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Montauk 170 Kicker
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ContinuousWave Whaler Moderated Discussion Areas
ContinuousWave: Post-Classic Whalers
Montauk 170 Kicker
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| Author | Topic: Montauk 170 Kicker |
| WT |
posted 02-26-2005 08:46 PM ET (US)  
Here are pictures of a 6 hp Mercury 4 stroke kicker on my 2004 Montauk 170. Panther stainless bracket. http://photobucket.com/albums/v665/warrent/Montauk%20Kicker/ Warren |
| Sheila |
posted 02-26-2005 10:54 PM ET (US)
Very nice, Warren--and that lettering looks terrific too! |
| Jkcam |
posted 02-27-2005 03:05 AM ET (US)
Warren Very nice looking rig. I like the live bait well. What will you use the kicker for? Safety net, or slow trolling? Does the rig fit in a standard garage? Very nice. jim |
| erik selis |
posted 02-27-2005 05:14 AM ET (US)
Very nice set-up Warren. Were they able to through-bolt the kicker-motor bracket? I like the name of your boat as well. It also looks great. Thanks for sharing your pictures. Erik |
| timsr |
posted 02-27-2005 11:58 AM ET (US)
Nice set up Warren, I'm thinking of doing exactly the same thing. Same question about how you plumbed the gas line to the main line if you did and secondly how fast does the 6hp push your Montauk. Do you leave the kicker on the boat all the time and if so how does the additional weight effect planing or performance in general. |
| timsr |
posted 02-27-2005 12:02 PM ET (US)
Warren what is the font style and size that you used for your boat name. Thanks |
| assaf |
posted 02-27-2005 03:48 PM ET (US)
very nice boat . I advice you to change the prop to a high thrust , it will give you much better push to the boat. |
| WT |
posted 02-27-2005 07:22 PM ET (US)
Sheila: Thanks. Jkcam: I'm using the kicker for back-up only. My wife won't let me park the boat in the garage but I'm sure it fits. I have a folding tongue on the trailer.
It's through bolted. The dealer said that I might want a tiller extension. After today I'm not sure if I want one. I'm not planning on trolling with it. Kicker is connected to the main fuel line and has it's own bulb.
Kicker pushed me at 6 mpg at WOT. In a lake it's fine. In the ocean it may be kind of weak. assaf: I'll ask about the high thrust prop. Thanks, Warren |
| montaukman |
posted 02-27-2005 08:00 PM ET (US)
WT, Nice pics. I could use one of them on my 2005 montauk for the the Great South Bay. Maybe after i get all the other itemds on my wishlist. That segways me into my question to you. What VHF do you have and do you have any other elctronics on your montauk. Are you happy with them? I saw a slight pic of your mic for your VHF so it prompted me to ask.. I am researching all the electronice before i take deliver in late march of my montauk. Thanks, Alan |
| WT |
posted 02-27-2005 09:06 PM ET (US)
montaukman: Here is some other "stuff" I had installed. http://photobucket.com/albums/v665/warrent/Montauk170/ I have a Icom 402VHF. |
| montaukman |
posted 02-27-2005 09:17 PM ET (US)
Hi WT, Once again, very nice pics. thank you for sending them. I needed advice on rod holders as well and now i see your set up and I like it. How do you like your Icom? What antenna do yoiu have and where is it mounted. Any problems comments about the VHF functionality? Also, i noticed you don't have a radio. any plans? where would you mount it? thanks for your help, Alan C. |
| WT |
posted 02-27-2005 09:33 PM ET (US)
CE Smith rod holders are from Cabelas. I like them a lot and they are very high quality. The ICOM is OK, no problems. Works great and range seems fine. Buttons and functions are NOT intuitive. I have an 8 foot Shakespear 5225. No radio installed. I have a XM Satelite portable radio and an IPOD. Have fun outfitting your Montauk. |
| MantyMonty |
posted 02-27-2005 10:16 PM ET (US)
WT I have one quick question for you. Does your VHF give deflection to your compass were it is located. I tried my Icom 502 in the same place, and it spun the compass about 15 degrees off. I then mounted it below the throttle/ steering area on the vertical surface. It doesn't bother my compass there, but it does interfere with my Garmin 188C or vice versa. When I have both the Garmin and VHF on, there is interference on 3/4 of the channels. I am going to sell my 502 Icom and try a Standard Horizon flush mount. My handheld S.H doesn't interfere, so I'm hoping this is true with a flush mount from them. I will be easier to change out the VHF vs. the Garmin. |
| WT |
posted 02-27-2005 10:34 PM ET (US)
MantyMonty: No problems with my compass. I have a compass function on my GPS and it is dead on with my compass. I'll probably going to get a Standard Horizon handheld as my backup. All my channels on my ICOM 402 come in crystal clear. Speaker is hard to hear when I'm at 4000 rpm and crashing waves. Warren |
| bigjohn1 |
posted 02-28-2005 12:26 AM ET (US)
Montaukman, I have seen your various posts asking questions about additional items you are thinking of installing on your boat. As you already know, all those additional options can quickly add up to a significant amount of cash on top of what you paid for the boat. I offer for your consideration to not worry about getting a large capacity Pate tank for now. Lots of people do and they sure are fine products but in my opinion, fuel mileage is so good on the 90 4-stroke, 12 gallons is ample fuel for playing on the water for a day. At least wait and assess your fuel consumption first. This will alleviate some initial expenses and free up cash for other options like vhf, stereo, GPS, etc. With a 115efi, I trolled this past Saturday in rough water for nearly 9 hours at 2,600 rpm's and used just under 15 |
| dcritch |
posted 02-28-2005 10:23 PM ET (US)
Warren Thanks for the pictures. I would like to put the same kicker on my 170 and like yours my transducer is on same side as kicker will be. Have you noticed if the kicker interferes with your sounder? Thanks Dave |
| bigjohn1 |
posted 03-01-2005 07:27 AM ET (US)
WT, since your new rig is bannished to the driveway for storage, if space permits, you might try looking for one of those galvanized framed canopies. Basically, its a piped frame you put together with an included high quality reflective tarp that reflects the sun away from your rig. The tarp is not one of those El Cheapo blue jobs you buy for 10 bucks at Autozone. They come in sizes from 10' X 10' all the way up to 40' X 40' - 10X20 or 15X20 would be perfect for your boat. Even if you already have a cover, they help keep the rain, bird poop, and sun rays from trashing your cover and further protect your boat. Since many people living west of California don't have homes with attached carports or garages, these jewels are super popular in Hawaii and the Pacific Islands. My 15X20 cost me $210 but I'm sure they are much cheaper back there. Just a thought. |
| WT |
posted 03-01-2005 01:42 PM ET (US)
bigjohn1: Thanks for the tip. I'm going to put in a 10X20 canopy made out of steel. I'm redoing landscape in my front and backyard which includes cementing an extra space, perhaps for an additional boat;). dcritch; I haven't tried reading my sounder with my kicker running. I won't be back on the water for 2 weekends. I'll report back at that time. Warren |
| Divedog |
posted 03-01-2005 05:28 PM ET (US)
WT- Quick question for you on the kicker motor. I'm interested the same motor but was cautioned that the one cylinder 4-strokes have a really bad vibration. What was your experience? I'd be using the motor for salmon trolling and want something that would be quite and comfortable of several hours of fishing. Also, is your motor a long shaft? |
| MantyMonty |
posted 03-01-2005 06:05 PM ET (US)
Divedog I had the same motor home for a month, then measured for the fourth time, and it was too short for my application. I am using a CMC-PT-35 power tilt, therefore the need for a 25 inch shaft. The tilt raises the mount over the transom/rubrail in order to allow the kicker to be able to fully tilt out of the water while in it's slip. This drove me to return the 6 hp Merc and order a 2006 25 inch T9.9 high thrust Yamaha with electric start and charging system. The charging function will be nice to keep the battery charged while trolling. I plan to leave the kicker fully independent of the main motor,ie. battery and fuel, to function as a true back-up. I have a two bank 120 volt charger for slip time charging. I will be doing the mounting as soon as I can get the boat out of storage this spring. Wisconsin hasn't been too cooperative so far in that respect. Have a good day! |
| WT |
posted 03-01-2005 06:41 PM ET (US)
Divedog: I have never used a kicker motor before, therefore I don't know what is deemed acceptable vibration. It does vibrate a little and I can't see trolling for long periods of time while steering with the tiller. I guess you can lock the kicker and use the main outboard as a rudder but I have not tried this yet. My main purpose for the kicker is for a backup motor. Warren |
| MantyMonty |
posted 03-01-2005 06:52 PM ET (US)
Just another two cents- The steering set-up I have is an E.Z. Steer, outboard to outboard model. This will allow either motor to be tilted independently and steering of the kicker enabled. There are other cheaper routes to go using a threaded rod and knuckles, but the E.Z. unit is easy to set up and undo for removing while tubing etc. with the kicker off the transom. |
| WT |
posted 03-01-2005 07:02 PM ET (US)
MantyMonty: Do you have pictures of your kicker setup? Thanks, |
| timsr |
posted 03-01-2005 07:26 PM ET (US)
Divedog I have heard the same thing about the vibartion on the 6hp 4 stroke engine. Would the 5hp 2 strike be a better solution? |
| MantyMonty |
posted 03-01-2005 08:49 PM ET (US)
No I don't. And it is going to have to bother me approx. 1 1/2 more months until I can get the boat out of storage. I have most of the stuff. The motor will arrive in May sometime I was told. It is a 2006 model on order. I will post pics when I get it done though. |
| bobeson |
posted 03-01-2005 08:55 PM ET (US)
I had a 6HP Merc 4-stroke on my 170 and thought the vibration was terrible. I suspect the biggest contributing factor to the vibration problem is the single-cylinder design. I suspect, but have not personally confirmed, that a two-cylinder kicker would be a lot smoother. Note that my mount was also particularly rickety, which would tend to exacerbate the vibration problem. With Warren's better mount it might be somewhat less of an issue. Warren - does your kicker tilt up fully while the bracket is in the raised position? Also, have you been able to operate on the water at full speed with the kicker raised without the kicker dropping off the tilt bracket? I had to use straps to secure the kicker to keep it from dropping off the tilted-up position. |
| WT |
posted 03-01-2005 09:18 PM ET (US)
bobeson: My dealer, Outboard Motor Shop, initially installed kickers on Montauk 170's on "not so good" aluminum brackets. They said they have replaced those brackets because of complaints of vibration. My bracket is stainless steel and is rated for up to 20 horsepower and 115 pounds. My kicker is 6 horsepower and 55 pounds. The kicker will tilt forward with the bracket raised. I have gone at WOT with the kicker tilted without any problems. I trailer the kicker strapped in an upright position, non-tilted. Warren |
| WT |
posted 03-01-2005 10:16 PM ET (US)
Only guys complain of the vibration. :) |
| Divedog |
posted 03-02-2005 10:19 AM ET (US)
WT & MantyMonty - Thanks for the info. This kicker business sure gets complicated! My goal is to use a fixed mount bracket and manually tilt the motor up. I guess I'll have to do some measuring and see if the idea will work. So how much does the 9.9 Yamaha weight? A larger kicker would be a lot smoother trolling, I'm just a little concerned about the weight. |
| Divedog |
posted 03-02-2005 10:26 AM ET (US)
timsr- A two stroke would be a good light motor but I was hoping to get something on the quieter side. Plus I'd have to have a separate fuel source since the primary engine has oil injection. |
| high sierra |
posted 03-02-2005 01:31 PM ET (US)
I have a folding Evinrude 3 horse 2 stroke that I,m planning to put on my 170 if all goes well. It is a 2 cylinder motor that is as smooth as a 4 stroke. Too bad they quit building them .Anyone who has has one would concur. high sierra |
| high sierra |
posted 03-02-2005 01:32 PM ET (US)
Has had, Has had. |
| dcritch |
posted 03-02-2005 03:31 PM ET (US)
Warren After reading the various replys to this topic I decided to call the local Honda/Yamaha dealer who agreed that their 1 cylinder 4 strokes are also rough running engines. Because I will be using mine for trolling I've thought about using an 8 hp 4 stroke yamaha (83lbs vs 55lbs on merc 4 stroke 6hp). My 90 hp optimax is 11 lbs lighter than your 90 4 stroke so the net additional weight would be 17 lbs. Do you think this would be ok or would it be the straw that breaks the camels back? |
| WT |
posted 03-02-2005 03:44 PM ET (US)
dcritch: I didn't notice any listing to my starboard side with the kicker bolted on. Have your dealer install a "good" bracket and ask if you can switch down to a 6 hp kicker if the 8 hp model doesn't work out. Warren |
| MantyMonty |
posted 03-02-2005 05:43 PM ET (US)
Divedog The T9.9 is 99lbs. and the 8hp is around 104. The T9.9 is a newer model, therefore lighter than the 8, so I was told. The T9.9 will have electric start and shifting on the tiller handle. This will be much easier than hanging out over the transom to shift and tilt. The weight issue will be OK, cause I have a 90 2 stroke. That was in the original purchase plan to keep the weight down so a kicker could be put on the transom. I am going to have a pail of downrigger balls and the portable gas tank on the opposite side for balance purposes. I have had kids sitting in the stern seat while slow crusing local Chain of Lakes, and there was no noticable leaning issue. All will be fine with a kicker mounted on the transom. I can't wait to hear the T9.9 High Thrust purrr while in the hunt for the Great Lakes Salmon. Have a good day. |
| MantyMonty |
posted 03-02-2005 05:54 PM ET (US)
Make that 97lbs. for the T9.9 and 102lbs. for the 8hp. There are varying numbers depending on what website you look at. |
| erik selis |
posted 03-03-2005 03:26 AM ET (US)
Warren, I still have a question concerning the through-bolted bracket. Through-bolting a kicker (or trolling) motor bracket on the transom of a 170 Montauk has been discussed here on the forum many times in the past. Basically it is possible to through-bolt the top bolts but not the bottom ones. Could you please check again if the bottom bolts are through-bolted on your set-up and if so could you also help us solve the mystery on how to do this? Thanks, Erik |
| Divedog |
posted 03-03-2005 10:23 AM ET (US)
MantyMonty- Thanks for the weight info. and good luck on the lake. I pulled out a nice 20 pounder when I was a kid fishing with my uncle. |
| WT |
posted 03-03-2005 01:36 PM ET (US)
Erik: The top 2 bolts are through bolted. The fuel line of the kicker is connected to the water/fuel separator. I believe that the water/fuel separator has 2 lines out. Warren |
| erik selis |
posted 03-03-2005 02:25 PM ET (US)
Ok, thanks Warren. I'll have a closer look inside the port hole under the starboard step. The bottom through-bolted screw must enter there. Erik |
| Joe Kriz |
posted 03-03-2005 02:29 PM ET (US)
I posted a Quick Reference guide to kicker weights awhile back but couldn't find it. In case anyone is interested in the updated weights, check it out here. |
| dcritch |
posted 03-03-2005 07:51 PM ET (US)
Warren Thanks for the advice. You've done a first class job on your 170! Dave |
| WT |
posted 03-03-2005 10:24 PM ET (US)
I didn't do anything except throw money at it until the problem goes away. :) |
| kingfish |
posted 03-04-2005 09:06 AM ET (US)
Warren- That's a really nice set up. Throwing money at a problem until it goes away is sort of a joke, I know (I say sort of because everything to do with boating requires a good money-throwing arm), but the problem still has to be identified and defined. You did good, methinks... |
| timsr |
posted 03-05-2005 02:47 PM ET (US)
Warren I notice you have some type of hydra-foil on your main motor. Did you add this after you installed the kicker to help get on plane? Also because of the weight of the two motors you are exceeding the recommended weight on the transom. Any adverse affects on performance or time to plane? Thanks Tim |
| WT |
posted 03-05-2005 05:12 PM ET (US)
timsr: My Turbolift has magic voodoo powers. I hop on plane faster and the rear end of the boat does not "drift" while running in the ocean. The prop seems to have better bite. I wish someone would scientifically measure the "with" and "without" performances of the Turbolift. I'm too lazy to do it. Warren |
| Holy Cow |
posted 03-06-2005 11:54 AM ET (US)
4 stroke Kicker mounted to transom ~ 5 hp motor on 170 Mighty 'Tauk! http://momentoffame.com/photopost/data/501/1131170_Transom_Kicker_Motor-med.jpeg http://momentoffame.com/photopost/data/501/1131170_Transom_Kicker_Motor_a-med.jpeg |
| Joe Kriz |
posted 03-06-2005 12:58 PM ET (US)
Holy Cow, That is a nice looking solid bracket. |
| timsr |
posted 03-06-2005 02:11 PM ET (US)
Holy Cow How do you have the fuel line connected to the kicker and what kind of cover is that. Thanks |
| Holy Cow |
posted 03-06-2005 02:40 PM ET (US)
The Stainless Bracket name is GARELICK from Minnesota. The fuel line uses a quick connect to a Temp tank! I am thinking of using a direct line connection to the Pate Tank! HC |
| Joe Kriz |
posted 03-06-2005 02:53 PM ET (US)
Holy Cow, I had not seen the solid brackets from Garelick before. http://www.garelick.com/marine/product_catalog_detail.aspx?cat=oma&subcat=smb |
| Holy Cow |
posted 03-06-2005 08:14 PM ET (US)
Please remember I am selling my 2003. See Below! HC 2003 Montauk 170 Whaler for Sale: Viewed 36 times 90 hp Four stroke Mercury motor with 125 hours Dimensions & History Engineering Changes.........Hulls made after 07/12/2002 incorporate
Standard .....DECK/COCKPIT: CONSOLE: SEATING: MECHANICAL: GALVANIZED TRAILER E-Z LOADER: Options: Drum brakes and flush kit for trailer FISHING PACKAGE: ($ 660) COMFORT PACKAGE: ($ 641) CANVAS: Gray console cover ( $201); Gray reversible pilot seat cover($ 192). You still get great 360-degree walk around fish fighting ability and a shallow 9-inch draft. The center console puts everything at your fingertips, including binnacle control, drink holders, electrical switch panel and an electric horn. There’s a spacious storage / anchor locker in the bow. And the reversible pilot seat has an adjustable 4-position seat back so you can use it as a bench or leaning post. Discover a new Whaler classic in the 170 Montauk.
http://momentoffame.com/photopost/d...CP_2347-med.JPG 90 hp Four stroke Mercury motor with 125 hours Dimensions & History Engineering Changes.........Hulls made after 07/12/2002 incorporate
Standard .....DECK/COCKPIT: CONSOLE: SEATING: MECHANICAL: GALVANIZED TRAILER E-Z LOADER: Options: Drum brakes and flush kit for trailer FISHING PACKAGE: ($ 660) COMFORT PACKAGE: ($ 641) CANVAS: Gray console cover ( $201); Gray reversible pilot seat cover($ 192). You still get great 360-degree walk around fish fighting ability and a shallow 9-inch draft. The center console puts everything at your fingertips, including binnacle control, drink holders, electrical switch panel and an electric horn. There’s a spacious storage / anchor locker in the bow. And the reversible pilot seat has an adjustable 4-position seat back so you can use it as a bench or leaning post. Discover a new Whaler classic in the 170 Montauk.
http://momentoffame.com/photopost/d...CP_2347-med.JPG
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| Divedog |
posted 03-07-2005 05:57 PM ET (US)
HC- Did you use your kicker motor for trolling much? I'd really like to put one my boat but I have a dilemma about horse power. I've been told by many sources that the 4 stroke motors in the 4 - 6 hp range vibrate excessively and don't have the trust to comfortably troll with. If I move up to an 8 or 9.9 hp the weight jumps by 30 pounds. I'm not crazy about the idea of hanging 100 pounds off one side of the transom. Any insight? |
| fishinchips |
posted 04-06-2005 11:41 PM ET (US)
the tohatsu/nissan/merc (4 strokes, single cylinder) 4hp, 5hp, 6hp = 55 pounds the tohatsu/nissan (4 stroke, 2 cylinder, featherweight) 8hp, 9.8hp = 81 pounds. |
| Divedog |
posted 04-07-2005 06:19 PM ET (US)
Merc (Tohastu)9.9 is listed as 84 pounds, the prokicker weighs in at 104 pounds. Add some oil, a heavy duty bracket and a prop, the next thing you know you've got 100 pounds + hanging off one side of the boat. Dry Weight (lbs.) (Lightest Version model, excludes engine oil, rigging, hardware and propeller): 84 |
| AQUANUT |
posted 04-07-2005 10:22 PM ET (US)
the 6hp fourstroke mercury is the same as the 6hp nissan...both are diahatsu...souped up weedeaters regards terry |
| fishinchips |
posted 04-08-2005 01:44 AM ET (US)
you can get a different prop for it also for pushing heavier loads. Light loads: 7.8 X 9 Difinition of loads: Gross Weight: I think these props if you order from nissan and tohatsu comes in WHITE. The merc, i don't know. |
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