10:42 PM ET (US) Yes, Meguiars is what I recommend too, and don't use the cleaner/wax combo. -- As for the finish, I really only use 3M finesse it, then wash boat again with scrub brush, then wax. -- I like to remove all rubbing compounds before a waxing. I have found, the pad, and speed make the biggest difference. I have several applicator pads, then a cleaning pad. -- And a dremmel with a pad for tight corners is also amazing.
L H G	posted 06-19-2013 11:13 PM ET (US) If the hull is not in bad shape, the 3M Super Duty compound is probably too much for the job. That stuff really cuts and is quite harsh. Never use more cutting of the gelcoat than you need. I recommend, and exclusively use, 3M IMPERIAL Compound and Finishing Material, in the black and purple qt bottle. You must use a wool pad with this stuff, but it really produces excellent results. Most people think my boats have a factory new shine. You can follow up with the Finessit, but it may not be necessary. Finessit, used correctly (and most don't) really gives a super high gloss when preceeded by the Imperial. For wax, the only Meguires product recommended by Boston Whaler is their #26 Yellow Wax. Boat stores don't carry it. But I have seen it at PepBoys. I think Collinite's #925 Pure Boat Wax is the best on the market.
Marko888	posted 06-20-2013 01:31 AM ET (US) What is the issue with a boat cleaner/wax product? I bought some of the 3M version, as my boat is only lightly oxidized, and it need not shine like a new Porsche. A 1985 Whaler shine would be good enough. Should I exchange it for two separate products anyways? Thank you
Jeff	posted 06-20-2013 02:14 PM ET (US) 3M Super Duty is what you want to use if you have a really chalky hull. Using the 3M Super Duty is FAR less damaging than wet sanding gelcoat. I have come to realize that wet sanding does far more harm than good by removing too much gel coat thickness. Some times it removes so much that is begins to expose areas of tiny pin hole bubbles below the surface. When you wax over these areas after wet sanding those exposed bubbles file with dirty wax and turn black over time. Once in there, you can not clean the wax out. http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/019057.html If you have a pretty good shine, start with the Imperial or Finesse It. Both provide similar results. Marko, cleaner waxes are just that....cleaners. They are meant to remove environmental contaminants from the paint / gelcoat surface. It will not polish the surface and remove oxidization to increase the shine. A compound will do that. A good carnauba wax protects the surface once the compound has polished the gelcoat. Finally a polishing wax like the Star Brite PTFE provides a coating over the protective wax that will help it keep a shine longer. Floater, Be sure and let the machine do the work for you. Put the compound or wax on the pad and really work the surface. I do mine in 2' sections of the hull sides. I work the area over and over until the compound / wax looks like it is no longer on the surface then move to the next area. By the time you are done there should just be a light haze left. Put a clean pad on to remove the haze and finish is a micro fiber cloth wipe down.
Jeff	posted 06-20-2013 02:24 PM ET (US) Here are some images of my hulls where I follow the procedure I outlined above with the Direct Drive and Porter Cable DA units. 1975 13 Sport When I picked it up https://plus.google.com/photos/103421531781813483446/albums/ 5271948526378808753?banner=pwa 1975 13 Sport complete compound, wax and polish https://plus.google.com/photos/103421531781813483446/albums/ 5332502229471632577?banner=pwa 13 Sport Finsihed https://plus.google.com/photos/103421531781813483446/albums/ 5379155688520656673?banner=pwa My 17 Newport after a complete detailing: http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jeff_rohlfing/library/ 1976%20Newport%2052812?sort=2&start=all/&page=1 My Grady White from after it's first compound, wax and polish http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jeff_rohlfing/library/ 190%201988%20Grady%20White%20details%2013?sort=2&start=all/&page=1 If you lived closer Floater, I would say bring your boat over for a detail how-to day...
jimh	posted 06-20-2013 03:14 PM ET (US) Jeff--You know that you and I live pretty close...
Jeff	posted 06-20-2013 03:28 PM ET (US) Jim, yes I do know that. Let's set up a winter storage workshop : ).
floater88	posted 06-20-2013 05:46 PM ET (US) Thanks for all the info guys. I guess i've been doing it wrong. Took it out for a fishing trip today and the water beaded up nicely along the sides but a scum line formed near the water line again and it won't rub off by hand or cloth. I guess it's a little porous around the water line even with two coats of wax on it.
Jeff	posted 06-20-2013 10:05 PM ET (US) It could be a couple things that cause the scum line to stick around...the quality of the wax, or just the contents of the "scum" itself. If it's from a sooty oily slick on the surface, that's always tougher remove. The Star Brite PTFE (Teflon) polish was great of reducing the occurrence of tough to remove scum line for me.
David Pendleton	posted 06-20-2013 11:08 PM ET (US) I have found that the best way to keep Mississippi river scum off my boat is to quit buying them beer. Thanks Jeff for some interesting links and perspective.
jimh	posted 06-20-2013 11:33 PM ET (US) I always count on Dave for a funny riposte.
David Pendleton	posted 06-21-2013 12:27 AM ET (US) I do what I can, Jim.
Jeff	posted 06-21-2013 08:52 AM ET (US) That was pretty damn good Dave!
K Albus	posted 06-21-2013 02:54 PM ET (US) Jeff - What about Collinite Fiberglass Boat Cleaner #920 - do you know if it has a more aggressive or less aggressive compounding action than Finesse-It II? Collinite Fiberglass Boat Cleaner: http://www.collinite.com/marine-wax/fiberglass-boat-cleaner 3M Finesse-It II: http:/ / solutions. 3m. com/ wps/ portal/ 3M/ en_US/ Marine/ Home/ Produ cts/ Catalog/ ?PC_7_RJH9U5230GE3E02LECIE20S4K7000000_nid=GS4L7VPCLPgs9NQ K7NZ8TZglT3RWDR9GD5bl
Jeff	posted 06-21-2013 04:09 PM ET (US) I honestly do not know Kevin. I have never used it. While it is called a cleaner it sounds like it has compound like properties. So I would assume it is similar to the Finesse It but I am not sure if one cuts more than the other...
floater88	posted 06-21-2013 04:13 PM ET (US) Wow lots of info here. So to simplify it for me since my hull is generaly in good shape I will first wash the boat and rinse it then use the Finesse and after that I can put on wax then polish? or wash, rinse, finesse, polish then wax or just skip the polish and go with the finesse???
David Pendleton	posted 06-21-2013 09:03 PM ET (US) I've used the #920 for several years now. I think it is primarily designed to remove dirt and previously applied waxes. I don't think it has any real compounding properties. It works well enough but like any other Collinite product, you have to work like a dog to apply or remove it.
jimh	posted 06-22-2013 12:44 AM ET (US) Some of the methods and products mentioned seem to me to be very old school and require a lot of elbow grease or electrically-operated gizmos to produce results. I would like to think there is some modern, chemically-based fluid you could wipe on and wipe off that would produce a nice shine without investing $400 in buffers, wool pads, really expensive compounds, polishes, and waxes. This is 2013. Some of these methods sound like something from the May 1957 Car Care Journal.
Jeff	posted 06-22-2013 08:34 AM ET (US) Jim, That fluid is called "Tire Wet". It's a liquid Silicon and makes the hull shine like it's brand new. The shine last for about 12-24 hours before it dries out and you are back to what you started with. Everything in life seems to go back to the Good, Fast, Cheap, pryamid... You can only have two.
floater88	posted 06-23-2013 01:43 PM ET (US) So back to one of my questons about the proper order to do things. Wash, rinse, then polish then wax? Or wax them polish?? Hull is in good shape and has a shine to it anyways. Just want to protect and keep the scum line off. Thanks
Binkster	posted 06-23-2013 03:31 PM ET (US) A good way to tell if you are finished polishing is to hold your hand about 6" from the hull. You should be able to see the reflection of your hand in the gelcoat. I think you guys are spending way to much money on tools and supplys and way too much energy and not getting the right results. Last winter I knew I was going to have to paint (AwlGrip) the interior of my 15 footer. The exterior of the hull was very dull, its a '86 boat without alot of previous care, but surprisingly enough the gelcoat had very few marks or chips in it. I decided to polish it, but I knew that the painted interior would have a very high shine, more so than any gelcoat. So I tried to do the best job possible. I flipped the hull, and first washed of as much of the dirt and grime off as possible. Then online I picked up some Abralon wet sanding pads. One of each. 600-1000-1500-2000-3000 grit. These sanding pads were originally made for fine furniture finishing, but have found their way into other industries. Now, if I had a compresser big enough to run an air powered DA sander it would have been really simple but I don't, so I had to hand sand. An electric DA can't/shouldn't be used for wet sanding for obvious reasons. So I started with the 600 grit and worked my way up to the 3000 grit. You can tell when your done with each grit as there will be no drag on the pad. Took about 7 hours total. Next day I applied two coats of Meguiar's Gold Class carnuba wax with a Harbor Freight 10" orbital polisher (under $20). I don't like those 90degree viarable speed polishers at all, I have one. I did a thread on this process back last winter with some pics. OK, the gel coat doesn't quite shine as well as the Awlgrip but you can still see your reflection. rich
K Albus	posted 06-23-2013 09:30 PM ET (US) Floater, the steps are: 1. Rinse, wash, rinse. 2. If hull is is chalky or lacks shine, compound. If the hull is in bad condition, start with a more aggressive compound (like Meguiar's Oxidation Remover or Meguiar's Color Restorer), then move to a less aggressive compound (like 3M Finesse-It II). If the hull is not to bad to start with, but seems a little dull, you can skip the more aggressive compound and start with 3M Finesse-It II. 3. Once the hull is nice and shiny, you can apply either pure wax (don't use a cleaner wax) or a polymer polish. Some guys, like Jeff, put wax on followed by a polymer polish. Most guys only use one or other. I personally prefer wax over the polymer polish products. I think wax has a deeper shine, but it doesn't last as long as the polymer polish products. After waxing or applying polymer polish, buff to a high shine. 4. Wait one year, then repeat, unless you're in Florida, then wait six months and repeat. One thing that I always found confusing was the use of the word "polish" in the polymer products. I always though "polish" meant a product with some type of grit to it, i.e., the products which are typically referred to as compounding agents. The polymer polish products don't usually have any compounding agents. They are generally intended to be used as a wax replacement.
floater88	posted 06-24-2013 08:54 AM ET (US) Thanks K Albus that is the order I was looking for. My hull is in very good shape except for the transom so i'm gonna follow your recommendations.
PeteB88	posted 06-24-2013 02:22 PM ET (US) But how do I use the machine w/o wrecking my boat?? Tips? Winter Storage and Workshop - Man, I'd jump all over that for sure. too bad you guys are on opposite side of state - place I'm in is awesome for that - And then there's the the explosion last March at North Shore Marina, Grand Haven recently ruled accidental - dude was working on his boat, fired up a torch, KA-Boom. Lucky he wasn't killed. http://www.mlive.com/news/muskegon/index.ssf/2013/05/grand_havens_north_shore_marin.html
EJO	posted 06-24-2013 04:26 PM ET (US) Floater I always had GREAT results with products from http://www.auroramarine.com/fiberglass.php these products have always out performed the well known names like 3m, mcguires, etc.
Jeff	posted 06-24-2013 05:45 PM ET (US) Well here you go Jim, the magic coating you were looking for. While I am not sure if it could increase the shine, It will undoubtedly make sure your hull NEVER falls victim to a scum line.... I give you Rust-Oleum's, NeverWet: http://bit.ly/145xMFJ
Binkster	posted 06-25-2013 02:18 PM ET (US) Wow, Jeff, If I coat the bottom of my boat with that stuff, I'll probably pick up 5 mph, no doubt. rich
DVollrath	posted 06-25-2013 02:43 PM ET (US) Rich, Be very careful not to get it on your prop though, as it will repel all water from the blades & you'll cavitate something fierce :) Dennis
PeteB88	posted 06-25-2013 02:56 PM ET (US) I'm getting some to spray down Ellen's std poodles, now we can go to the beach and come back without cars being soaking wet.
jimh	posted 06-26-2013 07:21 AM ET (US) Jeff--The "never-gets-wet" spray might be useful for the foam surrounding a fuel tank in a classic Boston Whaler. As for making boat hulls easier to move through the water, just use whatever the America's Cup sailors are using on their hulls.